updating from 9.0.3 to 9.2.2

Hi, ateeeate -

Welcome to Apple's Discussions.

What prohibits you from being able to use the download updates? Do they not work? If so, please describe in what way do they not work (any messages, etc.).

As far as using a full-unstall CD, the latest one available is a retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD; to get to OS 9..2.2 you would still need to use the OS 9.2.2 download update - there is no retail (universal install) OS 9.2.2 CD.

What specific model iMac do you have? If you're not sure of the Apple designation for it, this Apple KBase article can help you identify it -
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=58669

In all likelihood there is a firmware update applicable to your model; it may be necessary to install that before the machine will accept later versions of OS 9. You can check for that here -
Article #86117 - Firmware Updates

Hi, ateeeate -

Both of the model series I mentioned include a blue-color iMac at 350MHz speed. Perhaps this Apple KBase article will help you differentiate which one you have -
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=58669

You can often get retail OS 9 Install CD's at sites like these -
http://store.yahoo.com/hardcoremac/index.html - Apple Reseller
http://www.applerescue.com/
http://www.welovemacs.com/software.html

EBay is another possibility.

Regardless of the source, be sure to get a retail OS 9 Install CD - those are white, with a large gold 9 on them; the retail OS 9 Install CD's have a universal installer; model-specific Install CD's do not.

Again, since you want to end up at OS 9.2.2, I'd recommend getting a retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD. When you are using a retail OS 9 Install CD, you do not need to install any intermediate versions of the OS - you can do a direct install of the new version from the CD.

Hi, ateeeate -

Although the firmware update page I linked to is written around OSX, it is the closest article available that lists all of the firmware updates applicable to various models - and so is a handy article to use. Some Macs need to have their firmware updated before they will accept the later OS 9 installs; others do not.

This article lists firmware updates specifically for iMac models, is not written with OSX in mind, and so may be easier to use -
Article #58174 - iMac: When to Install Available Updaters

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...am I being gently urged to go and buy a new computer?

Not by me. I don't work for Apple, nor own any of their stock; I'm a firm believer that it is not necessary to replace a Mac unless there is specific need to do so, such as to use hardware or software that is not usable on an older model.

Hi, ateeeate -

Am I right, that it might be easier to upgrade to system 10 instead? but that it would also require upgrading to new software - (even more expensive)??

Yes, on both counts.

An OSX install includes multiple language capability by default; extra languages can be removed (or not installed to begin with) by intention, but are included by default.

However, that does not include Classic - the OS 9 install used for Classic remains single-language, and would need appropriate version Language Kits in order to regain that flexability in use. Since the minimum version OS 9 that can be used as Classic is OS 9.1 (OS 9.2.1 and OS 9.2.2 provide better compatibility in the Classic mode), not much has been gained.

Unless, of course, you also replace any software which you need to use in Japanese with native OSX versions. If you do plan on replacing the machine with a newer one in the near future, then that may be money well spent - since newer machines boot only to OSX, and the newest ones which use Intel processors can not use Classic at all, then you would probably need to get such software anyway.

The cheapest (and probably simplest) way to get to where you want to be, using your current hardware, would be to get a retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD and install that OS - either on top of your existing OS 9.0.3 System Folder, or via a Clean Install (note that a Clean Install of OS 9 removes nothing) which would give you a new System Folder in the new OS version.
Article #58176 - Mac OS 8, Mac OS 9: Performing a Clean Installation

Since a retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD includes the ability to install Language Kits, you can do that at the time of installing the new OS itself. To do that, on the page with the Start button, locate and click the Customize button. In the new page, scroll down to Language Kits and checkmark it. To the right of that item a pulldown menu should become active - select Customized Installation from it. In the new window, select the Language Kit(s) you want to install. Okay your way back out to the main installer page, and click the Start button.

This will update (if you are installing on top of your existing OS 9.0.3, it will actually remove the old and install the new) Language Kits on the machine.

Once that is done, download and install the OS 9.2.2 download update - it should have no problem installing on top of the new OS 9.2.1 - be sure to download the language version that matches the native-language version of the new OS 9.2.1.

Hi, ateeeate -

A 350MHz model iMac in a blue color would be either a Blueberry iMac/iMac DV (Slot Loading) model, or an Indigo iMac (Summer 2000) model.

The problem would appear to be that you have one or more Language Kits installed. There is a fundamental change in Language Kit versions between OS 9.0.4 and earlier, and OS 9.1 and later - the earlier versions will not work with OS 9.1 and later. A full install retail OS 9.1 Install CD includes Language Kits, and will install on top of an OS which has earlier versions (the new will replace the old); however, the download updaters do not include any Language Kits, and the presence of any earlier ones will prohibit the install of the update - the updater's installer was not programmed to remove Language Kits.

There are a couple of solutions which will allow the use of the download update -

• Use an older OS 9 Install CD, preferrably one the same version as the currently installed OS. Run the installer on the CD; when you select the destination volume in the installer's window, a screen will appear. One of the items selectable in that window is to remove software - click that, step through the installer, and on the page with the Start button click the Customize button. Then select the Language Kits to be removed.

Alternatively, you can just run an uninstall for just Language Kits. To do that, insert the CD. Locate and open the Software Installers folder. In that, locate and open the Language Kits folder. In that folder, double-click the file named Install Language Kits. In the window that opens, in the upper left is a pulldown menu - it should display "Custom Install"; select "Custom Remove" in that menu. Then select the Language Kits that were installed previously in the list, and click the "Remove" button.

Once that is finished, restart and try the OS 9.1 download update.

• The other method usually works, but may leave some older fonts and perhaps keyboard layouts behind. Restart the machine, immediately press the Option and Spacebar keys, keep them held down until the desktop has fully loaded - doing this will prevent any Language Kits from being loaded. Open the System Folder and double-click the file System. In the window that opens will be three kinds of files - sound files (icon = document with a glyph of a speaker); keyboard layout files (icon = document with a glyph of a keyboard); and WorldScript files (icon = document with the glyph of a globe). Remove the WorldScript files to a holding folder on the desktop.

Then restart normally, and try the OS 9.1 download update.

If the installer still protests about Language Kits, you will need to hunt down and remove any added fonts and perhaps keyboard layout files (those will be some of the ones accessible in the System file).

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If you want to retain Language Kit capability, you will need to obtain a retail OS 9.1 or retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD - that will be the only way to re-install those kits in a version suitable for OS 9.1 and later (there are no downloads available for Language Kits).

...trying to start with 9.2.1 informs me that to go from 9.0.3 to 9.2 I must install 9.1 first.

Correct. The OS 9.2.2 download update requires OS 9.2.1 to be already installed, and the OS 9.2.1 download update requires that OS 9.1 be already installed. The OS 9.1 download update is designed to install on top of any earlier version of OS 9 (one without any Language Kits).

Using a retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD will eliminate the need for any download update except for the OS 9.2.2 one.

Additional note - OS 9 (all versions) comes in a base language version. A download update must match the specific language version of the installed OS, or it will not work. In particular, the International English download update will not install on top of a North American English version, or vice versa.

(continuing - ran out of time with the editor)

What I've been able to locate of retail system 9 CDs will cost about $150. Does that seem likely to you or am i making some kind of mistake?

That price is not out of line for some sources.

If you must have Japanese, then you will need to use a retail OS 9.1 or later Install CD in order to retain the ability to use Language Kits.

If you want to end up at OS 9.2.1 or OS 9.2.2, then do not get a retail OS 9.1 Install CD - get a retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD instead, from which you can do a direct install of OS 9.2.1 either as a Clean Install, or on top of any earlier version of OS 9; and then apply the OS 9.2.2 download update if desired.

The other alternative would be to locate a Japanese language version of a retail OS 9.1 or OS 9.2.1 Install CD, install that, then apply download updaters as needed. Note that using one of those disks will convert the base (native or built-in) langiage of the OS to Japanese; and that if you want to use English you would need to install that Language Kit (if available - I don't know whether there is one).

If you want the OS's menus to continue to be in English, then stick with an English retail OS 9.1 or 9.2.1 Install CD.

Hi -

I've got a question about Language Kits. I'm slimming down my G4, dumping any programs I don't use. Are there any potential drawbacks if I dump the Language Kit that came with OS9? Does OS X have it's own language kit or language capabilities? And lastly (I think), what exactly does a language kit do? Is it a translator or does it allow someone to type in another language on a qwerty keyboard?

Thanks in advance,

EC

Hi, East Coastin' -

Welcome to Apple's Discussions.

An install of OS 9 includes only one native language for the OS.

The Language Kits in OS 9 do one or two things, depending on which language kits (and any extras for them) are installed -

• They will provide additional alternate keyboard layouts (a remap of the keyboard) so that it matches the needs of other languages, and so that non-standard multi-stroke characters (if needed by the other language) become possible.

• Additional fonts may be included with a kit, so that the characters specific to that language are available.

In addition, some kits include extras such as language specific versions of SimpleText.

Language kits do not provide any translation capability; nor will they change the menus and messages for the OS or other programs.

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OSX, by default, will install all languages it is capable of handling. In this OS, switching to a different language will result in menus, etc., appearing in the new language. However, no translation capability is part of it.

This multi-language capability adds a lot to the size of the default install of OSX. Many folk who have no need for all the languages will reduce the installed set at the time of installation in order to conserve space.

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One of the Discussions regulars, Tom Gewecke, has put together a site dedicated to Macs and languages. You may find it quite informative on that subject; it can be accessed via this link -
Your Multilingual Mac