u2jimbo

Q: If a neighbors network shows up on my WiFi list under About This Mac, should I be concerned about security?

I am trying to solve a networking issue.  In the process, I was reviewing the WiFi networks listed in the System Report under About My Mac.  I found all my expected networks but also found a network I will name My Next Door Neighbor.  Although I have seen this network on my computer when connecting to one of my networks (and believed it to simply be a neighbor whose own network was close and strong), I was surprised to find it as a listing on the WiFi page of the System Report.

 

I don't know if I am over-reacting or should be concerned this neighbor could somehow be riding on my internet account and/or have access to sensitive information on my computer.  All my networks are secured with WPA2 Personal.  So is the neighbor.

 

Thanks for any insight that you can provide.

 

Jim

Mac Pro (Late 2013), OS X El Capitan (10.11.1)

Posted on Dec 17, 2015 10:23 PM

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Q: If a neighbors network shows up on my WiFi list under About This Mac, should I be concerned about security?

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  • by Network 23,Solvedanswer

    Network 23 Network 23 Dec 18, 2015 9:35 AM in response to u2jimbo
    Level 6 (12,043 points)
    Mac OS X
    Dec 18, 2015 9:35 AM in response to u2jimbo

    In the System Report, is the My Next Door Neighbor network listed under Current Network Information or Other Local Wi-Fi Networks?

     

    Current should be the network you're on, and that should be your own. If My Next Door Neighbor is under Other, that's OK. It means it's available but you're not connected to it. On my Mac, the Other category is all of my neighbors, about 10 of them. Other is like all of the non-selected networks under the Airport icon in the menu bar, they are of no concern because you're not connected to them. They are like the list of radio stations on your radio, they are listed because you are in range of them but they cannot affect you. Unless you're connected.

  • by u2jimbo,

    u2jimbo u2jimbo Dec 18, 2015 9:40 AM in response to u2jimbo
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 18, 2015 9:40 AM in response to u2jimbo

    Thanks Network 23.  My Next Door Neighbor is listed under the Other category of the WiFi network listings.  Your radio station analogy was a great aid to help me understand what is going on.

     

    Merry Christmas!

  • by Grant Bennet-Alder,

    Grant Bennet-Alder Grant Bennet-Alder Dec 18, 2015 10:08 AM in response to u2jimbo
    Level 9 (60,734 points)
    Desktops
    Dec 18, 2015 10:08 AM in response to u2jimbo

    Duane pointed out that WiFi Explorer (US$15 with three-day free trial) can show you the distribution and competition of surrounding Networks:

     

    WiFiExplorer.png

     

    From the diagram, you can see the spectrum overlap of two Networks on Channel 1 (Red and Green) and two other networks around channel 5 and 6 (orange and blue).

     

    it illustrates how few clear channels may be available at 802.11b/g/n speeds many Routers try to use in the 2.4GHz band.

     

    In the 5GHz band, a neighbor's network at channel 155 is way too low a signal to be useable by you.

     

    Re: 5G wifi linkspeed is slow (11Mbps)


    .

  • by lllaass,

    lllaass lllaass Dec 18, 2015 10:16 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder
    Level 10 (188,077 points)
    Desktops
    Dec 18, 2015 10:16 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder

    There is also a free version of NetSpot

  • by Mac_Cat,

    Mac_Cat Mac_Cat Dec 18, 2015 6:24 PM in response to lllaass
    Level 1 (44 points)
    Dec 18, 2015 6:24 PM in response to lllaass

    It's more and more common to see many different WiFi networks from neighbors, particularly in apartments and hotels.

    Don't worry about them, but make sure you put a good password on your's !

     

    Most of the currently sold wifi routers monitor other networks and which channels they are using (including your wireless phones), and if there is much interference, they will usually automatically choose a different channel.  (In the older routers, you sometimes had to manually choose  a different channel).

  • by Grant Bennet-Alder,

    Grant Bennet-Alder Grant Bennet-Alder Dec 18, 2015 6:36 PM in response to Mac_Cat
    Level 9 (60,734 points)
    Desktops
    Dec 18, 2015 6:36 PM in response to Mac_Cat

    Don't worry about them

    Oh, they won't get on your Network if you have a good password. But that is not the only problem. If you look at Duane's Network Neighborhood, it is typical of many. The 2.4GHz band is JAMMED with cheap Routers, all trying to shout over each other. and instead of the expected taking of ONE Channel per network, they take a third of the total bandwidth each! There are SIX Routers fighting over that 2.4GHz bandwidth!

     

    Users often complain that their Wi-Fi connection "drops out". That is because there is no way to get a (data) word in edgewise!

    If you live in a crowded area, you are just going to have to get a Router with dual-band, including 5MHz band, or you will not be able to get through the crowded mess that is the 2.4GHz band today.

  • by Mac_Cat,Helpful

    Mac_Cat Mac_Cat Dec 19, 2015 11:31 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder
    Level 1 (44 points)
    Dec 19, 2015 11:31 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder

    I agree.

     

    That's a good reason to buy Apple's Airport routers!

    They are dual banded and automatically hop to channels that aren't busy.

    I'm not a network engineer, but I do know that crowded WiFi channels are a real problem and 10 years ago, I would be manually changing channels on my 3rd party routers from time to time, like you are suggesting.   One really shouldn't have to log into their router, though, which is why I like using the Apple routers and monitoring it with the Airport Utility.

     

    I have used Netgear and Linksys routers with similar smart technology, but in my experience, they did not work as well as my Airport Extreme.

     

    I recommend updating routers every 2-3 years, because the technology improves and Apple devices have always been able to take advantage of that new technology.  The Airport Extreme, in fact, is truly superior for larger houses or offices, particularly with basement or upstairs rooms. 

  • by u2jimbo,

    u2jimbo u2jimbo Dec 19, 2015 12:27 PM in response to Mac_Cat
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 19, 2015 12:27 PM in response to Mac_Cat

    Mac_Cat:

     

    To start off, I am not well versed in any aspect or computer networking.  Your comment about the Apple Airport Extreme raises an interesting issue.  I have a 1TB Time Machine which is currently disconnected.  I believe it contains an Airport Extreme card - but would not bet my life on that belief...  In any case, it is disconnected cause when we recently moved into this house I could not get good coverage.  The house is 4300 sf with 800 sf upstairs (game room, guest room, bath).  My primary computer is at the opposite end of the house from the living room and the upstairs game room.

     

    I have been on a mission to get stable coverage throughout the house.  Being ignorant has its costs.  I assumed the Apple Airport Extreme was 'weak' so I went out and bought a Netgear Blackhawk X6 Tri-Band router (model R8000) in the belief it would solve my problem.  Not so.  Back to the store.  Next, a Netgear AC1200 Dual Band Range Extender (Model EX6200).  I placed it midway between my office and the living room and directly below the game room.  The living room was OK (not great) but the game room would not connect.  Finally I hooked up with a knowledgeable salesman at Fry's who suggested TP-Link Powerline Adapters (which I had never heard of).  I disconnected the range extender.  I installed the Powerline Adapters.  Like magic, everything snapped into focus and worked like a champ!

     

    Now, though, I wonder if I could have saved myself the cost of the Netgear devices and hooked up my Time Machine (which I want to continue to use at least as a backup strategy) along with the TP-Links and have equal or better connectivity...

     

    FYI, my original question about the My Next Door Neighbor network I see  represents the only additional networks (besides my own) that show up on any of my home network devices.

     

    I find networking issues to be the most frustrating aspect of computing.  And to just let you all in on the solution to the problem I was having which led to my original post regarding My Next Door Neighbor, my two TP-Link Powerline adapters inexplicably just dropped out.  This had me chasing MAC addresses, IP addresses, testing and rebooting ad nauseum and reading the System Report.  As it turned out the problem was a self-inflicted wound:  I had run out of wall plugs in my office and installed a outlet adapter.  I then plugged my router and the Powerline Base Station into the new adapter.

     

    A day later I noticed all the devices connected to my Powerline Adapters had crapped out and would not connect to the internet.  I did not put 2 + 2 together for a day and a half.  I found out you are not supposed to plug a Powerline Base Station into an outlet adapter (although a router works fine).  As soon as I removed the outlet adapter and plugged the Base Station directly back into the wall outlet my network again snapped back into action!

     

    So, thanks to each of you (Network 23, Grant Bennet-Alder, IIIaass, and Mac_Cat) for sharing your expertise with me.  I am back in business and feel my networks are secure and stable - at least until I decide to try to reincorporate my Time Machine!

     

    u2jimbo

  • by Mac_Cat,

    Mac_Cat Mac_Cat Dec 19, 2015 1:37 PM in response to u2jimbo
    Level 1 (44 points)
    Dec 19, 2015 1:37 PM in response to u2jimbo

    @ut2jimbo:  That is really good information - Thanks !

     

    I believe the Airport Extreme is a pretty good router and it works well in my house (two stories and irregularly shaped).

     

    I will warn you that in my personal experience, my Airport Extreme routers don't last very long.   I have replaced my Airport Extreme 3 times since the first came out.   But, after I gave them my network name and password, all my devices recognized the new router.   The Time Machine backup disk on all of them failed very early.  The first one lasted about 9 months and Apple replaced it without questions.  The second one lasted 3 months.  Apple replaced it.   The 3rd one lasted two weeks, so I just gave up using Time Machine, but the router continues to work flawlessly.

     

    Since so many things rely on a wifi connection, I also put my cable modem and my Airport Extreme on a small battery backup ($40).  They don't require much power and it's really helpful if the don't go down during a brief power glitch.


    With non-Apple routers, you usually have to go through an annoying sequences of turning each device back on, in order, after a power outage, because they will get their IP addresses mixed-up when the power up.  That never happens with the Apple routers.  I don't know the details, I just know that I got very tired of re-setting all the network devices and computers in the house and nobody in my family was willing to learn that process!

  • by Grant Bennet-Alder,

    Grant Bennet-Alder Grant Bennet-Alder Dec 19, 2015 1:43 PM in response to u2jimbo
    Level 9 (60,734 points)
    Desktops
    Dec 19, 2015 1:43 PM in response to u2jimbo

    This article shows how to add more Network Access points if you have a large area to cover, or if your house (like mine) is solid masonry construction or wire lath plaster, all of which swallow up the Wi-Fi signal. almost any Router that has 80211n can be incorporated.

     

    Wi-Fi base stations: Extending the range of your wireless network by adding additional Wi-Fi base stations - Apple Suppo…

     

    I suggest you not take the illustrated Wi-Fi to Wi-Fi connections seriously, but instead pull an Ethernet cable to each router location. WiFi-to-WiFi kills more than half your potential bandwidth just forwarding packets. Use Ethernet for the connections between Routers.

  • by u2jimbo,

    u2jimbo u2jimbo Dec 20, 2015 11:09 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder
    Level 1 (0 points)
    Dec 20, 2015 11:09 AM in response to Grant Bennet-Alder

    Grant:

     

    My network looks like this:   Arris Gateway > Netgear Router > TP-Link Base Station > TP-Link Adapter.  Each of these devices are connected to each other via ethernet cable or my house electrical wiring (is electrical cable as good as an ethernet cable?).  Nothing except the Router is connected to the Gateway.  My primary computer is connected via ethernet cable to my Router; and two printers are USB connected to my Router.  At the Living Room TP-Link Adapter I have my internet capable TV and Blu-Ray player connected via ethernet cable; and I use my Mac Book wirelessly connected to the TP-Adapter while watching TV.  At the Game Room TP-Link Adapter I have my internet capable X-Box console and a gaming computer connected via ethernet cable; and I have used my MacBook wirelessly in this location, too.

     

    From reading the article you shared, I believe if I were to substitute my Time Machine for the TP-Link Base Station and substituted Airport Extreme Base Stations for each of the TP-Link Adapters (and connected them to the Time Machine via ethernet cable), I would have a Roaming Network.  Would you agree?

     

    Would you expect to see stronger signal strength / greater connection stability with the Roaming Network vs. the set-up I have currently installed?  The three TP-Link devices cost ~ $100.  One Airport Extreme is about ~ $100.

     

    Do you think the TP-Link devices would work with my Time Machine?  For example: Router > Time Machine > TP-Link Base Station > TP-Link Adapter > X-Box console.

  • by Grant Bennet-Alder,

    Grant Bennet-Alder Grant Bennet-Alder Dec 20, 2015 12:45 PM in response to u2jimbo
    Level 9 (60,734 points)
    Desktops
    Dec 20, 2015 12:45 PM in response to u2jimbo

    what model TP-Link are you using?

  • by Grant Bennet-Alder,

    Grant Bennet-Alder Grant Bennet-Alder Dec 20, 2015 5:05 PM in response to u2jimbo
    Level 9 (60,734 points)
    Desktops
    Dec 20, 2015 5:05 PM in response to u2jimbo

    (is electrical cable as good as an ethernet cable?)

    category-5 Ethernet cables with all conductors present can run up to 1000 Megabits/sec

    TP-Link backbone across your house wiring claims 500 Megabits/sec (not too shabby and you did not have to pull any cables). so that is pretty good for your wired connections.

     

    Almost nobody has a connection to the Internet that fast, so extra speed is only helpful for local transfers.

     

    --------

    The TP-Link remote devices you have use only the 2.4GHz band. So if your Wi-Fi connections are suffering from neighbor's interference, you don't have access to the wide-open 5GHz band.

     

    I think as long as the data rates stay good, and do not start to drop off, you could just keep using TP-link stuff.

     

    If you read closely, that Apple document talks about extending an Apple Network with an additional Apple Router used as an Access point, and connected by Ethernet cable. But almost ANY Router can be added to an existing network in this way, to do roaming without having to replace, only extend your existing Network.

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