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Airport Utility: Device Not Found; have to power cycle

We have an Airport extended network. One of the Extreme Base stations continuously falls off the network. See the screen grabs below. Notice the "3rd Floor Hallway" is Not Found. The green light is on, but its guest network does not show up so i am led to believe it is not transmitting wi-fi. Then i power cycle the unit (un plug it momentarily). Walah. It now shows up in Airport Utility. Tomorrow, i have the same exact problem. I do not have the problem with the base station identified as Doghaus Brewery, even though it is similarly connected by ethernet. I physically swapped the Hallway unit with the one connected wirelessly and labeled Adventure Inn. Same problem.


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here is the screen shot showing version

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and we use the setting of creating a network, named the same so that we have the effect of a mesh or roaming network.

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Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Posted on Jan 26, 2016 10:34 AM

Reply
6 replies

Jan 26, 2016 12:29 PM in response to iciclesteve

How old is the Extreme that you have designated 3rd Floor Hallway?


Model from the base please.. eg A1408, would be a Gen 5.


I would also like you to test it. when it drops off the network.. go and plug a laptop or something directly into it (if that is feasible) and see what is happening.. Is it actually off the network or not.. ping the main router.. ping the internet. Tell me where it is breaking down or if this is just airport utility not able to see ethernet connections at the same time as wireless connections.


On whatever computer you are using to take the screenshots.


1. Have you set IPv6 to link local only for both wireless and ethernet? This is important now to get accurate information.

eg for wireless.

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2. When you swap the airport utility to ethernet does it show up.


Unbeknown to most people the airport utility works on either wireless or ethernet not both. This is located in the most unusual of places.. the top left corner that says Other Wi-Fi Devices.. it is so obviously where you would select to view the network over ethernet.


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I would also note.. Apple routers are not business devices.. they are home use.


You are trying to use them in a hotel.. and they are just not up to the task.

Jan 26, 2016 1:11 PM in response to LaPastenague

"3rd Floor Hallway" is model 1408

"Adventure Inn" is model 1408 (this dropped off when used as 3rd floor hallway, but has not dropped off in current wireless setup!?)

"Doghaus Window" is model A1143 and has never dropped off (1st Gen)

"Service Window" which is not pictured but has the same drop off issue is model 1408


i find it odd that the older version does not have the drop off issue that the newer version has.


i find it odd that the 1408 model dropped off when connected via ethernet, but has not dropped off since i removed the cable and let it connect wifi.


the IPv6 is set to configure 'automatically' i will change to 'link-local'. Note, my desktop version of airport utility looks different then your screen shot on this point. i am using version 6.3.6.


on the philosophical topic of using Airport in a commercial environment, i would argue that it works really well. Especially when configured as a mesh style network. Our ISP had us set up with windows devices and we were not happy with the performance. But for the mysterious dropping issue, i am super happy with Airport in our nine room hotel and 100 seat beer garden. i regularly sees 20+ devices logged in without a glitch.


hopefully the link-local change will help.


steve

Jan 26, 2016 2:08 PM in response to iciclesteve

the IPv6 is set to configure 'automatically' i will change to 'link-local'. Note, my desktop version of airport utility looks different then your screen shot on this point. i am using version 6.3.6.

I still use Mountain Lion for my regular computer.. resort to El Capo when forced to.


"3rd Floor Hallway" is model 1408

"Service Window" which is not pictured but has the same drop off issue is model 1408

I have run these in various extend network configurations and found them working fine when initially installed and then drop off.


It is interesting the older Gen 1 behaves itself.


Let me suggest a different method of setup.


I think your "mesh" setup has inherent weakness.. in that units that wireless extend cannot be forced to connect to a particular AP. So things can get pretty tricky. It would work better with all connected by ethernet or all connected by wireless extend.. but the main culprit could be the AC model extreme. I think the DNS in this can be faulty.. and what is happening is the units fail because they are lost on the network..


And this is where more pro products would tell you what is happening.

Our ISP had us set up with windows devices and we were not happy with the performance.

I was suggesting something more like Ubiquiti.. pro type products but not over expensive.


Anyway let's pursue the problem.


What I want you to do is setup the two wired units, 1408 in static IP mode and to handle their own dhcp.


The setup is here.

Re: airport time capsule keeps disconnecting


I think bridge connection has a weakness.. especially if the DNS in the main router goes phfft.


So in your particularly layout.. set the main router DHCP server to 10.0.1.2 - 10.0.1.100 and reduce the DHCP lease time to 1 hour.


Now take your pick. Set say 3rd floor hallway to static IP, 10.0.1.101 and set its DHCP range to 10.0.1.102-150


Set Service Window to 10.0.1.151 and set its DHCP range to 10.0.1.152-200


Both of them with lease times also of 1hour.


For DNS setting in those two units.. you can use your main router.. 10.0.1.1 but then also add either your ISP or 8.8.8.8 google public DNS.


It might well be also worthwhile having got all that done.. to use dhcp reservation in the main router so you actually apply the IP to it as well.. I have to check again.. I have forgotten if Apple can apply dhcp reservation outside dhcp range or not. But what we are trying to do is ensure the wired units stick in the ARP table of the main router.. they should but I am not sure it isn't worth having two bites at the Apple (sic).


This also allows you to always be able to pick up the fixed IP units using Configure Other in the main menu of the airport utility.. This has also helped me when items dropped out of sight.


This might initially look pretty complicated.. it isn't. Actually it is dead simple.. You are not routing .. you are simply dividing and moving dhcp load from the main router to peripheral units. It is still one flat network.. anything is in theory able to connect to anything else.


But the stability of this I found gave much improved results.. YMMV .. !!


I can give you more specifics if you need them.. I could almost replicate what you have with the equipment I have here.. with some substitution of bits and pieces. Extreme for express.


I also would say when I was building these systems.. I found the 7.6.4 fell over more often than 7.6.1 ever did.. it was 100% reproducible.. if I downgraded the reliability improved.. upgraded it got worse. But I haven't done much since I put in the AC model (TC in my case) where the whole setup became a lot less reliable.. which leads me to think DNS issue there could be the hidden problem.


I will add a few screenshot..

Jan 26, 2016 2:39 PM in response to LaPastenague

Overall network.


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Setup of the TCgen52tb

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Notice I set the static address to the AE outside the DHCP range locally so that is fine.. This will help keep things updated.

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Now the setup of the AEgen5ex


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And the network tab.

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So I have my computer now connected to the AEgen5ex by wireless..


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And I have perfect internet connection..


Plus what I can do is see inside the Gen 5 TC.. (this is not normal.. sorry it takes a lot of work).


tcgen52tb# arp -a

? (192.168.2.201) at 6c:70:9f:d4:c4:76 on bridge0 permanent

? (192.168.2.215) at 3c:07:54:0e:97:a4 on bridge0

? (192.168.2.219) at 28:37:37:15:4d:6f on bridge0

? (192.168.2.236) at 5c:96:9d:6d:e9:2b on bridge0

? (192.168.2.237) at 28:37:37:15:4d:6f on bridge0

? (192.168.2.254) at 60:03:47:01:5d:61 on bridge0

? (192.168.2.255) at (incomplete) on bridge0


For you from a terminal ping the broadcast address.


ping 192.168.2.255

PING 192.168.2.255 (192.168.2.255): 56 data bytes

64 bytes from 192.168.2.215: icmp_seq=0 ttl=64 time=3.444 ms

64 bytes from 192.168.2.236: icmp_seq=0 ttl=255 time=10.219 ms

64 bytes from 192.168.2.201: icmp_seq=0 ttl=255 time=10.235 ms


Any major issues should show up in ping.. failure to respond or long times.


You need to translate all that to 10.0.1.x for your system.. but it should not be too difficult with that guide.


This is add on so won't affect the rest of my system and I can check it a few times a day and see how it does.


Hope all that helps some.

Jan 26, 2016 4:42 PM in response to LaPastenague

The Link-Local remedy did not work.


the wired "Hallway" has remained up today, but the wired "Service Window" dropped off and also the wireless 'Adventure Inn' dropped off.

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I plugged the MBP into the wireless 'Adventure Inn' that was showing a green light. But, it could not reach the internet. So, it was totally disconnected.


i plugged the MBP into the wired 'Service Window' that was showing a green light. It did reach the internet, despite not being seen by Airport Utility.

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i power cycled 'service window' and it came back up in Airport Utility. (same with the wireless 'adventure inn' just not showing in image)


maddening. i have not yet tried your other 'dead simple' (ha) suggestions.


i have looked at ubiquti that you referenced. i was impressed. i was probably more impressed with open-mesh.com from a price and simplicity angle. I was even on the pre-order list for months waiting on Eero.com. But, i really hoped, and still hope to make it work with Apple.

Jan 26, 2016 4:52 PM in response to iciclesteve

I would be very tempted to take one of your Gen5 AE.. downgrade it to 7.6.1 and swap the AC version AE with the older one.


Anyway my experience is that you will need to take sterner measures..


My "dead simple" approach is .. how should we say it.. time consuming and will take a while to implement.. it is easy to understand.


What I think needs to happen is to remove all the AUTO out of the system.. you need to control all the IP and of all the units.. so nothing is allowed to drift around.. the DNS is just not up to handling it.

Airport Utility: Device Not Found; have to power cycle

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