Questions before I return Apple TV (4th gen) for refund

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Level 1

60 points

Questions before I return Apple TV (4th gen) for refund

I am so very underwhelmed by the new Apple TV. It seems clear that Apple doesn't really listen to customers.

But before I return this slick looking device for a refund, I want to ensure that I've eliminated any misunderstandings about this device. Here is my very reasonable issues with this device (hoping that I am wrong about these issues):

[The first two issues are make/break - If I cannot solve them, the Apple TV will be returned - thanks for your help]

The biggest blow (I see it as a slap in the face) is that there is absolutely no native support for any industry standard way of accessing my NAS library! Despite being assured, by an Apple Store employee, that I won't have a problem reading my Synology NAS and playing my music, videos, or photos...
That the Apple chooses to ignore the DLNA *standard* is only perplexing until you realize that the Apple TV's primary objective is to sell iTunes media content; there is no incentive to allow non-iTunes content. I have even installed an iTunes server on my Synology but I still can't see my content.
I did manage to find a Apple TV app that "sees" my Synology (called NAStify Player) but the quality is quite sub-par compared to what my inexpensive WD TV Live delivered. Another 3rd party Apple TV app is available called Plex but I hesitate to purchase this b/c it only supports video and I'm uncertain if the quality is any better.
Yes, there is always Airplay but why should I have to run another device that the Apple TV should be able to do on its own? For the same reason, I am not going to be forced to turn on my Apple computer, just so that it can stream to the Apple TV... that is the job of the much lower energy footprint Synology! That is why I purchased it! I did not want to power-on my computer all the time.
No KEYBOARD! WHAT was Apple thinking (or not!)? This is the epitome of ridiculousness! Again, sure there is Airplay but it is as though Apple wanted to ensure that Apple TV owners must own all Apple devices! I cannot think of any other reason to disallow a bluetooth keyboard! There was an app for the Apple TV 3 but that app no longer works for Apple TV 4. Good luck to everyone if your Apple TV remote fails!
It might not be so bad if Siri worked as well as it does on the iPhone. More on Siri later.
The games have a lot of potential but unfortunately, Apple failed here as well by disallowing pairing of multiple remotes and I believe only one specific Apple endorsed game player is allowed!
No ability to add local storage via a USB port. That means that there is no point in traveling with the Apple TV (like I did with the WD TV Live and a 32 GB memory key loaded with training videos for my clients). I can't do that with the Apple TV because of Apple's apparent tunnel vision and their inability to see use cases beyond their iTunes store! It's frustrating b/c the device is technically capable but is locked down! There isn't even a USB port to charge the remote control! Seriously? Yes, I understand it doesn't need frequent charging.
Very little offerings in the Apple TV store! And many of the apps are quite expensive and very few offer a free trial version. Until now, I had found that Apple Store apps are better priced than Android apps. On my first day, I wasted about $15 on sub-par apps! Is there any opportunity to get my money back on buggy/poorly implemented apps?
Even Siri is crippled and rather sub-par! Where is Siri's voice? Why is Siri mute and so limited compared to the iOS version? It was a huge fail when I realized that I couldn't even use Siri to substitute for the missing keyboard.
This is an Internet device! Why can't I browse the Internet? I've owned other similar boxes for years and most of them offered Internet browsers (with add-in keyboard)! Yes, I can use Airplay but Apple could have been brilliant with a golden opportunity to offer Internet searching via Siri. Now, that would have been impressive!
I was hoping that the new remote worked in a similar manner as the WII controller and equally engaging games... thus far, I have seen no evidence of such immersive games / game control.
Youtube! This is probably not Apple's fault but the Youtube app is infuriating! It plays the same two ads (Subaru and some insurance broker) after about every 4 videos. Playlists get stuck and repeat the same videos (rather than advancing) and if you attempt to skip ahead, the app gets permanently stuck at the end of the video you are attempting to skip.

I just expected much more from Apple and I don't think I am asking for anything unreasonable.

Looking for helpful solutions to the issues that are solvable, at least that will ease the 'pain' of the unsolvable issues.

Thanks

Apple TV

Posted on Nov 24, 2015 3:38 PM

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Answer 1

Protodd

Level 4

2,092 points

Nov 24, 2015 4:20 PM in response to sdc01

If I was as frustrated as you I think that returning it is the best option. Nothing designed for entertainment should cause you this much aggravation. All of the apps (or lack of) are dependant on developers putting the time/resources into an app. While tvOS is based upon iOS framework it's ground up development. Therefore, I expect apps and games to improve overtime.

I have an iTunes library of 10,000 files tvshows, movies and music videos. I am able to seamlessly stream all via my ATV on homeshare Just like I did with my ATV 1/2/3

As far as the remote app/Bluetooth keyboards, I agree it's a step back but personally believe that will come back with firmware updates and or an update to the app. But that's my personal belief nothing confirmed (either way) from Apple.

Its designed as as a streaming media player and a hub for HomeKit. So external storage has never been in the design. I have had 4 generations of the ATV and never once wanted to take it with me. If I travel, I put media on my laptop/iPad and then stream via direct HDMI.

As far as Siri goes, I am so greatful she doesn't talk! But she is very limited which Apple has already acknowledged and will be adding more functionality over time (we already have confirmation music is being added after the new year) .

as for Internet, I have a computer/tablet/phone to surf the web. again, I am greatful this has not been added - having to watch my kids surf the Internet on the big screen? No thanks.

YouTube ads ads are YouTube issues in fact any issues with any apps go back to the app developer rather than Apple (just like iOS, android, Windows etc)

again, as the device is designed for entertainment if your not being entertained then why keep it? Me? I feel it's a big step forward (not as big as Apple/Tim cook would say) but yes, there are some issues and i expect Apple to address them. But the device will never be all things to all people which is why as a consumer you have the ability to choose what best meets our personal needs.

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Answer 2

sdc01 Author

Level 1

60 points

Nov 24, 2015 4:59 PM in response to sdc01

Hello and thanks for your reply.

Ideally, I don't want to return it because I believe the hardware has a lot of potential.

It simply makes no sense to ignore DLNA... it's just software! Apple is ignoring the millions who own personal NAS or SAN devices! I just don't get it... and my primary reason for posting this message was because I was hoping to be proven wrong. I find it highly unlikely that I am the only Apple TV owner that wants to see the media on their personal NAS.

Best regards.

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Answer 3

Protodd

Level 4

2,092 points

Nov 24, 2015 6:21 PM in response to sdc01

You should take a look at Plex. I actually use it more than homeshare just because of its flexibility. I know that it does support the NAS users and their app on the ATV4 offers much more. but there are others who dislike Plex as well. 😕 I just run the free version so maybe it's worth looking into as a way to achieve a middle ground? Good luck with however you choose to move forward...

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Answer 4

morrispe

Level 4

1,224 points

Nov 24, 2015 5:35 PM in response to sdc01

You obviously aren't the target market for this product. The Apple TV 4 is meant to be a plug and play streaming device for the masses.

... and a few of my thoughts.

The App store has only been online for a couple of weeks. Give it time to ramp up and for developers to bring their apps to market. Likewise game developers will need time to make the most of the remotes capability. Even so I wouldn't expect anything close to console gaming.

When you push the Siri button the TV audio ducks to hear your question. The response is in text which is appropriate to allow your program audio to continue.

The Apple TV 2 and 3 were both streaming only devices. Why should anyone be surprised by the lack of local storage. Its meant to be streaming only. The Plex app has already been released to connect to media storage Plex servers.

In my opinion nobody wants to browse the web on their TV, they just think they do. There have been countless iterations of Web TV that have all failed in the market. Now that we have smartphones and tablets in our lap while watching TV there is even less reason to put it on the big screen.

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Answer 5

sdc01 Author

Level 1

60 points

Nov 24, 2015 6:33 PM in response to morrispe

morrispe wrote:

You obviously aren't the target market for this product. The Apple TV 4 is meant to be a plug and play streaming device for the masses.

With all due respect, you just contradicted yourself with that second sentence. FYI, the Apple TV is the only smart TV device that doesn't support DLNA or anything else besides iTunes. I don't think my complaint is unreasonable, except perhaps inside the Apple bubble. 😝

The App store has only been online for a couple of weeks. Give it time to ramp up and for developers to bring their apps to market. Likewise game developers will need time to make the most of the remotes capability. Even so I wouldn't expect anything close to console gaming.

Well, that I understand but that wasn't my complaint. My concern was the prices of apps... actually more so, my complaint is that many of those expensive apps do not have a free trial version. Like I stated, I purchased a few apps that I then find to be utterly terrible. I know this is sometimes an issue in the iPhone world but at least there are more choices available.

In my opinion nobody wants to browse the web on their TV, they just think they do. There have been countless iterations of Web TV that have all failed in the market. Now that we have smartphones and tablets in our lap while watching TV there is even less reason to put it on the big screen.

Well, that is your opinion but you might be surprised that a web TV type system would actually work with a competent Siri interface. Web TV has failed in the past for a number of reasons, such as a lack of an effective human - computer interface and poor resolution. Both of those issues are in the past now.

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Answer 6

Nov 24, 2015 9:02 PM in response to sdc01

I agree completely with you. I sent mine back two weeks ago because after waiting for three years, I was very disappointed.

I have an nVidia Shield Android TV and it does everything you are looking for except for point 8.

I'm willing to have another look at the Apple TV next year if they improve the software and hardware, but all the points you raise are very fair. You won't get much support in this forum, however, as the frequent commentators are all living in the reality distortion field.

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Answer 7

Nov 24, 2015 8:23 PM in response to sdc01

there is absolutely no native support for any industry standard way of accessing my NAS library!

You can access it you just have to load it in iTunes to be indexed. You can leave the content on the NAS it just needs to be in the iTunes lib to be seen.

No KEYBOARD! WHAT was Apple thinking (or not!)? This is the epitome of ridiculousness! Again, sure there is Airplay but it is

None of these devices(AppleTV, Ruku, Amazon Fire, etc) have a keyboard. It is too inconvent to carry a keyboard around compared to a remote and it is rarely needed. The Remote App on iOS devices gives you keyboard functionality, but I have seen people posting it does not work for ATV4.

No ability to add local storage

They have been down that road. The first ATV had local storage, it caused lots of confusion, and after going to HD the file sizes were too big. No amount of local storage is enough, and again content needs to be indexed in iTunes to be seen. You can have local storage by keeping content on your local computer(s) in iTunes.

This is an Internet device! Why can't I browse the Internet?

Again no TV based device offers that. Every attpent to do web browsing on TVs has fallen on its face. If you want a web browser that is what tablets and phones are for.

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Answer 8

sdc01 Author

Level 1

60 points

Nov 24, 2015 9:37 PM in response to Brian Cook4

Hello Brian,

Thanks for your reply...

Brian Cook4 wrote:

there is absolutely no native support for any industry standard way of accessing my NAS library!

You can access it you just have to load it in iTunes to be indexed. You can leave the content on the NAS it just needs to be in the iTunes lib to be seen.

I am running the iTunes server on my Synology but how/where do I go to see this content on my Apple TV? For instance, iTunes Movies only displays movies to purchase. Where do I find my own feed by my iTunes server? Same for my music and photos??

Brian Cook4 wrote:

No KEYBOARD! WHAT was Apple thinking (or not!)? This is the epitome of ridiculousness! Again, sure there is Airplay but it is

None of these devices(AppleTV, Ruku, Amazon Fire, etc) have a keyboard. It is too inconvent to carry a keyboard around compared to a remote and it is rarely needed. The Remote App on iOS devices gives you keyboard functionality, but I have seen people posting it does not work for ATV4.

By keyboard, I was also referring to the ability to control access from my iPhone or iPAD. That cannot be done on the Apple TV 4. The old app (which wasn't even fully endorsed by Apple) is not compatible with the Apple TV 4. I think it is ludicrous that Apple thought that the hunt and pick feature was good enough. Again, if Siri was given more capabilities this problem would be almost moot. Unfortunately, Siri was inexplicably limited in its abilities... major miss for Apple!

Every other Smart TV box includes a mobile app for an alternative remote control and keyboard. Additionally, most (or all) the Android based streaming boxes allow Bluetooth keyboards.

Brian Cook4 wrote:
No ability to add local storage

They have been down that road. The first ATV had local storage, it caused lots of confusion, and after going to HD the file sizes were too big. No amount of local storage is enough, and again content needs to be indexed in iTunes to be seen. You can have local storage by keeping content on your local computer(s) in iTunes.

Confusion? Seriously? Are you suggesting that Apple TV owners are somehow less technologically knowledgeable than ALL the other stream box owners? I emphasize all because it is a fact that only the Apple TV unit is limited in this regard. You know, it is really handy to bring a video over to my sisters home on a USB key and simply plug that USB key into her Ruku and INSTANTLY PLAY! With the Apple TV, the steps involved include turning on the computer, uploading the video, making sure it is indexed by iTunes... ridiculous! Fortunately, the reverse situation is unlikely...hence, less important.

Thanks for listening.

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Answer 9

Nov 25, 2015 2:00 AM in response to sdc01

I am running the iTunes server

There is no such product from Apple so what ever that isn't likely to be very comparable.

where do I go to see this content on my Apple TV?

If you want to see content on a local computer you go to the Computers icon.

The old app (which wasn't even fully endorsed by Apple)

That is completely false. Apple provided the remote app. No idea why they broke it with ATV4, but it is not surprising. They can not keep much working any more.

Are you suggesting that Apple TV owners are somehow less technologically knowledgeable than ALL the other stream box owners?

Did I say that? No. Lets try sticking to reality and my actual words. Rather than complete fiction you are choosing to childishly make up. It caused confusion between what was synced locally vs. available in their library. The same way YOU were looking in one place and did not see content you were looking for and just decided to believe it was not possible access local content which is completely false. Said confusion is the same reason Amazon Fire stopped supporting local storage.

With the Apple TV, the steps involved include turning on the computer, uploading the video, making sure it is indexed by iTunes... ridiculous!

Also completely false. If you have the content on a laptop or what ever it is instantly playable you just select it from the local device. If it content from iTunes then you do not even need to do that you can just play it from the iTunes Music store directly.

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Answer 10

Nov 25, 2015 3:14 AM in response to sdc01

Why keep debating it, you are obviously a quantity over quality type of individual, go get one of the other devices that do DLNA.

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Answer 11

Nov 25, 2015 7:26 AM in response to sdc01

sdc01 wrote:

I am so very underwhelmed by the new Apple TV. It seems clear that Apple doesn't really listen to customers.

If you don't like it, return it. It really sounds as if it's not the device for you. That doesn't make it a bad device, just the wrong one. I really like mine. Meets my needs and then some.

Take it back and submit your feedback to Apple:

http://www.apple.com/feedback

I agree with the previous poster. This entertainment devices is causing you way too much stress.

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