Headphone Mix - in low latency mode - Bus Send to 3+4 is disabled?

Question

Level 1

0 points

Headphone Mix - in low latency mode - Bus Send to 3+4 is disabled?

Logic Pro X. 2x Presonus FireStudio Project.

Not sure why Logic Pro X is disabling the sends to outputs other than Main 1+2...

My studio monitors are output 1+2, headphone amp1 is 3+4, headphone amp2 is 5+6....

I have an Aux Bus collecting all the tracks for the drummer, and levels how he wants them, using pre-fader sends on Summed Tracks for Drums, Vocals, and Guitar. That Aux Bus is routed to 3+4.

As soon as I turn on Low Latency Mode, the sends are disabled, and "oranged-out"

So I can only output to the mains while low latency mode is on?

MacBook Pro (13-inch Mid 2012), OS X Mavericks (10.9.5)

Posted on Jun 30, 2015 7:14 AM

Reply

Answer 1

Eriksimon

Level 6

15,416 points

Jun 30, 2015 7:43 AM in response to nextNME

nextNME wrote:

Not sure why Logic Pro X is disabling the sends to outputs other than Main 1+2...

User uploaded file

Are you really "not sure", or is it that you don't know?

Anniehoo, direct bus routings are often bypassed in LLM, and sendbusroutings are bypassed if there are latency inducing plugins on their destinatiopn auxes. That's how Low Latency Mode works.

http://help.apple.com/logicpro/mac/10.1/#/lgcpe11997ba

It creates a latency-free path so that you can record additional material without having to remove latency-inducing plugins and - routings.
It would have helped (a bit) if you put up screenshots where Low Latency Mode was actually enabled.

On your 3rd screenshot I can see that your outputs 3-4 are disabled, even with LLM turned Off - so it seems LLM is not your culprit here.

Reply

Answer 2

Pancenter

Level 6

14,644 points

Jun 30, 2015 8:25 AM in response to nextNME

Also, the Bus --> Aux system has it's own latency, not 100% sure but I believe it's the one part of Logic that's not fully delay compensated. Basically your send/Aux has exceeded the latency limit and is being bypassed. Or as Erik mentions, you have delay inducing plugins involved.

In Logic 9 (which I use) there is an option to make sends "Low latency Safe", however, you will be dealing with some latency on your outputs. (Does Low Latency Safe mode exist in Logic X?)

https://documentation.apple.com/en/logicpro/usermanual/index.html#chapter=10%26s ection=9%26tasks=true

Also, what is your plug-in delay compensation set at? If it's set to all, try Audio and Software Instrument Channel strips, if it's not set to ALL try that.

Reply

Answer 3

nextNME Author

Level 1

0 points

Jun 30, 2015 8:52 AM in response to Pancenter

Thanks to you both for the reply.

Plug-in delay compensation: All (other options leave too much latency)

So to clarify: I don't know to what extent Low Latency Mode "disables things" in the signal chain. What is disabled at 5ms, or 15ms? What items like Sends, Aux Tracks, etc are disabled? The verbiage is quite general in the manuals... I find that your statement "direct bus routings are often bypassed in LLM, and sendbusroutings are bypassed if there are latency inducing plugins on their destination auxes. That's how Low Latency Mode works." is more helpful...

So I have the Aux Bus for the drummers headphones, which is sent to Out 3+4, it does not have any plug-ins whatsoever... I am using it as a bus collecting the other Sends, Track Stacks, their plugins and levels... then just right out to the headphone amp.

I've been reading up on the Low Latency Mode, and Low Latency Safe mode... I hope this will solve my problem, because I was unaware of the Latency Safe mode for Sends. I'm going to try this tonight at the studio. Hopefully it will restore the sound to the additional outputs (even if some plug-ins are removed per LLM).

*The 3rd photo is not truly correct since yes, at that time I took the screenshot my audio unit was off, so there was not any available 3+4... I should post a photo when I'm connected to my FireProject Studio interface.

Reply

Answer 4

Pancenter

Level 6

14,644 points

Jun 30, 2015 9:30 AM in response to nextNME

Low Latency Mode, is a specific function and not meant to be used all the time, definitely not on normal playback as it will bypass Plug-Ins

The Logic 9 manual is far clearer on most explanations.

Read carefully- (open "To Activate Low Latency Mode" and read that as well)

http://documentation.apple.com/en/logicpro/usermanual/#chapter=41%26section=2%26 hash=apple_ref:doc:uid:TempBookID-Replac…

Reply

Answer 5

nextNME Author

Level 1

0 points

Jun 30, 2015 9:54 AM in response to Pancenter

Correct. I only use LLM when recording. But recording is when I need the Sends active, so each member of the band can have a unique headphones mix. During playback and mixing, LLM is not on.

I'm also not sure if it's my MacBook Pro or the new-to-me (used) FireStudio Project interfaces... but the latency is pretty bad when recording even without heavy plug-in use. My previous PC setup was almost zero latency without disabling plug-ins, nor using LLM. (Windows 7 pro, i7 3.5ghz quad core, 16gig ram, Cubase 5, old school FirePods)

Bypassed plug-ins may be on the selected track, any auxes in the signal path, or even output channels.

That is helpful up to a point...... if I change the limit to 15ms, will I get any Sends or Buses back? is there any order after the "Plug-ins with the highest latencies are bypassed first."?

I don't mind losing reverb, or delay, modulation... I just want the Sends to work.

Should I be trying something instead of LLM? I use software monitoring when recording.

Reply

Answer 6

nextNME Author

Level 1

0 points

Jul 1, 2015 6:45 AM in response to nextNME

Update 7/1/15

Even tho the Sends are "oranged out" when using LLM, they still output sound to the specified headphone amps.

However, only the focused, record enabled track does not output. Even with software monitoring turned on.

Reply

Answer 7

nextNME Author

Level 1

0 points

Jul 1, 2015 4:25 PM in response to nextNME

Oh, and there is no option on the orange send for Low Latency Safe mode....

Reply

Answer 8

Pancenter

Level 6

14,644 points

Jul 1, 2015 5:13 PM in response to nextNME

nextNME wrote:

Oh, and there is no option on the orange send for Low Latency Safe mode....

Don't know what to tell you, obviously Logic X is different than Logic 9. Glad I stuck with an older OS (10.6.8) and L9.

Reply

Answer 9

Jsalant

Level 1

4 points

Jun 28, 2016 5:34 PM in response to nextNME

hey guys,

i found a low latency safe mode in logic x (maybe they put it in after an update) but if you click and hold the send you'll see an option for "low latency safe" and your send wont turn orange anymore.

I have still found that when you set your channel output to a bus, there is still no option for a low latency safe, but if you want you can try this work around:

try creating a send to bus 3 and bus 4 and use those to feed an auxes with bus 3 and bus 4 as inputs. then you can low latency safe those sends. could be worth a shot!

cheers!

-josh

Reply

Answer 10

Pancenter

Level 6

14,644 points

Jun 28, 2016 5:54 PM in response to nextNME

bzzzt

Reply