Theo_99
Level 1 (0 points)

Q: Power Mac 7200/90 will not boot from its HDD

I was a longtime Mac user but had to convert to Windows almost 20 years ago for work-related reasons. As a result, my PowerMac 7200/90 got increasingly less use.  Eventually, it sat idle for a number of years.  I recently tried to boot it to access some files on it that would have been useful for a work project, but it failed to boot from its HDD. I then booted it off of the Apple McIntosh CD that came with the computer.  The HDD mounted immediately and I ran Disk Doctor which diagnosed a problem with the root directory on the HDD but Disk Doctor was unable to repair the problem.  I then ran Disk Warrior off of a bootable CD.  Disk Warrior reported that it was successful in building a new optimized directory and that it had made no changes to any of the files or folders on the HDD in doing so.  All attempts to boot the computer from its HDD after Disk Warrior had worked its magic have ended in failure – each time, the Apple “happy face” appears on the startup screen and there’s the promising sound of some initial disk activity, but then the “happy face” just sits there and the computer fails to boot.

 

The report generated by Disk Warrior indicated that “no system folder was found” by Disk Warrior in the process of rebuilding the HDD’s directory (although the system folder is there, plain as day, after the computer boots and the HDD mounts).  As a result, as recommended in Apple’s operating manual for the PowerMac 7200/90, I decided to do either a clean install (first choice) or a full install of the system software (plan B) to try to get the computer to “find” its system software and to boot from its HDD.  When the computer is booted from either the Apple McIntosh CD that came with it or from the bootable CD that contains Disk Warrior, the HDD mounts with no problem and all the data on it appears to be intact.  (I’ve been able to open a number of Word files and they all appear to be fine.)  When I ran Disk Repair (in preparation for attempting either a clean or full install of the system software), it indicated that the HD “appears to be okay” (which is consistent with Disk Warrior having completed its rebuild of the directory successfully).  Selecting “Repair” as an option under Disk Repair not surprisingly does nothing (because the utility didn’t diagnose anything in need of repair).  Here’s where things get strange:  Disk Warrior had no problem identifying the HDD on one of its initial screens; it indicated that the HDD was “a Mac OS standard disk” (which it is; the computer has never been modified). But when I ran Disk Setup, it identified the HDD as “not supported”; the only option that Disk Setup then provides (under the “Functions” menu) is “Rescan Bus” but the eventual outcome of running “Rescan Bus” is the warning “Cannot modify the disk in an unsupported drive.”   As a result of Disk Setup being unable to identify the HDD as “a Mac OS standard disk” and the fact that the keystroke combination for a clean install on startup has no effect, I’m unable to do a clean install of the system software (since I can't access the screen that would allow me to choose to install a new system folder on the HDD).  When I try to do a full install (i.e., plan B), the installation fails from the get go; the computer either says that an unknown error (-199) occurred, or the Apple “bomb” screen appears and the computer hangs. 

 

Having used Windows PCs pretty much exclusively for almost 20 years now, my knowledge base regarding Mac OS system problems and possible solutions is very thin at this point.  Does anyone have any suggestions on options that I might try to get my Power Mac 7200/90 to boot successfully from its HDD?  It appears to have been using Mac OS 7.5.3 Revision 2.  The bootable CD that was provided with Disk Warrior came with OS 9.1 on it, which boots the computer very smoothly, but my gut sense is that if I tried to install a more recent OS on the computer's HDD, the install would fail (for the same reasons that a clean or full installation of the current OS are failing).  Since the data on the internal HDD is useful though not irreplaceable, if getting the computer to boot from its HDD is a lost cause, I would be willing to consider buying an external HDD that came with a more recent OS already installed on it, assuming that the computer would be able to boot from that external drive.  Any suggestions/recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

Posted on Aug 25, 2015 7:02 PM

by Jeff,Solvedanswer
Jeff Jeff
Level 6 (11,559 points)
A:

That's it, although the settings vary somewhat by the make/model of the specific SCSI hard drive, regarding the placement of the jumper(s) across the pins.  Typically, a SCSI address of "0" uses no jumper.  Setting the address to "1" requires a single jumper of the proper size and pin spacing.  There should be a label on the top of the drive, showing the pin configurations for various addresses.  You don't want to use "3," because the SCSI CD-ROM drive is always set to that by default.  If the drive has no label, a web search will provide you with the settings that are specific to that drive.  If your original hard drive (that you removed) has a jumper installed across a pair of pins designated "TE" (termination enabled), remove it.  As you've described it, the new hard drive is in that top bay, so it's the last device connected to the SCSI ribbon cable and the only device that should have termination enabled via a "TE" jumper.

Posted on Oct 6, 2015 9:28 PM

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Theo_99

Q: Power Mac 7200/90 will not boot from its HDD

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  • by Jan Hedlund,Helpful

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 25, 2015 10:41 PM in response to Theo_99
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 25, 2015 10:41 PM in response to Theo_99

    First of all, if possible, when starting from a CD, it would probably not be a bad idea to copy important files on the hard disk onto 1.44 MB floppy disks (unless you already have backup copies).

     

    Has the 3.6 V logic board battery voltage been checked? A bad battery can cause various problems, including the inability to locate the startup disk (system folder). You may also want to test a PRAM reset.

     

    >I then booted it off of the Apple McIntosh CD that came with the computer.

     

    Would it be correct to assume that this was a System 7.5.2 disc?

     

    >it indicated that the HDD was “a Mac OS standard disk”

     

    Mac OS Standard = HFS (that is, not Mac OS Extended = HFS+).

     

    >But when I ran Disk Setup, it identified the HDD as “not supported”

     

    Apple HD SC Setup (is that utility not on the original CD?) is intended for hard drives with the Apple logo. However, if a third-party formatting utility has been used to modify an Apple hard disk, Apple HD SC Setup may not recognise the drive. Apple HD SC Setup 7.3.5 (http://download.info.apple.com/Apple_Support_Area/Apple_Software_Updates/English -North_American/Macintosh/Utilities/Apple_HD_SC_Setup_7.3.5.sea.bin) would be the preferred application for a SCSI hard drive. You may want to update the hard disk drive driver software (Update); but only do this once backup copies have been made and if Disk First Aid reports that the hard disk is OK.

     

    Some versions of Drive Setup (such as 1.7.3, http://download.info.apple.com/Apple_Support_Area/Apple_Software_Updates/English -North_American/Macintosh/Utilities/Drive_Setup/Drive_Setup_1.7.3.smi.bin) may be able to handle certain third-party drives, while others are listed as unsupported.

  • by Jeff,Helpful

    Jeff Jeff Aug 26, 2015 2:49 AM in response to Theo_99
    Level 6 (11,559 points)
    Aug 26, 2015 2:49 AM in response to Theo_99

    "I would be willing to consider buying an external HDD that came with a more recent OS already installed on it, assuming that the computer would be able to boot from that external drive."

     

    If — and only if — you really need to add an additional hard drive, it could be a bare 3.5" SCSI I/II type that can be installed internally, beneath the existing (500 MB) hard drive.  These drives are very scarce now and the prices charged for them on ebay are about 3 - 4 times what I paid for comparable, used SCSI drives years ago.  There are (2) metal EMI shields that snap in place over the drive bays on the front of the chassis, but the one that covers the empty 3.5" bay and optical drive is the first one that can be removed.  It would be good to have the 3.5" plastic drive sled for the hard drive because it slides in the rails in the bay, securely positioning the drive in place.  The SCSI ribbon cable has a 50-pin connector already provided, for such an upgrade.  Since the exiting hard drive is configured for SCSI address "0," it's usually easiest to configure the added hard drive to address "1," to prevent any conflict.  Years ago, I bought (3) used 7200s in mint condition.  I removed their motherboards (with their soldered CPUs) and replaced them with ones taken from the Power Mac 8500 mini-tower model.   The 8500 motherboards with processor slots enabled the use of faster processor cards - including G3 upgrades, and the A/V module provided RCA and S-Video input and output ports on the rear.  After adding a PCI graphics card and more memory, they were much better/faster than when originally released. Today, when I think about the amount of $$ that I invested in each one and the negligible value that those computers have now, I wish I had bought shares of Apple stock instead.

  • by Theo_99,

    Theo_99 Theo_99 Aug 26, 2015 12:43 PM in response to Jan Hedlund
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 26, 2015 12:43 PM in response to Jan Hedlund

    Hi Jan,

     

     

    Has the 3.6 V logic board battery voltage been checked? A bad battery can cause various problems, including the inability to locate the startup disk (system folder).

    That sort of diagnostic test is well beyond my competence unfortunately. 

    You may also want to test a PRAM reset.

    I tried a PRAM reset yesterday (among other things) before posting.  It had no effect.

    Would it be correct to assume that this was a System 7.5.2 disc?

    Correct.  I tried installing System 7.5.2 from the disc.  Once the HDD has been mounted (after booting from either the Apple CD or the CD that Disk Warrior was provided on), I have limited ability (because of limited memory) to run any applications that are stored on the HDD.  There is a system installer on the HDD that's supposed to install System 7.5.3.  I tried that installer yesterday as well with no success.

    Mac OS Standard = HFS (that is, not Mac OS Extended = HFS+)

    Just to clarify:  are you indicating that "Mac OS standard" is what disk setup utility should be recognizing (as the Disk Warrior software is doing) or that the hard disk for a Power Mac 7200 should be "Mac OS extended"?

    Apple HD SC Setup (is that utility not on the original CD?) is intended for hard drives with the Apple logo.

    In a subfolder called "Utilities" the original CD contains a utility that's named "HD Setup".  Selecting "Get Info" identifies it as "HD Setup / System Software 7.5.2." 

    However, if a third-party formatting utility has been used to modify an Apple hard disk, Apple HD SC Setup may not recognise the drive.

    I think your response above gets at the nub of the matter.  The system software installers that I've tried thus far won't initiate (much less complete) any sort of system software installation as long as the HD setup utility is indicating that the HDD is an unsupported drive.  I've downloaded the 2 setup utilities that you've provided links for.  So far I've had no luck figuring out a way to get those files from my PC over to my Power Mac in a format that the CD-ROM or the floppy drive on the Mac will read. Assuming I can eventually get over that obstacle, I'll post back with an update as to whether using one of those setup utilities solved my problem. 

     

    Some final questions:  Assuming that I eventually get to the point where I'm able to initiate a clean install, which system software would you recommend that I try to install?  The System 7.5.2 that's on the Apple disc, the System 7.5.3 that's (apparently) stored on the HDD itself, or should I try to install a system software version that's more recent than either of those?  I've read that System 7.6 is more stable than System 7.5 and, as I noted in my original post, the Disk Warrior CD booted from System 9.1 very smoothly and the Power Mac seems to work relatively well using System 9.1 running off of the Disk Warrior CD.

     

    Many thanks for your prompt reply and helpful suggestions.

  • by Theo_99,

    Theo_99 Theo_99 Aug 26, 2015 12:56 PM in response to Jeff
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 26, 2015 12:56 PM in response to Jeff

    Hi Jeff,

     

    Thanks for taking the time to post your reply.  I'm going to try to get my existing HDD to boot by following up on some of Jan's suggestions.  If doing so ultimately proves unsuccessful I'll investigate the fallback option that you've suggested.  I hear you though on the issue of cost and parts availability related to that option.  A few years ago, when I was briefly looking into the possibility of buying a bootable drive as a solution when the boot problem with my Power Mac first surfaced, there were a lot of drives available on eBay and for fairly reasonable prices. That doesn't seem to be the case anymore -- which is probably to be expected when you're dealing with a computer that's 15+ years old.

     

    Thanks again.

  • by Jan Hedlund,

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 26, 2015 2:57 PM in response to Theo_99
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 26, 2015 2:57 PM in response to Theo_99

    Hi Theo_99,

     

    >That sort of diagnostic test is well beyond my competence unfortunately.

     

    Would it be possible to look up the Date & Time control panel (in the system folder on the hard disk) when booting from a CD, and set the correct date and time? Then, switch off the computer and disconnect it from the mains for about an hour. If the date and time have been reset following a new startup, the battery is bad.

     

    For an exact 3.6 V battery voltage check, you would need a multimeter (one would replace the battery if the voltage is lower than approx. 3.3 V DC).

     

    >are you indicating that "Mac OS standard" is what disk setup utility should be recognizing (as the Disk Warrior software is doing) or that the hard disk for a Power Mac 7200 should be "Mac OS extended"

     

    Those are file systems determined by the formatting utility once used. Mac OS Standard (plain HFS) must be used here, since System 7.5.2 and 7.5.3 cannot work with Mac OS Extended (HFS+).

     

    >In a subfolder called "Utilities" the original CD contains a utility that's named "HD Setup".

     

    Could you please confirm the exact name of that utility? Not "(Apple) HD SC Setup", nor "Drive Setup"?

     

    >I've downloaded the 2 setup utilities that you've provided links for.  So far I've had no luck figuring out a way to get those files from my PC over to my Power Mac in a format that the CD-ROM or the floppy drive on the Mac will read.

     

    Since your Power Macintosh 7200/90 is not booting from a full system on a hard disk, a PC Exchange control panel is probably not active (unless the system on a bootable CD has that function). That means that PC-formatted floppies cannot be used for transfers. If you have a PC with a floppy drive, you could transfer the files on Mac-formatted 1.44 MB HD diskettes, providing that a special utility (such as an appropriate version of MacDrive or TransMac that still supports floppies) is installed on the Windows machine. Normally, keep the files exactly as they are (with the .bin encoding intact) until on the Mac; once there use StuffIt Expander to decode the files.

     

    >Assuming that I eventually get to the point where I'm able to initiate a clean install, which system software would you recommend that I try to install?

     

    This is always a difficult question. It depends on what programs you want to run, etc. However, System 7.5.3 should be adequate in most cases.

  • by Jan Hedlund,

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 26, 2015 3:40 PM in response to Jan Hedlund
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 26, 2015 3:40 PM in response to Jan Hedlund

    Addendum

     

    When booting from a CD, you may want to open the System Folder on the hard disk. Move the System suitcase out of this System Folder. Close the System Folder. Finally, move the System suitcase back in. Now, try to restart the computer from the hard disk. Any change?

  • by Theo_99,

    Theo_99 Theo_99 Aug 26, 2015 8:45 PM in response to Jan Hedlund
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 26, 2015 8:45 PM in response to Jan Hedlund

    Jan,

     

    Would it be possible to look up the Date & Time control panel (in the system folder on the hard disk) when booting from a CD, and set the correct date and time? Then, switch off the computer and disconnect it from the mains for about an hour. If the date and time have been reset following a new startup, the battery is bad.

    I was able to correct the Date & Time yesterday, after several tries and only after booting from the Disk Warrior CD running System 9.1.  For whatever reason, the computer would hang each time I tried doing so by booting from the Apple CD.  The Date & Time have remained correct some 30 hours or so later, although I haven't disconnected the computer from the wall in that time (assuming that's what you meant by "disconnect it from the mains for about an hour").  I will disconnect the computer from the wall this evening and check on whether the Date & Time are still correct tomorrow.

    Could you please confirm the exact name of that utility? Not "(Apple) HD SC Setup", nor "Drive Setup"?

    On looking at it again this evening, the utility is in fact named "Drive Setup".  Does that suggest that it's the "Apple HD SC Setup" that you referred to in your original post (since it's failing to recognize the hard drive after I ran Disk Warrior to repair the directory)?  In any case, I haven't yet been able to run the Apple HD SC Setup 7.3.5 that you provided a link for on my Power Mac. I'll try to follow your various suggestions on how to do so since a PC Exchange control panel is definitely not included as part of the system on either of the two bootable CDs that I've been using.

    When booting from a CD, you may want to open the System Folder on the hard disk. Move the System suitcase out of this System Folder. Close the System Folder. Finally, move the System suitcase back in. Now, try to restart the computer from the hard disk. Any change?

    No change unfortunately.  As before, when booting from the hard disk, the Apple “happy face” appears on the startup screen but the computer then just freezes and fails to boot.

     

    I suspect that getting the drive setup utility to recognize the hard drive as a MacIntosh HD (rather than an unsupported drive) is the key to being able to proceed with and complete a clean install, which might make the computer bootable from the hard disk again.  I'll keep trying to get to that point.  Your many suggestions are greatly appreciated.  Even if all of the effort eventually ends without a successful outcome, I'll at least take some comfort in the knowledge that I didn't throw in the towel prematurely.

  • by Jan Hedlund,

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 27, 2015 2:27 AM in response to Theo_99
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 27, 2015 2:27 AM in response to Theo_99

    Theo_99,

     

    >I will disconnect the computer from the wall this evening and check on whether the Date & Time are still correct tomorrow.

     

    The idea is to make sure that the computer is completely without power for a while, thus forcing the 3.6 V battery to retain the date and time settings. If not, the battery is bad and should be replaced, However, we do not know whether a new battery has any effect on the bootability issue here.

     

    >On looking at it again this evening, the utility is in fact named "Drive Setup".  Does that suggest that it's the "Apple HD SC Setup" that you referred to in your original post

     

    No, these are two different utilities. Apple HD SC Setup is merely for SCSI drives, while Drive Setup (at least a number of versions thereof) can be used for both IDE/ATA and SCSI. You have downloaded Apple HD SC Setup 7.3.5 and Drive Setup 1.7.3, which both should be suitable here. The Drive Setup version in the Utilities folder on your 7.5.2 CD would be an earlier one.

     

    Do you have a Disk Tools floppy for this computer (or is there a disk image file for one on the 7.5.2 CD)? If yes, you could of course try booting from that floppy as well, and then run the disk utilities.

     

    Otherwise, try booting from the 7.5.2 CD, this time holding down the four keys Command(Apple) + Option + Shift + Delete(Backspace). Is Disk First Aid in the Utilities folder? If so, begin by verifying the hard disk. After that, launch Drive Setup from the CD. Then (providing that the hard drive is available), try to update the hard disk drive driver (Update Driver under the Functions menu).

     

    If the above does not work, it may become necessary to proceed with the downloaded files (as yet another alternative, you could try a web search for the Lido 7.56 formatting utility, which is able to handle most SCSI hard drives). This may or may not work as intended, since you have to depend on booting from a CD and using the possibly not fully reliable hard disk in connection with decoding/decompression operations. Once copied onto and running from a floppy disk, the new utilities could be tested with the hard drive (the computer still booted from a CD).

     

    >I'll try to follow your various suggestions on how to

     

    Please post back if you do not have an appropriate version (such as 4.0.1 or 5.5) of StuffIt Expander for the Mac.

  • by Theo_99,

    Theo_99 Theo_99 Aug 27, 2015 8:06 AM in response to Jan Hedlund
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 27, 2015 8:06 AM in response to Jan Hedlund

    Jan,

     

    The battery failed to retain the correct date and time after the computer was without power overnight, so the battery is obviously bad.  Which should not come as a surprise, since the computer was in storage and often unconnected to any power source for years at a time. I'll try to replace the bad battery, although I suspect it's not at the root of the booting problem.

     

    Over the last few days, among other options, I've tried running the disk utilities from both the Disk Tools floppy and the 7.5.2 CD, always with the same result that I mentioned in my original post, i.e., running Verify in Disk First Aid results in a report that the HD appears to be OK, but, in both cases, Hard Disk Setup reports that the HDD is an unsupported drive.  Presumably because of that result, any attempt to do a clean or full install fails out of the starting gate.

     

    I also tried booting from the 7.5.2 CD holding down the key combinations that you mentioned.  I don't know what result I was supposed to get, but I ended up getting a prompt asking whether I wanted to rebuild the desktop.  I gave that a shot, but, again, to no effect.

     

    The computer definitely has version "4 something" of Stuffit Expander stored on it.  I think I'm now down to seeing whether Apple HD SC Setup 7.3.5 or Drive Setup 1.7.3 will recognize the drive.  If not, I'll probably explore Jeff's suggestion about buying a bootable internal drive, although the results of some recent searches in that vein suggest that they may not be so easy to come by these days.

  • by Jan Hedlund,

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 27, 2015 1:25 PM in response to Theo_99
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 27, 2015 1:25 PM in response to Theo_99

    Theo_99,

     

    >I'll try to replace the bad battery, although I suspect it's not at the root of the booting problem.

     

    Yes, that is quite possible, but we do not know for sure until a replacement has been tested.

     

    >holding down the key combinations that you mentioned.  I don't know what result I was supposed to get, but I ended up getting a prompt asking whether I wanted to rebuild the desktop.

     

    The intention was to make an attempt to prevent possibly bad SCSI hard disk drivers from affecting the computer during startup. The key combination is normally used to bypass the internal hard drive when one wishes to boot from another SCSI drive.

     

    >I've tried running the disk utilities from both the Disk Tools floppy

     

    A Disk Tools floppy can often be used to hold other utilities (and/or control panels and extensions). At this point, when it is still possible to gain access to files on the hard disk, it is probably a good idea to make a couple of copies of the Disk Tools floppy (preferably using Disk Copy 4.2, http://download.info.apple.com/Apple_Support_Area/Apple_Software_Updates/English -North_American/Macintosh/Utilities/Disk_Copy/Disk_Copy_4.2.sea.bin). You could then remove the existing utility programs from one diskette (do not forget to empty the Trash). This should directly make room for perhaps 100-200K new files.

     

    Using special techniques, it may even be possible to get more space.

     

    Also, a system folder from a Disk Tools floppy, drag-copied to an empty hard disk, can sometimes be used as a small temporary system.

     

    Furthermore, it is not a bad idea to make backup copies (drag onto 1.44 MB Mac-formatted floppies) of a couple of useful control panels and extensions from the System 7.5.2 (or 7.5.3) system folder while you can gain access to them: PC Exchange, Apple CD-ROM, Foreign File Access, High Sierra File Access, and ISO 9660 File Access. These may come in handy at a later stage.

     

    >Hard Disk Setup reports that the HDD is an unsupported drive.  Presumably because of that result, any attempt to do a clean or full install fails out of the starting gate.

     

    It is possible that, somehow, a third-party driver earlier has been installed, thus blocking access to the hard drive for the version of Drive Setup that you have been using.

     

    >I think I'm now down to seeing whether Apple HD SC Setup 7.3.5 or Drive Setup 1.7.3 will recognize the drive.

     

    Yes, that would be the next step. You should probably also get Lido 7.56, which should be able to handle even more difficult situations. It may also become necessary to simply reformat the whole hard drive, so make sure that you have the backup copies that you need.

  • by Jan Hedlund,

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 27, 2015 4:47 PM in response to Jan Hedlund
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 27, 2015 4:47 PM in response to Jan Hedlund

    Theo_99,

     

    In addition to the previously mentioned files, it may be wise to copy the Memory control panel and StuffIt Expander to a Mac-formatted (if necessary, a reformatted PC diskette) 1.44 MB backup floppy.

     

    Then, if of interest, a small experiment in order to possibly allow transfers from a Windows computer on a CD. Is the Disk Tools disk a System 7.5.2 floppy for the 7200/90? Does it have a System Folder complete with subfolders like Control Panels, Extensions, etc? If yes, you may want to try to modify a copy of this Disk Tools floppy: Move Disk First Aid and Drive Setup to the Trash (and empty the Trash). Next, drag-copy Apple CD-ROM (if not already there), Foreign File Access, High Sierra File Access, and ISO 9660 File Access (from the Extensions folder in the System Folder on the hard disk) to the Extensions folder inside the floppy's System Folder. Now, check whether you can boot the 7200/90 from this floppy. Finally, burn a normal (ISO 9660) CD-R (not CD-RW) on the Windows computer (at a low speed). The CD could, for example, contain downloaded Mac (.bin) files. Will the 7200/90 read this CD with the files?

  • by Theo_99,

    Theo_99 Theo_99 Aug 27, 2015 8:18 PM in response to Jan Hedlund
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Aug 27, 2015 8:18 PM in response to Jan Hedlund

    Jan,

     

    I was eventually able to run both HD SC Setup 7.3.5 and Drive Setup 1.7.3 off of a 1.44 MB floppy.  (Fyi, both utilities require patches that I downloaded from this website:  http://lowendmac.com/2007/format-any-hard-drive-for-older-macs-with-patched-appl e-tools/.)  Running HD SC Setup 7.3.5 after Disk First Aid once again found the drive to be OK had no noticeable effect.  As before, I couldn't get to a clean install screen and trying a full install led to the computer hanging.  Running Drive Setup 1.7.3 led to one noticeably different result than running the version of Drive Setup that came with the computer:  rather than simply indicating that the hard drive was an unsupported drive, Drive Setup 1.7.3 found the drive and it showed the full name of the drive.  It then gave the following description:  Unrecognized driver or this disk is protected by security software.  This disk can still be initialized.  I obviously didn't choose to initialize the hard drive, but the rest of the message above is consistent with your comment:

    It is possible that, somehow, a third-party driver earlier has been installed, thus blocking access to the hard drive for the version of Drive Setup that you have been using.

    The other reason I think your comment is significant is that when I further explored the hard drive earlier today, I found the FWB Hard Disk Toolkit saved in one of the folders.  I purchased the 7200/90 from a computer consultant in 1996/97 rather than from an Apple store, and it appears that he likely formatted the hard drive using the FWB Hard Disk Toolkit.  One of the utilities that's part of the FWB Hard Disk Toolkit disclosed that the drive is a Seagate ST31200N 1006 MB drive.  I then googled that particular hard drive and couldn't find any drivers for that (now 18-year old) drive on Seagate's support page, or anywhere else.

     

    I will try the rest of your suggestions over the weekend although I'm now leaning towards the conclusion that the driver for the hard disk having somehow become corrupted is the likely cause of the current bootability problems. If I could somehow get the hard disk to boot even with a very streamlined system that would just allow me to open the files on the 7200/90 I would view that as a successful outcome since all I'm really after is trying to ensure that I have occasional access to those files when the (infrequent) need arises.  (Backing up all of those files isn't very practical at the moment; there are almost 700 MBs worth of files in all stored on the hard drive, so transferring them onto 1.44 MB floppies obviously isn't very feasible.  Some years ago I foolishly threw out the Zip drive and the 100 MB Zip floppies that I used to back up the 7200/90 back when it served as my main computer.  The computer had booted without incident up until then and, after I switched over to using Windows PCs virtually exclusively in the late 90s, I hadn't anticipated that I would run into this current situation.

     

    Thank you again for taking so much time and for providing so many detailed and creative suggestions.  I wish I could say that I'll be able to "pay it forward" but my knowledge of Macs is now painfully thin and out of date.   

  • by Jan Hedlund,

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 28, 2015 12:03 AM in response to Theo_99
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 28, 2015 12:03 AM in response to Theo_99

    Hello again,

     

    >I then googled that particular hard drive and couldn't find any drivers for that (now 18-year old) drive on Seagate's support page, or anywhere else.

     

    Unless you are thinking about special firmware for the hard drive, the hard disk driver software is installed as a part of the formatting/initialisation process (for example, by Apple HD SC Setup 7.3.5, Drive Setup 1.7.3, or a third-party utility such as Lido 7.56).

     

    It may not be a bad idea to verify jumper settings (http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/manuals/scsi/67452d.pdf?) in order to rule out something obvious.

     

    >Unrecognized driver or this disk is protected by security software.  This disk can still be initialized.  I obviously didn't choose to initialize the hard drive,

     

    Normally, in a case like this, with a problem that cannot be resolved in another way, one would just format/initialise the drive. That would, typically, ensure a hard disk with a fresh file system and a new driver (and, of course, completely erased/empty).

     

    >If I could somehow get the hard disk to boot even with a very streamlined system that would just allow me to open the files on the 7200/90 I would view that as a successful outcome since all I'm really after is trying to ensure that I have occasional access to those files when the (infrequent) need arises.

     

    Because of all the errors until now, that seems to be risky. If you do not want to change/reformat/erase the internal hard disk, and just have occasional access to files, it would probably be a lot safer to boot from another disk/disc. That could be a CD, another SCSI hard drive (internal or external), or possibly even a special/modified floppy capable of expanding the space with a RAM disk.

     

    However, if you are willing to take the risk, it may be possible to manually deactivate the existing operating system on the 7200/90 hard drive, and then copy a small temporary system from a floppy to the hard disk (but we do not know whether that temporary system will be bootable either).

     

    >Backing up all of those files isn't very practical at the moment; there are almost 700 MBs worth of files in all stored on the hard drive, so transferring them onto 1.44 MB floppies obviously isn't very feasible.

     

    Backing up to a second SCSI hard drive of adequate size would be the easiest way. Otherwise, with a suitable separate startup disk (with basic TCP/IP and FTP software), a transfer of the files to another computer over a local network may be a possibility.

  • by Jan Hedlund,

    Jan Hedlund Jan Hedlund Aug 28, 2015 1:35 AM in response to Theo_99
    Level 6 (9,901 points)
    Aug 28, 2015 1:35 AM in response to Theo_99

    >Drive Setup 1.7.3 found the drive and it showed the full name of the drive.  It then gave the following description:  Unrecognized driver or this disk is protected by security software.  This disk can still be initialized.

     

    Can I assume that the Update Driver option was not available under the Functions menu?

     

    >it appears that he likely formatted the hard drive using the FWB Hard Disk Toolkit.

     

    A driver update possibility may be limited to the software originally used for the initialisation. If you know which utility was used, and if you have access to the third-party program in question, have you checked whether it provides an available option to merely update the driver?

     

    Warning: As I have indicated earlier, there is always a risk involved when attempting to carry out a driver update. One should have backup copies of important files, since a failed update could lead to an inability to gain access to all files on the hard disk (bootable drive or not).

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