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Is iTunes true 1080P

Being there are so many new devices out there with a myriad of apps, ones that Apple TV 4 do not offer, just wondering if iTunes really is a true 1080P video stream? When I compare other apps (I won't mention names) on other devices, they all seem to offer a clearer higher quality video stream, darker colors, deeper colors, higher depth and contrast, defined better than iTunes. My TV is a Sony 43 inch 4K UHD, but can set settings (On the TV) to 1080P using all 3 devices I have, and the Apple TV 4 seems like the poorest quality image, which amazes me because Apple's other products are much more superior in image quality and video playback. I'm just wondering if anyone else notices a slight but rather annoying difference in video streaming on the new ATV4?


Is it because the app developers have not updated the actual apps to be optimized yet for the new ATV4?

Apple TV, tvOS 9.1, Apple TV 4 and iTunes Movies 1080P

Posted on Jan 1, 2016 12:38 PM

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21 replies

Jan 1, 2016 2:11 PM in response to daveco35

AppleTV 3 and AppleTv 4 handle 1080p output with aplomb.


Your question really relates to iTunes 1080p video quality - it is generally extremely good 1080p content these days but is compressed far beyond BluRay which still offers the best video quality until 4k BluRay releases come in the next few months.


iTunes differs from most services in that content streamed via the internet is fixed size/quality (so buffering on slower connections) whereas most other things like Netflix reduce quality with slower connections, so personally I've tended to find AppleTV much better unless you have very fast broadband.


My main gripes with iTunes and other streamed video tends to be compression leading to banding in dark/bright colours to a far greater extend than on BluRay. iTunes releases are far better than they used to be, plus it's also content dependent so you notice it less with generally well lit video than say sci-fi with lots od dark space scenes etc.


A few things spring to mind:


Firstly, the iTunes playback quality for cloud streaming is configurable SD/720p/1080p - ensure in Settings for itunes Store that 1080p is selected.


Secondly under Audio and Video Setting play with the HDMI output mode which has choices of:


Auto

RGB Hi

RGB Low

YPbPr (or is it YCbCr)


....and RGB Hi/Low really can offer dramatic differences if you find things too dark - annoyingly the new flat AppleTV graphic design hinders quick evaluation as before when you had the '3d' looking AppleTv with a reflection you could quickly appreciate shadow detail changing with the settings being changed - no chance with the flat grey icon.

Jan 31, 2016 12:20 PM in response to Alley_Cat

Thanks for the impressive reply!


I tend to agree with you, iTunes doesn't offer the quality of a true 1080P Blu-ray Player video image, being internet compression leads to banding in dark/bright color in od dark space scenes etc, (Darn, I absolutely hate that) to a far greater extend than on Blu-ray Players, in fact, that doesn't occur at all on a Bly-ray Player.


My TWC cable is set to Component being the HDMI is 1080i, and very pixelated. I rather sacrifice the 1080i to a full scan in 720P, which turns out to be deeper in color, not as many blurred pixelated motion scenes.


My internet connection is 100 Megabytes down, and 25 Megabytes up, plenty of bandwidth for one person, alone in a household. My Wi-Fi streams sometimes on an iPhone in a test at 120 Megs down... So all the 3 media streaming devices are receiving their fair share of broadband, most than many households.


Do you ever think, from an Apple standpoint, this will ever be resolved using a supposed internet compressional 1080P video stream to be comparable to a real Blu-ray experience? I also have the new Sony BDP S6700 with Triluminos (2015-16 Model). There are those out there who disagree with Sony's claims, but I do notice the life like colors, of course on a Sony TV, maybe its in my head!

But even in a streaming app, such as Netflix (I cannot access iTunes on that device, but if I did, I think it would do better than the ATV4), the color space is quite stunning, more vivid, deep, with true flesh tones.


My opinion, there are just too many options out there now, experimenting, whereas iTunes has been around for much longer. So I do tend to buy Movies in iTunes, more than the other services, although iTunes doesn't offer the ability to sync with Ultra Violet, which is obvious. I don't know where it will all lead to, but I am betting on the internet as being the sole source of TV entertainment within the next 10 years... Cable is still dishing out 1080i, such a joke!


--------------------------------------------


I do have a myriad of settings on my HDMIs, terms I'm not too sure about, and maybe you can help me with this...

I have 5 HDMI inputs, 3 components, 3 composites (I don't use those anymore) and 3 Videos (really have no idea why they are there) and 3 PC types, DVI, VGA, and mini display ports (You can configure a USB Type C -1)


Here are some of the options on the separate HDMI settings:


Color Matrix - selection of "Auto" or all the resolutions, including 1080P with ITU709, or ITU601.

I don't know the difference between ITU601 or ITU709


RGB Dynamic Range - selection of "Auto" or "Full" or "Limited" - I left them all on Auto


Photo Color Space - selection of "Adobe RGB", or "sRGB" or "sYCC" - they are all on "sYCC"


Video Color Space - selection of "x.v.Color" or "Normal" or "Auto" - these are all set on "x.v.Color"


CineMotion - selection of "Auto" or "Off"



Then there are Text, Gaming, and Photo selections which doesn't apply, way too many options.


Sony doesn't have, anywhere in the manuals, what these will do, but I am assuming on the Video Color Space, the settings for x.v.Color is basically for another Sony device, such as a Sony Blu-ray Player, syncing true color with the HDMI inputs. Sony has the 1080p/24 which is basically the way the picture was made in Cinema Film.


Here is my take on as many services I use:


iTunes - steady, never any buffering, no color banding in dark to light, overall near 1080P but not quite.
(for me, no buffering ever occurs on any devices, yet, with that kind of bandwidth)


Vudu - HDX, steady, never any buffering, some color banding, however more brighter and wider color range using Roku 4.


Amazon - Okay, close to 1080P but more muffled, blending of colors, high compressional methods for 4K, noticeable but nice job.


Netflix - the best service I have seen, both using the ATV4, Roku 4, and Sony BDP S6700, a bit true like Blu-ray on the Sony.


Hulu - quality is near Netflix, but still notice, not much, color banding on all devices.


HBO Go - I bring this up because it has a quality server, picture is overall near 1080P on all devices, but they left out the "AUTO-PLAY feature on the ATV 4, and Roku 4 which was and has been very disappointing, I have tried over and over again to contact the developers of that app for especially the ATV 4, but to no avail, they figure you can air-play it from your iPhone, but they do not realize, if you air play it to the ATV 4, you still cannot autoplay, you still have to hit a few buttons on the iPhone for the episodes to continue, being the iPhone, even wen mirroring it to the ATV 4, goes into lock screen mode, and looses that ability to autoplay... How sad :-(



Thanks so much, I hope this offers where I am standing as far as video streaming over the internet. Best

Feb 7, 2016 7:54 AM in response to Winston Churchill

Winston, I meant as "True 1080P is Bluray".

I agree, iTunes now, seems most best at offering the closest one can receive to full HD - 1080P , via Apple's ATV4 media device.

Comparable is VUDU, Netflix, HBO GO, some others out there, using a Roku 4 in UHD.

Unfortunately, iTunes nor the ATV4 can produce an upscale stream near 4K.

I would assume Apple will release a new ATV (Perhaps 5 Version) once 4K becomes widely received.

Feb 7, 2016 8:17 AM in response to Alley_Cat

Alley_Cat, I did as you suggested, played around as much as possible with so many options on the Sony Bravia 4K, and it boils down, to me anyway, to leave the HDMI input I have designated for the ATV4 on "Auto". I did see some differences, but nothing as much as I was expecting. So far the best true skin tones and deep colors can be found on the new Sony BDP 6700 or Sony BDP 6500, using Triluminus technology on a quad processor with Bravia sync. However, as far as the internet media service, horrible interface. If you can get past this, channels such as Netflix, PlayStation Movies (Entertainment), and Crackle, YouTube, some others I won't detail, do offer the up scaling to near 4K, and even if I keep the setting both on the Player and TV to just 1080P, wow, this is amazing, both the disc and the few internet services I mentioned, are really a "True" Full 1080P video. It is actually hard to tell the difference between Netflix and a Blu-ray disc. The PlayStation Entertainment channel offers the same content, as far as movies, than does iTunes.


I wish (I'm hoping as I have a lot invested in iTunes) iTunes will become like this someday in the future.

Feb 7, 2016 10:37 AM in response to daveco35

In the UK I've found terrestrial/satellite brodcasts (at least the free ones) max out at 1080i which is disappointing.


The trouble with iTunes Store is that it's about convenience over absolute quality and most people don't care - not only is there a need for users to have very fast downstream speeds for faster bitrates but Apple's servers would potentially need to be bolstered to cope if they suddenly allowed far better streaming rates, and I'd honestly be surprised if they did so for existing purchases (spec 8 Mbps for 1080p). If you do a search for iTunes vs BluRay I suspect you'll find a few frame by frame comparisons and unless zoomed most people would struggle to spot much difference at all - even if they can viewing stills is not the same as viewing video. I think the areas where dedicated BluRay players etc beat streamers is really in a much more solid video playback with fewer jerky movements on panning etc - often as AppleTV cannot output 24 fps even though many movies are actually encoded at that for the store.


As for many of the settings you're probably best leaving on Auto where possible or trying various permutaions -I agree these days there are far too many things to set or possibly alter with little guidance.


CineMotion is presumably frame interpolation - I've yet to see an increased frame rate offer better quality when interpolation is involved - things looks too sped up for me. Maybe when newer 50/60 fps source material is available.


Amazon Prime video quality has not impressed me much. Netflix has always been a top performer even with slow connections, they've got something right in their streaming model.

Feb 8, 2016 2:25 AM in response to daveco35

daveco35 wrote:


Winston, I meant as "True 1080P is Bluray".

I agree, iTunes now, seems most best at offering the closest one can receive to full HD - 1080P , via Apple's ATV4 media device.

To stream at the data rate used by blurry would mean the vast majority of people would be unable to use it, yes it's a compromise.

Unfortunately, iTunes nor the ATV4 can produce an upscale stream near 4K.

The Apple TV outputs 1080p it's your TV that would do the upscaling, if it doesn't do it well it's the TV's fault, unfortunately I think you will find most TV's are like this, they sell themselves with numbers not quality.

Actually without going into providing examples I note that iTunes HD is streamed at a higher data rate than most services offering 4k, so it seems it is mostly a marketing gimmick at the moment.

I would assume Apple will release a new ATV (Perhaps 5 Version) once 4K becomes widely received.

I'm sure they will at some stage, I'm not so sure it needs to be just yet though, as I note above I feel 4k (with any quality) is a way off just yet.

Feb 10, 2016 11:41 AM in response to Winston Churchill

I had composed a detailed reply but accidentally clicked away from the page!


Interesting site:


http://4k.com/movies/


Sky really want a pound of flesh...


http://4k.com/news/sky-nails-a-price-to-its-eventually-4k-streaming-service-sky- q-coming-for-purchase-in-february-to-the…


So far comparing Netflix Jessica Jones episodes on AppleTV vs Samsung Netflix app with a 4k subscription, the Samsung 4k seems a lot better, but not in all scenes - the animated/graphic start sequences are considerably more detailed, sharper and there seems to be less jerky motion. May not be comparing apples with apples quite yet though.

Feb 10, 2016 12:48 PM in response to daveco35

Just for completeness...


if iTunes really is a true 1080P video stream


There are some professional formats that are 'true' resolution, but *ALL* consumer video formats are compressed. Yes, that includes BluRay.

Sure, all devices describe an image of 1920 x 1080 pixels, 60 times a second, so it can be called 1080p, but that's where the similarities end.


Uncompressed data rates are calculated by multiplying the horizontal and vertical resolutions (1920 x 1080) by the color depth (typically 24 bits), all multiplied by the frame rate (60 frames per second), which results in:


1920 x 1080 x 24 x 60 ≈ 2.98Gbps


Few, if any, individuals have this kind of bandwidth available, so all video formats use some kind of encoding and compression to make the data stream viable.

What's most important is the algorithm that's used to compress the data - you want one that optimizes (minimizes) data size while minimizing image artifacts (color fidelity, banding, etc.).


Unless you're working with raw footage, you're dealing with compressed content.

Feb 12, 2016 12:42 AM in response to Winston Churchill

Winston says - The Apple TV outputs 1080p it's your TV that would do the upscaling, if it doesn't do it well it's the TV's fault


I think its pretty fair to say sir, as having owned Sony TVs since 18 years old, my current Sony is the finest on the market. It definitely is NOT the TV's fault, and Sony doesn't use false advertising schemes. All video, images, data is compressed, we couldn't live without compression, jpegs, mpegs being a great examples. I highly doubt, at the data rate I receive using the ATV4, on a home network with just 100 Megabytes down, iTunes can produce a full 1080P video. But it certainly does a great job. I think I have agreed with someone in here, iTunes does the best with scaling issues we usually see on internet media servers.

Feb 12, 2016 12:54 AM in response to daveco35

It would seem fair to say, even iTunes, falsely advertises they are delivering a 1080P movie... So every method to today's madness of high quality video, so they say, has its own merits of misguided claims...


I remember about 20 years ago, Bill Gates was the key speaker when Microsoft unleashed new OS like Windows 98, XP, etc... He did a digital download of a 120 minute movie in its original format, in less than 5 seconds. TWC cannot even produce a 1080p video, not sure if 1080P is offered by other providers yet in selected cities, so we are far behind the curve so to speak.


OTA here in the States is still at 1080i or 720P.

Feb 12, 2016 1:49 AM in response to daveco35

I suggest you read things more carefully before chiming in. I'm fully aware what compression is thank you, I don't need any lessons on video compression. I was correcting the poster who seemed to think that the Apple TV upscales it's output for their 4k TV.


The TV does the upscaling and if the upscaling isn't done well there is only the TV to blame.

Is iTunes true 1080P

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