Hi Gang
I have a 90 minute project in 4:3 Standard Definition but the entire piece was cropped using a wide screen adjustable mask. If I use a Wide Screen theme from iDVD 08, will the content of the piece be affected? Will the content wind up appearing distorted in any way, or will it remain intact? In other words, my question is whether 'a wide screen theme' will affect the dimensions of the content?
Thank you
Mac Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.8), FC7
After conducting a few tests, I'm going to answer my own question:
Using a 'Wide Screen Theme' will in fact, alter/force the actual media content to become 'Stretched'.
Again, (as I mentioned originally), the media content is technically 4:3 but its all been cropped with a 'Wide Screen Mask'.
It would be nice to use an iDVD 08 'Wide Screen Theme' while not affecting the actual media content, but I don't know how to do that in iDVD.
I think that's something that can be accomplished in DVD Studio Pro.
After conducting a few tests, I'm going to answer my own question:
Using a 'Wide Screen Theme' will in fact, alter/force the actual media content to become 'Stretched'.
Again, (as I mentioned originally), the media content is technically 4:3 but its all been cropped with a 'Wide Screen Mask'.
It would be nice to use an iDVD 08 'Wide Screen Theme' while not affecting the actual media content, but I don't know how to do that in iDVD.
I think that's something that can be accomplished in DVD Studio Pro.
ENIGMACODE wrote:
Hi Gang
I have a 90 minute project in 4:3 Standard Definition but the entire piece was cropped using a wide screen adjustable mask. If I use a Wide Screen theme from iDVD 08, will the content of the piece be affected? Will the content wind up appearing distorted in any way, or will it remain intact? In other words, my question is whether 'a wide screen theme' will affect the dimensions of the content?
Thank you
Yes. Use a 4:3 theme.
At least in iDVD7 (which is included in iLife 09 and all grey install disks of at least Snow Lepard) you can choose the apsect ratio of the project. When you select 16:9 project and use a 4:3 theme, the theme will be strechted.
If I understand the initial post right, it is your source that is affected. Am I right to assume, that one actually just has to select the project aspect ratio that is the same as the used video sources? A use of a theme with not fitting apsect ratio will only result in streching/squishing the theme, which will be no Problem, right?
Hello lime - Hello Klaus
Thanx for your responses. As I mentioned, I solved the problem myself but appreciate your input.
With iDVD 08, you cannot use a 'Wide Screen Theme' without it affecting/stretching/distorting the video/media content.
The perfect 'Work-Around' for me was to create a 'cropped' 4:3 image and insert it into the menu window which matched the same proportion as all the media content. So now, everything is 'Window Boxed'.
Purists may not agree, but I used a CROPPED mask for all the 4:3 content: (every frame), (every clip). It resembles the older 'wide-screen' capture option with older 4:3 cameras. The entire project is original. And (so far), the feedback is that its more pleasing to the eye than seeing the black side bars.
Again, its only an artistic opinion.
Happy New Year!
Happy New Year, too!
Two things:
1). I have to correct myself. I wrote iDVD7 which is in iLife09. Correct is the following:
*iLife08: iDVD 7.0 (8/2007, App itself like the encoder was not changed after that)
*iLife09: iDVD 7.04 (2009, only minor bug fixes)
*iLie11: iDVD 7.12 (2010, only minor bug fixes, Themes before Version iDVD5 are missing, you can get them, if you get iDVD7 or 7.04, which has all themes and then update it for free to 7.12)
iDVD installs from grey 10.5 and 10.6 DVDs work on other Macs/operating systems, too.
2). aspect ratio
Do you have the 4:3 content still? Could you test something for me?
1. When you open iDVD and select "create new project", the next step will be to give it a name and at the bottom of the window choose "Standard 4:3".
2. now go to themes and select a theme from 7.0 or 6.0 (all are 16:9). When you do so, iDVD tells you that this is 16:9 and asks you if you want to keep your aspect ratio (4:3). click "keep".
3. add a 4:3 movie for testing. save as Image and view the result.
In my picture you see, that iDVD forces the 16:9 theme which you see on the right into 4:3 by cutting off (cropping) part of the sunflower and the curls of the plant.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/75270900/16to9theme%20in%204to3%20project.pn g
Hello there again lime 🙂
Yes, I follow your logic and really appreciate the tips, (things I haven't seen before), so they are helpful tips. Thanks for the handy screen shot.
Only problem for me, (an artistic angle), is that in the current world, 16:9 naturally fills the entire width of a TV Flat Screen. If I'm to understand this, I don't think the resulting 'mis-match' of Menu Image vs. Media Image is pleasing to the eye - follow my logic?
Along this thinking, you've probably seen that 'some' cable networks actually produce/create 'Window Boxed' media. There's probably a technical reason? But I'm not sure why....
In any event, the next time I open iDVD, I'll test your theory/option and try it.
Thank you my friend
Thanks back to you. I am new to iDVD (after having used Macs for 15 years now. 😮 😊 ) I have a thread running Is the number of movies videos used in iDVD limited to 5? on which I still await that some experst like @Klaus1 and @Karsten Schlüter show up. 🙂
Yeah, I noticed, that they sometimes use window boxing (here in Germany, when they show some very old series that have low quality they artificially "minimize" the viewable area, so that it doesn't look that ugly on a big screen). I think it is ok, better have a nicer picture than a big picture.
RE your logic. I think I understand (?), but I assume, if one tells iDVD to make the 16:9 menue theme fit in 4:3 (which cuts off the sides) and the media is 4:3 too and then you watch the DV on a 16:9 TV it, the TV would add bookends (black bars) to the left and the right to make the 4:3 DVD fit the 16:9 screen without stretching the material. Or do you dislike the bookends (or that it cuts of part of the flower in my screenshot) from an artistical standoint/view?
Edit: you can switch between project aspect ratio during your creation process all the time by selecting "project" from the iDVD menue bar at the top (not of the DVD itself) and then click on the second entry "change aspect ratio of project". Also you can use the shortcut opt-key+cmd+A
Hello again lime
Thanx for your interest in continuing the discussion. *You mentioned you're waiting to hear back from klaus? Yes, I understand - there are helpful people in this particular forum. But other experiened kind souls have left these forums because of new Apple rules which sometimes strip/reduce the well-earned hashmarks. 'Japamac' for one, (an American living in Japan), was from a past generation of self accomplished mechanical - soft ware geniuses.
Ok, back to the issue - you mentioned: "TV would add bookends (black bars) to the left and the right to make the 4:3 DVD fit the 16:9 screen without stretching the material. Or do you dislike the bookends"
Yes, more than likely, (despite my customized individually cropped 4:3 media), it could still appear stretched/distorted, or the least of which, might luckily appear enlarged proportionately during certain broadcasts which could automatically FILL the screen.
And yes, (despite some opinions), I do NOT want the Black Bars to appear.
To be better prepared, (regardless of iDVD menu options), I should already have at my disposal, (ready for broadcast), UP-RESEZED 4:3 media cropped properly, (again using crop adjustment tool). Then, (and only then), I'll concern myself with standard 16:9 menus, (no need for work-arounds). verstehen? 🙂
Best
Mike
Hi
I knew Japamacs superb website and when I registered here and over time found out that he was a contributing member of this forum I was very happy. The more I was sorry/sad, when I later learned that he had left (after already having seen people bickering and disrespecting his great knowledge and friendly attitude). Would be a shame if Klaus1 and other helpful members are going or have gone, too... Well, sure there might be new ones that have great knowledge, but you are used to some people, right 😉
On topic. OK, ich verstehe. 🙂
I just (a few minutes ago) discovered a strange thing in the iDVD menue that leaves me puzzled and confuses me.
From the menue (See screenshots) you can choose to let iDVD show "the area that will be viewable/visible on TV" and something I would translate as "show marks for are that is cut off in general".
viewable TV area 16:9 https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/75270900/viewable%20TV%20area%2016to9.png
"genereally not visible or cut off" area 16:9 https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/75270900/generally%20cut%20area%2016to9.png
viewable TV area 4:3 (notice the second "general" option is not available from the menue https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/75270900/viewable%20TV%20area%204to3.png
I don't have a DVD-standalone player, nor a 16:9 TV (I am oldfashioned and have the habbit to use stuff until it is dead or not reasonably usable anymore. Also I can't cope with picture quality of Flat-TVs vs my old Tube-TV. I know other people say digital is always better than analog referring to LCDs and Tubes as well, but... well.).
Since I don't think I will get any input in my other thread very soon, I will just use the "show viewable area" marks and see that I don't place buttons etc. into the "no"-area. I want to get finished with it and send it away soon. If my cousin gets problem with it I will just change the project afterwards and send it again.
(I'll also do an easy alternative version of it in Toast, where Toast does all the decisions...)
RE: your link. Nice project you have there, good idea. (That explains your user nick 😉 )
Hi again lime
I can definitely relate to your statement: "Also I can't cope with picture quality of Flat-TVs vs my old Tube-TV"
I'm older, (67). What I find most annoying about so-called 'Back Lit LED' flatscreens is a problem that can produce something known as the 'Soap Opera Effect.'
It has to do with the refresh rate that was designed especially for 'Sports'. But it destroys the natural beauty of film by altering frame rate and making the media appear Fake. Most people simply don't care and just accept it without bothering to adjust settings. I have an older Plasma, (which to me), still looks warm & rich.
Back to Japamac: I'm of the opinion that some of the newcomers simply don't acknowledge nor respect experience and goodwill. Its bickering and stupid jealousy. Few here, (so far), have exhibited the same ole' fashioned, mature, 'self-reliance'. Japamac was a true Renaissance Man. 'BD Aqua' as well.
Unfortunately you may not see 'good will' and respect from experienced users on the FC forum. Threads get Hijacked, go off point, and then sometimes followed blindly by the novice. There's an occasional aire of 'lecturing superiority.' Thus, I've switched over to Creative Cow for FCP. Its more conducive, (less condescending).
Good luck on your Menu issue - I'll take another look at your screen shots. Hope klaus gets back to you - he's very good.
Wir teilen die gleichen Meinungen 🙂
My Best
Mike
I remember BDAqua, too. Didn't know he has gone.
RE the screen display issue, I found something in another thread "On the other hand, DVDs created in iDVD are automatically set to display as "auto letterbox & pan/scan" which means that, depending on your DVD player's settings, the DVD might not display correctly." source: Re: FCP to IDVD Distortions
Maybe this is, why iDVD offers to show marks for areas that might disappear.
Hi lime
Actually BD Aqua may still be around - I mentioned him because he also builds custom computers and has a lot of 'old-style' experience. He used to suggest that folks with 'Graphics Card' issues ask Japamac, (Graphics Card Expertise).
With regard to iDVD - Yes it will sort of 'Up Res' Standard Def Files, if mixed with HD on a FC sequence. Especially if the export settings of FC are also set to 'Wide Screen'.
But again, (in my particular case), every frame, every piece of video is nestled within a sequence set to DV/DVCPRO NTSC 720X480. Therefore, iDVD will recognize the media (as is), and has no conflict with output.
*I have a friend who mixed media on his FC timeline, (exported as Wide Screen HD). The end result, (with regard to the Standard Def media), was sort of an 'Up Rezed' appearance.
DVD Studio Pro, a more sophisticated program, (with a moderate learning curve), should resolve some of those issues. Its a very powerful program.
Mike
Wide Screen Menu iDVD 08
