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User profile for user: Morpheus Blak
Morpheus Blak Author
User level: Level 1
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BIG font problem involving Linotype FontExplorer X & Extensis Suitcase 10.2

HELP! Well, I made a mistake, and now I am in a pickle. I was using Extensis Suitcase 10.2.2, or should I say, managing with Suitcase (as it is far from perfect), and basically cruising along just fine on my home based G4. I use a G4 at work as well, and recently installed Linotype FontExplorer X (FEX) on it to manage my font library on that machine. I was VERY impressed with FEX, to the point that I figured I would install it on my home G4, and move on from the less than brilliant Suitcase. I did so, and THEN discovered too late that FEX does not support Classic mode : ( . This is bad for me, as I still use PageMaker and have close to 20 years worth of my docs as PageMaker documents.

So, I uninstalled FEX according to Linotype's instructions which are very through. FEX had moved most of my fonts to a Linotype library in a nice tidy fashion, so I put them back into my main Fonts folder located on my hard drive. Next, I opened up Suitcase to go through the process of adding all my fonts again so as to have access to them in OS9 and OSX. Well, of course there has to be a PROBLEM!

I can Add fonts into Suitcase, but when I attempt to activate them, I get the following message;

"There are fonts in the suitcase 'Font Name' that conflict with fonts in the System Fonts folder. You must remove the fonts from the System Fonts folder and restart before you can activate these fonts with Suitcase."

Okay! So I have looked into the aforementioned folder, and find no sign of any fonts with same names or that would appear to be conflicting, there, or in any other Fonts folder in the Library, username Library, or the Classic OS9 System Folder, so I have NO IDEA as to what is going on at all. All I know is that;

1/ No longer have access to any fonts
2/ When FEX created its' own library(which it appears to have done a very nice, clean and through job of), it grabbed fonts from everywhere on my machine, System fonts and all. As mentioned above, when Uninstalling FEX as directed by Linotype's instructions, I replaced all the fonts it had cataloged in the Linotype library back into my main Fonts folder. Now I have a silly big font list in there, because FEX grabbed fonts of names and places that I have never seen or heard of before, including many duplicates and triplicates now.

So, I need to know how to remedy this problem, and how to clean up my Fonts folder in terms of can I throw away all those repeat fonts. I have included links below to screen shots of my Fonts library as it stands now. Thanking in advance those who are able to assist in resolving my problem.

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Dual 1.25Ghz G4, Mac OS X (10.4.3)

Posted on Sep 30, 2006 5:19 PM

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User profile for user: Kurt Lang
Kurt Lang
User level: Level 9
64,550 points

Sep 30, 2006 6:59 PM in response to Morpheus Blak

Hoo boy! What a mess. The quick fix is probably to throw out the preference files for Suitcase. You'll get the conflict message where no conflict exists when they get messed up. Go to the Preferences folder in your user account and toss the folder named Suitcase. Restart the Mac. Note that you will lose all fonts sets you have created, but it should at least clear that problem up.

You mention that FEX "grabbed fonts from everywhere on my machine, System fonts and all." But I don't the any of the system fonts in your separate Fonts folder. That's not to say there aren't any issues.

The "AdobeSanMM" and "AdobeSerMM" fonts are supposed to in the /Library/Application Support/Adobe/PDFL/7.0/Fonts/ folder (for Acrobat 7). Though they may be and FEX just made copies of them. You can ditch the duplicates if there are copies in the correct folder.

I also see that a couple of PostScript Type 1 printer outline fonts for Copperplate have been separated from the rest of the set. Of the three Copperplate folders you have, I believe they belong in the one name "Copperplate Gothic Bold". At least, that's where they are in my set. But my folder for that font is just called "Copperplate Gothic". I don't have a distinction between bold and light.

You also have an outline font for Wood Ornaments loose. But I don't see a folder it belongs to. Other than that, most of it looks organized.

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Hope this helps.

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Looks like the current forum software ignores the center tag. 😉
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User profile for user: Kurt Lang
Kurt Lang
User level: Level 9
64,550 points

Oct 1, 2006 9:39 AM in response to Kurt Lang

Just noticed some other stuff. There's a few fonts that I would guess to be TrueType with a .tt extension loose. Normally, it should be .ttf, but these are probably the same. They don't need to be in their folder to work, but I would imagine you'd want them in their appropriate spot for organizational means.

There's also quite a few other Type 1 PostScript outline printer fonts loose. It took me a little while to determine what some of the other icons were. Case in point are the four Rockwell font files that begin with Rockw. Those all belong in one of the Rockwell folder with their matching screen fonts. But I couldn't tell you which one. Same with any other with that icon. They are printer fonts separated from their bitmap screen fonts.

There is also at least one loose screen font in "Crush No. 47.bmap". But there's no folder for Cruch, and no matching outline fonts with that file. Other files that may be orphaned screen fonts are ones like "Thundergod Italic". It is listed as a Font Suitcase. Just no easy of telling if it's a Type 1 PostScript suitcase, or a TrueType suitcase.
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User profile for user: Morpheus Blak
Morpheus Blak Author
User level: Level 1
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Oct 1, 2006 12:37 PM in response to Morpheus Blak

Hi Kurt,

Okay, first up THANK YOU, we'll get this sorted! Okay, here we go;

1/ If you look ay my Fonts folder in the screen captures, examine Ariel as an example. I have Ariel, Ariel 2 and Ariel 3 folders. Can I trash the obvious duplicates I have existing that are clearly the exact same folder/fonts?

2/ When I mentioned about FEX having "grabbed fonts from everywhere on my machine, System fonts and all", I was refering to fonts with wild and crazy names like #GungSeo Regular, #HeadLineA Regular, #PCMyungjo Regular and #PilGi Regular that were not in my Fonts folder before. I put them there as when I was Uninstalling FEX, and getting rid of the Linotypoe created font library, I thought it safest and best to keep everything for now. With that stated, what gives with all the whacky named fonts in my Fonts folder now? Are they okay to be there, and what exactly are those fonts?

Let's start with that. I am now going to trash the Suitcase Prefs, and restart after I post this reply. Let's hope it works and I will check back here later today to see if you have thoughts on the above.

Morpheus
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User profile for user: Morpheus Blak
Morpheus Blak Author
User level: Level 1
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Oct 1, 2006 1:05 PM in response to Kurt Lang

Okay, trashed the Prefs that you mentioned, restarted, and still getting the same error message. "There are fonts in the suitcase 'Font Name' that conflict with fonts in the System Fonts folder. You must remove the fonts from the System Fonts folder and restart before you can activate these fonts with Suitcase."

Thoughts????
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User profile for user: Kurt Lang
Kurt Lang
User level: Level 9
64,550 points

Oct 1, 2006 2:43 PM in response to Morpheus Blak

I have Ariel, Ariel 2 and Ariel 3 folders. Can I trash the obvious duplicates I have existing that are clearly the exact same folder/fonts?


Most likely. If an application copies a file or folder to a location where one of that exact name already resides, the OS will add a number to the end. It will also increment the numbers as the same file/folder keeps getting copied to the same place. So Arial 2 and 3, Comic Sans 2 and 3, and any other folder that is an identical name with a number are probably copies that can be removed. Just quick check the contents of each to confirm that they contain the same number of font with the same names and same file sizes. If they all match, then I wouldn't hesitate to delete the duplicates.

I was referring to fonts with wild and crazy names like #GungSeo Regular, #HeadLineA Regular, #PCMyungjo Regular and #PilGi Regular that were not in my Fonts folder before.


I have no idea what those are, or where FEX would have found them. Most likely pulled from some buried folder created by a third party application you installed.

Okay, trashed the Prefs that you mentioned, restarted, and still getting the same error message. "There are fonts in the suitcase 'Font Name' that conflict with fonts in the System Fonts folder. You must remove the fonts from the System Fonts folder and restart before you can activate these fonts with Suitcase."


Then the conflict must be real. Please copy/paste a list of the fonts in your /System/Library/Fonts/ folder here.
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User profile for user: Kurt Lang
Kurt Lang
User level: Level 9
64,550 points

Oct 1, 2006 6:25 PM in response to Morpheus Blak

Okay, now I'm getting confused. That's a nice short list of fonts that shouldn't conflict with anything. Well, Helvetica and Courier get duplicated a lot. You do have separate folders in your Fonts folder for a couple of copies of both Helvetica and Courier. Are they part of a set you've been trying to open. Better yet, which fonts are giving you the error?
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User profile for user: Morpheus Blak
Morpheus Blak Author
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Oct 1, 2006 11:00 PM in response to Morpheus Blak

WHOA! Kurt, something weird just happened (right after I posted the last message in the thread that all fonts were giving me the error message), but actually in a good way. I restarted again, fired up Suitcase, added a few more fonts, tried activating them, and PRESTO!, they are working. So, let's consider that solved for the time being... I will let you know if there is a problem, but it is safe to assume that things are returning to normal.

Now, before I add all the fonts back into Suitcase, I want to work on my Fonts folder with you, in terms of cleaning it up, as I am like you and like things neat and tidy. Step one, I trashed all the multi-copies that were definately dupes. The next thing is as follows; It seems that FEX separated many of the bold faces from the regular(or 'light') version of the face and put them into separate folders. Please reference back to original screen captures, and look at Cavil US115, Al Bayan and Chalkboard as examples. Can I join them back into a single folder by removing the actual fonts from the Bold version folders and place the bold versions into the regualr folder for that font, thereby reuniting them and creating a 'family' and then trashing the empty folder)? Not sure if I am using the term 'family' correctly, but I have always understood it to mean the conglomerate of the plain, bold and italic versions of the same font. Please let me know if I have this correct, and if I can reduce the number of folders and put all variations of a font into one folder. Now, I do believe I have a few circumstances in my collection (of which Excelerate, Excelerate Left, Excelerate Outline and Excelerate Straight would be an example) that those were (perhaps) all created by someone as different fonts, and I have a feeling should not be combined into one single Excelerate folder. Right or wrong? If combining them into one solitary 'family' folder, then is one to presume that when choosing that typeface in a font manager that it would activate all variations of that typeface in one, fell swoop?

Regarding the following passage from your first reply; "I also see that a couple of PostScript Type 1 printer outline fonts for Copperplate have been separated from the rest of the set. Of the three Copperplate folders you have, I believe they belong in the one name "Copperplate Gothic Bold". At least, that's where they are in my set. But my folder for that font is just called "Copperplate Gothic". I don't have a distinction between bold and light."
Is it okay for me to put them all together in a single folder and rename the folder, in this case "Copperplate Gothic"? I would love to do that, but do not want to confuse Suitcase.

Okay, I'll leave it at that for now. If I get the above issues sorted, I will probably be finished and back up and running... You are a hero in my world, and I thank you for the help so far, and in helping me with these last few questions above. hey, I retain it and learn, and am grateful for the help!

M.
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User profile for user: Kurt Lang
Kurt Lang
User level: Level 9
64,550 points

Oct 2, 2006 6:13 AM in response to Morpheus Blak

fired up Suitcase, added a few more fonts, tried activating them, and PRESTO!, they are working.


That's better. It's what should have happened the first time. Couldn't tell why it didn't. Weirdness!

It seems that FEX separated many of the bold faces from the regular(or 'light') version of the face and put them into separate folders.


Now that you mention it, yes, it does look like that's what happened. Ugh! It could be pretty difficult to get the printer fonts in with the correct screen fonts. Especially if you have no way of looking into the suitcases. Although you can use Font Doctor for that. Download and start the demo. Press Command+D and load a suitcase file you want to examine. It will show a list of screen fonts in that suitcase. They will match the names of the printer fonts they belong with.

But yes, you need to get all of a font family back together (if you can figure out which ones belong where) so that they are grouped back with their screen fonts. Or those printer fonts that aren't in the same folder as their suitcase of screen fonts won't work. A case in point I see with your last pics is Goudy Old Style. You have the suitcase of screen fonts in its folder, but the two printer fonts are still loose in the Fonts folder. They need to be moved in with the suitcase.

Is it okay for me to put them all together in a single folder and rename the folder, in this case "Copperplate Gothic"?


Actually, no. With the larger image, I can see these don't belong together at all. The font in the Copperplate folder is a .dfont. This is a standalone font that OS X installed and has nothing to do with the two printer fonts for Gothic Bold and Light. Who knows where the screen fonts went for those? But at the moment, it's missing.

In short, FEX made a mess of your fonts. The easiest thing for you to do, if you can, is simply delete the entire Fonts folder and replace it from a backup of your hard drive before FEX moved things around.
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BIG font problem involving Linotype FontExplorer X & Extensis Suitcase 10.2

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