Q: I don't think my MBP slept after closing the lid - it was hot when I woke up
-
Aug 1, 2014 7:57 AMby brenden dv,Hi Doug Lerner2,
If this issue reoccurs or persists, or if you have any other sleep or wake related issues with your MacBook Pro, you may find the information and troubleshooting steps outlined in the following article helpful (apologies if you have already seen it):
OS X: When your Mac doesn't sleep or wake
http://support.apple.com/kb/TS5357
Regards,
- Brenden
-
Aug 1, 2014 8:23 AMby Doug Lerner2,Thanks for your reply. I looked over that article, but it doesn't quite seem to apply to the available settings on my MBP.
Right now I have the "prevent computer from sleeping automatically when the display is off" checked under power adapter settings. I thought that still allowed the computer to sleep, even when connected to an external display, when the lid was shut. But now I'm confused. The options don't really seem to be explained in detail anywhere.
doug
-
Aug 1, 2014 9:15 AMby Doug Lerner2,I tried an Apple Support chat. But as you can see, I was left more confused than I began.
Hi, Doug! How may I assist you today?
I have a question regarding the conditions under which my MBP should sleep.
In Energy Saver > Power Adapter I have the display set to turn off in 15 minutes. But I also have the "prevent computer from sleeping automatically when the display is off" checked, because I don't want to lose any remote terminal sessions which might be active when the display is off.
I also have an external monitor connected via the HDMI port.
However, when I close the lid, I would like the computer to sleep. And I thought it had been. But I noticed the last couple of days the computer was warm to the touch in the morning when I went to open the lid again.
So I think the computer was, in fact, not sleeping and am confused what the conditions are for letting it sleep when the lid is closed - but not letting it sleep when open and the power connected.
I totally understand how confusing the sleep settings can be. I usually like my computer to sleep when I close the lid of it as well. I would be more than happy to provide you some insight for your sleep settings and how to activate them when you close your display lid.
As we work toward discovering some answers for this, I’d like to ask some questions about how you use your Mac. This will allow me to figure out the best options available, and tailor them to specifically to your needs. Would that be okay with you?
Yes, of course.
Thank you, Doug!
How do you primarily use your Mac? Is it mostly for home, school, or work use?
I use it from my home office, mostly for work and personal use. Typically it is connected to the power most of the time and I don't travel with it. But every Sunday I do volunteer teaching across town and take my MBP with me then for the teaching and connect it to a projector. But all other times it stays on my desk, connected to power.
Thank you for that information! It is so nice to hear that you are a volunteer teacher!
To provide you some insight as to how the sleep functions work for your Mac when it is connected to power and your display is off: Since you have the setting enabled “"prevent computer from sleeping automatically when the display is off” your Mac’s hard drive will not sleep. If you choose to have your Mac’s hard drive sleep when you close your display. You can press the power button quickly and choose the option “Sleep” when the dialogue box appears. This way, you can close the lid of your Mac and have it sleep.
Since this computer uses SSD does that "put hard disks to sleep when possible" setting even mean anything?
Great question! Yes, it does! When your Mac has Power Nap enabled this is when that function kicks in.
Did you know that with Power Nap, this feature allows your Mac to backup with Time Machine, check for emails and other tiny tasks, like syncing with iCloud?
So, when this feature is enabled, the Mac will turn its hard disks on for a period of time. When it has completed its tasks, the Mac will then turn its hard disks off or go to sleep again.
Yes, I knew that. Though Mail app doesn't sync very well with the Gmail server. Anyway, I am getting confused now. Perhaps I should just ask some simple yes or no questions to help sort it out.
Let's get the question of the "put hard disks to sleep" out of the way since you mentioned it.
Okay, cool!
I have "enable power nap while plugged into a power adapter" checked. Would that work differently depending on whether I had the "put hard disks to sleep when possible" since I don't have an internal hard disk anyway?
(The internal drive is SSD.)
I see where you are coming from. The words “hard disks” still refer to your SSD, it is a general term that we use in Mac OS because there are so many types of internal hard drives that our users have. This option still applies to your Mac even though you have an SSD.
But what does it mean for the SSD drive to sleep?
It means that your Mac will not use power, to make disk checks or access the disk. I would like to get you a clearer definition for this. I have an article in mind that can help provide some clarity about this. Do you mind if I take a few moments to locate it?
That is fine.
Thank you!
Thank you for your patience, Doug! I was able to locate the article that I was thinking of.
Well, it says there, "Solid-state drives (SSD) do not use a motorized mechanism to read or write data. For Mac computers that only include a built-in solid-state drive, this setting does not affect the built-in drive. It only applies to externally connected, mechanical drives."
There you have it! Was that able to answer your questions?
I'm afraid I'm just getting more confused by this chat than I was before. Anyway, I must go now, so I will end this chat for now. Thank you.
---
And that was it.
Hmm...
doug
-
Aug 1, 2014 9:35 AMby Doug Lerner2,In the article OS X: Saving energy with Sleep it says:
How do I put my Mac to sleep?
To put your Mac to sleep immediately, do one of the following:
- Choose Sleep from the Apple menu ()
- Press the Command (⌘) Option and Media Eject key (⏏) simultaneously.
- If you’re using a Mac notebook computer, close its built-in display.
- Tap the power button on your computer.
However, I find that tapping the power button on the MBP (which was also recommended by the Apple support person) doesn't cause my MBP to sleep. It doesn't seem to do anything at all.
And of course closing the lid doesn't seem to work, which was what I posted about in my original note.
Very strange.
What I think is happening is that the fact I have "prevent computer from sleeping automatically when the display is off" checked in combination with the fact I'm connected to an external display that is powered on is preventing my MBP from going to sleep. But it has worked in the past... There just doesn't seem to be any documentation on this though.
doug
-
Aug 1, 2014 3:45 PMby Doug Lerner2,And another Apple Care chat session. But I still can't figure out exactly what's going on, and we seem to be going in circles.
Hello, Doug! How are you doing today?
OK. And you?
I’m doing really well, thanks for asking! How can I help you today?
Well, I tried talking about this via chat support earlier, but was getting wrong information, so I thought I would try again and take a different approach to how I ask .
I’m currently reading through the chat transcript to get a strong understanding of what you were going through.
If you read over the chat you can see we digressed into a separate question about whether the "turn hard drive when possible" mattered to the internal SSD and he said it did and pointed me to a support page which said it did NOT and then he said, "there you have it! have all your questions been answered" but none were so I gave up.
Anyway...
Basically it's just this. My MBP is connected to an external display. In the energy settings I have my MBP set to not sleep when the display sleeps so I don't lose some Terminal SSH connections when I'm working.
But when I'm going to sleep I thought I would let it power nap and cool down.
But I've noticed the MBP is warm in the morning. Also I noticed that open SSH sessions were not broken. So I think my MBP is not going to sleep.
Perhaps the computer thinks it’s going into Clamshell mode since it’s connected to an external display via HDMI, correct?
I did read in help that if you hold the power button down 1.5 seconds an option dialog will appear and from there I can select sleep. I did that, but this morning it is still warm and the connections were not broken.
Let me look into this, I want to do everything I can to make sure you’re getting your questions answered this time.
Yes, I believe you are correct. That it is just going into clamshell mode, and even though I manually selected sleep from the power button option it is ignoring that.
It seems to immediately sleep though. Instead of timing out, the external display goes black, reports a loss of signal and then goes into its own power save mode. So it appears to go to sleep.Yet it is warm in the morning, and the open Terminal sessions, which I would normally expect to break, are not broken.
Okay, so there’s still network communication going on, and you’re used to that terminating.
It shouldn’t be possible, but that could be what’s going on here. This is an interesting one, and I can see how you’d expect your Mac to be a little cooler to the touch if it’s supposed to be sleeping.
Okay, so there’s still network communication going on, and you’re used to that terminating.
Let me check our resources on this. It may be a great opportunity to speak to a senior advisor as well.I just came back from a trip and during the trip there was no external monitor and I didn't experience this, even though the energy settings are the same.
The network is my home wifi. On my trip, it was my friend's home wifi.
So the external display is really the big variable here I think.
Probably so.
I could just power off the external display before I close the lid as my next test before I go to sleep next time. But I sort of wanted to know what was happening. Especially since I intentionally manually selected sleep.
I’d like to check with a senior advisor if that’s okay with you.
Yes, please do check.
Also - another thing.
I notice my keypad and hand rest - the whole top surface - has become noticeably COOLER since we began our chat. So I'm wondering if there is stuff in the display/lid itself which might be causing the warm temperature, rather than the body (which is what I would have expected with the display off). Or it is just able to "cool better" with the lid open?
That’s another interesting observation. I think either way, the concern still remains whether or not the computer is actually going to sleep. The display of all things should not be producing excessive warmth.
Do you hear any fan noise when you wake your Mac?
Or right beforehand?
Yes, you are correct about the main concern. I thought maybe there was something in the logs I might be able to check to see if it actually was asleep or not.
I have never heard any fan noice from the MBP.
Okay. I just wanted to make sure. My hands-on experience with a new Retina display is limited, I’m not sure what the fan actually sounds like compared to my traditional MacBook Pro. I’ll go ahead and consult with my senior advisor since our troubleshooting steps would indefinitely cause us to get disconnected.
Thanks for your patience as check on this!
I just found this terminal command to check on the last sleep time:
pmset -g log | grep sleep | tail -n 1
It does report that it went to sleep at 2:42 am which sounds right:
8/2/14, 2:42:25 AM GMT+9 com.apple.sleepservices.sessionTerminatedSleepService: window has terminated.
Unless that means sleep ENDED at that time.
Interesting. I’m glad you found that. It’s a little beyond the level at which I know OS X, But I’ll have some answers soon enough.
OK. Take your time.
Thanks, Doug.
I believe I found more information, though it still doesn't explain why the SSH connection didn't break.
This command:
pmset -g log|grep -e " Sleep " -e " Wake "
will report all the sleep/awake occurrences.
For the last few days it reports:
7/30/14, 11:16:09 AM GMT Wake Wake from Standby [CDNVA] due to EC.LidOpen/Lid Open: Using BATT (Charge:99%)66 secs 7/30/14, 11:17:15 AM GMT Sleep Clamshell Sleep: Using BATT (Charge:99%) 10830 secs 7/30/14, 2:17:45 PM GMT+ Sleep Maintenance Sleep: Using BATT (Charge:97%) 11542 secs 7/30/14, 5:30:07 PM GMT+ Wake Wake from Standby [CDNVA] due to RTC/Alarm: Using BATT (Charge:96%) 41 secs 7/30/14, 5:30:48 PM GMT+ Sleep Clamshell Sleep: Using BATT (Charge:96%) 10823 secs 7/30/14, 8:31:11 PM GMT+ Sleep Maintenance Sleep: Using BATT (Charge:94%) 7/30/14, 9:29:02 PM GMT+ Wake Wake from Standby [CDNVA] due to EC.ACAttach/Lid Open: Using AC (Charge:94%) 8/2/14, 2:06:18 AM GMT+9 Sleep Software Sleep pid=78: Using AC (Charge:100%
So (if you can look at that neatly, one line at a time, it shows it was in fact going into clamshell sleep until I manually put it into sleep.
Then at 2:06 am it went into "software sleep".
Then at 2:42 a it went into something called "maintenance sleep"
at 3:30 am it was awakened by CCC (Carbon Copy Cloner) and did not go to sleep again after that.
So maybe:
1. The sleep is quietly keeping the SSH connections alive and,
2. CCC is not properly putting the MBP back to sleep after doing its 3:30 am backup?
Doug, I’m going to go ahead and transfer you over to a Senior Advisor now. They will discuss this with you further. Does that sound good?
Yes, thank you.
You are now being connected to another Advisor. Please standby.
Okay, so your external display is not sleeping?It is sleeping.
It times out in 15 minutes normally.
After I close the MBP lid.
Just like the energy settings say it should.
And when I did the forced sleep via the power button the external display immediately went black and reported loss of signal and then went into power save mode.
So I assumed it was asleep.
Okay, so, the Mac is not sleeping or the Display?
What I'm trying to find out is if the Mac is sleeping or not. The reason I was prompted to ask was because in the morning after I wake up I notice the MBP feels warm to the touch. I would expect it to feel cold if it was sleeping. Also, a terminal session with an SSH going did not get broken.
Okay, I think I understand now. You are looking for answers about the sleep status of your Mac. I understand your expectation of a cold Mac, and I am here to help.
Thanks. Did you notice my pmset command outputs near the end of my chat with the previous person?
So, In Energy Saver, there is a setting to wake for network Activity.
Yes. It is checked.
However, when not connected to the monitor (like on my previous trip) that was not enough to keep an SSH session going.
Okay, so this would explain to me why the Mac would be warm to the touch. If there is a SSH session active.
Typically those shells would break when the lid was closed.
Okay, with a Display attached, the system expects to operate in Clamshell mode when the lid is closed.
This is all expected
Which prompts two questions:
(1) Even if I force it to sleep with the power button followed by selecting "sleep" from the options and
(2) Even though the pmset output indicated it went to sleep and not into clamshell mode?
I am not familiar with the pmset
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pmset
In computing, pmset is a command line utility to manipulate power management settings under the Darwin and Mac OS X operating systems. It can assign sleep settings, schedule sleep and wake times, and display power information.
pmset indicated it went to sleep at 2:06 am. Anyway, as I reported above with the previous tech person.
Okay, pmset is not supported by AppleCare, yes it is a Terminal command, but it is there for Developer use
So... where are we left? That you think it was in clamshell mode even though I manually forced it into sleep mode and the logs indicate it went to sleep? I'm just still left not quite understanding what is happening.
I guess I'll just try a test next time with the display powered off and see what happens. I need to go now. Thank you. I will end the chat for now.
