andynick
Level 5 (4,938 points)
Video

Q: Performance of a NEW Mac Pro compared to my mid-2012 model

Posted this on the Mac Pro page, but went around in circles and got no answer, so I'll try here where the experts are!

 

I'm looking to upgrade to a faster machine - mainly for editing 4k video and the like.

When trying to compare my existing model with what's available on the Mac Store, I was confused by the specs.

 

My existing model is mid 2012 with:

  • 2 x 2.4 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon processors
  • 20 GB 1333 MHz DDR3 ECC
  • ATI Radeon HD 5870 1024 MB

On the Apple website the specs are worded like this:

  • 3.5GHz
  • 6-Core
  • Intel Xeon E5 with 12MB L3 cache and Turbo Boost up to 3.9GHz

Configurable to 3.0GHz 8-core processor with 25MB L3 cache or 2.7GHz 12-core processor with 30MB L3 cache

 

In layman's terms, what does all that mean - particularly when compared to my existing machine editing video?

 

Any help with this will be gratefully accepted.

Andy

Final Cut Pro X, OS X Yosemite (10.10.5)

Posted on Oct 20, 2015 2:14 PM

by Russ H,Solvedanswer
Russ H Russ H
Level 7 (21,825 points)
Quicktime
A:

Andy, You may already have come across this speed comparison article. It's not exactly what you're trying to compare, but it may shed some light on the subject. I couldn't help but notice that the iMac acquitted itself pretty well.

 

Russ

Posted on Oct 21, 2015 5:44 AM

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andynick

Q: Performance of a NEW Mac Pro compared to my mid-2012 model

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  • by David Bogie Chq-1,

    David Bogie Chq-1 David Bogie Chq-1 Oct 20, 2015 2:35 PM in response to andynick
    Level 7 (25,792 points)
    Video
    Oct 20, 2015 2:35 PM in response to andynick

    The machine is only part of the picture.Depends on your camera's codec, how you store and back up your files, and your real world output needs. That is, lots of people shoot 4k for no reason at all, just because they can.

     

    Look up some posts by Karsten, he edits multistream 4k on a system I would consider way underpowered if he wasn't here to vouch for it. Karsten uses separate Thunderbolt (or USB3, dunno for sure) drives, one for each stream of 4k.


    Look at the minimum specifications for FCPX on the marketing pages and then scale up to what you can afford. Add more RAM. Spec the higher graphics card since there's a lot going on there. Don't forget to look carefully at the used market and for refurbed machines form Apple. And factor in a lot of drives.

     

    My 2013 cylinder with was purchased specifically for FCPX and Motion:

    3.5GHz 6-core Xeon E5

    32G RAM

    SSD 1T

    AMD FirePro D500 3072 MB VRAM

     

    I asked for an iMac back in 2013 because I had deliberately and extensively demo'd FCPX and Motion on the iMacs and decided I could save my company a ton of money. They got me this instead. Is this a super fast video monster? No, it's just a Macintosh and I don't do 4k yet.

  • by andynick,

    andynick andynick Oct 21, 2015 5:29 AM in response to David Bogie Chq-1
    Level 5 (4,938 points)
    Video
    Oct 21, 2015 5:29 AM in response to David Bogie Chq-1

    Thanks David - that's certainly food for thought, but it doesn't actually address the question which was whether the new MP would be faster (given the same circumstances and accessories) than my old 2012 "tractor".

     

    It would seem though that the reason my system is struggling (with mostly 1080p 50fps) is down to my external 8 TB LaCie Drives. I've used 4TB G-Tech G-Raid units but they proved less reliable and even though all my media and projects are backed up to at least one other drive, reliability is extremely important to me.

     

    Thunderbolt would seem to be the way to go, but of course, my vintage Mac Pro doesn't have that option, so I think I need to upgrade.

     

    The videos we produce are usually only presented in Standard Definition, in fact I drop the clips onto a custom timeline that is 1024 x 576 pixels, which gives great definition on DVD.

     

    We shoot most of our material in 1080p 50fps so that I can "zoom in" in post. The videos are about training sheepdogs to work sheep - and the action can be extremely difficult to follow closely, so we shoot a little wide and then get closer in post. Shooting in 4K is even better for "zooming" but with only 25 or (around) 30 fps available with 4K at the moment, I lose the lovely smooth Slow Motion that's available with 50 or 60fps.

     

    I realise that my custom timeline and "zooming" in post requires a great deal of processing power (of one kind or another) and I'd love to keep the setup I have - if only I could have faster external HDs. To be honest, it's becoming difficult to find good FW 800 drives in the UK, so I guess there best alternative is to update the whole shooting-match.

     

    Would some sort of RAID setup help much, do you think? Can you set up any two FW 800 HDs as a RAID thing, or do they have to be of a certain spec?

    Andy

  • by Russ H,Solvedanswer

    Russ H Russ H Oct 21, 2015 5:44 AM in response to andynick
    Level 7 (21,825 points)
    Quicktime
    Oct 21, 2015 5:44 AM in response to andynick

    Andy, You may already have come across this speed comparison article. It's not exactly what you're trying to compare, but it may shed some light on the subject. I couldn't help but notice that the iMac acquitted itself pretty well.

     

    Russ

  • by Russ H,Helpful

    Russ H Russ H Oct 21, 2015 6:32 AM in response to andynick
    Level 7 (21,825 points)
    Quicktime
    Oct 21, 2015 6:32 AM in response to andynick

    Also this – including the  links. (I particularly liked the short summary of which machine was better for different types of operations.)

     

    Russ

  • by David Bogie Chq-1,Helpful

    David Bogie Chq-1 David Bogie Chq-1 Oct 21, 2015 6:31 AM in response to andynick
    Level 7 (25,792 points)
    Video
    Oct 21, 2015 6:31 AM in response to andynick

    andynick wrote:

    Thanks David - that's certainly food for thought, but it doesn't actually address the question which was whether the new MP would be faster (given the same circumstances and accessories) than my old 2012 "tractor".

    Andy

    I cannot compare my machine's performace to yours without a carefully parsed test that runs on both. I can tell you that graphics card specs get a lot of attention around here. But the new Macs cannot be be upgraded liek that any longer so you buy the best one you can. I can also tell you that our cylinders are reasonable performers with 1080P material. We don't know what's going to happen when we start brining in 4k and we don't have any interest in comparing our 2013 machines to the latest crop of cylinders.

     

    You can research the performance specs of every Macintosh model on sites like BareFeets but those number rarely transfer directly to video because of the unpredictable variables—that can be run or are running in the background in no standard order of operations—inherent in the application: numerous video formats and codecs, coming in from various type of drives appearing on different buses, audio processing and real time mixing, complex and simple video effects that might call upon another applicaiton like Motion, compound clips, alpha processing, transcoding and other background tasks, So you find a target budget and get the best machine you can afford and you hope for the best. Or you jsut buy the biggest and fastest unit and hope you can make money to rationalize the expense.

     

    RAIDs introduce a new level of complexity to the decision since they do not rely on the processor or graphics card at all, just the bus speeds and the architecture of your machine's buses. I cannot imagine that your external drive is conributing to your perception of sluggishness unless it's nearly full of widely scattered media. That's easily tested, though. You finish a complex project using only your internal, do the sme project with a Firewire drive, do the same with a RAID setup. And you can run many different drive throughput tests on your present system and compare them against tests on Thunderbolt drives and RAIDs published on various sites.

     

    HOpefully ly the High Wonks will chime in with some hard information for you.

  • by David Bogie Chq-1,

    David Bogie Chq-1 David Bogie Chq-1 Oct 21, 2015 6:08 AM in response to Russ H
    Level 7 (25,792 points)
    Video
    Oct 21, 2015 6:08 AM in response to Russ H

    GGood stuff, thanks for the link, Russ.

    we still have Karsten's rig to contemplate. He seems to do quite well with a Mac mini merely by adding separate drives to the little box.

    CHasing specs is is interesting and compelling but the decision on which Mac to buy for a particular task is more complex.

  • by andynick,

    andynick andynick Oct 21, 2015 6:37 AM in response to Russ H
    Level 5 (4,938 points)
    Video
    Oct 21, 2015 6:37 AM in response to Russ H

    Great links - many thanks Russ H.

    I've decided to go for the new MP as it will bring all my kit up to date (until tomorrow morning, at least).

     

    The time I can spend editing video is restricted, so I think a big boost in speed will be of benefit all round.

     

    Many thanks also to David for his helpful observations and advice.

    How Karsten manages with that setup, I'll never know but full marks to him for persistence!

    Andy