Apple center bricks my phone

Michael Black wrote:

love repair wrote:

I hope the irony is not lost on you that THIS EXACT post is about a user who had a minor issue with their phone (touch ID wasn't working) they went to get repair, and the "repair" ended up destroying the device. And then, they asked that shop to 'stand by their work' and were told that they are SOL. They are having difficulty seeking restitution. Of course this repair shop was Apple, Inc.

Actually, I don't know that it was Apple. The OP never identified their location, so "Apple repair center" could be Apple or an independent aAplle Authorized repair center. Or, as has often been the case in posts here, a place that told them it was an Apple authorized repair center but was in fact nothing of the sort.

The the bottom line is I don't know where the OP is, whom is the official point of contact for Apple iphone service there, or actually what company they took it to.

Fair enough. I got the impression that he was in another country. It sounds like you regulars on this forum have heard it all on here. The noobs are probably just too green on this forum to read between the lines, but you may be right on that.

love repair wrote:

I totally understand that, and you're right. Independent repair has a low barrier to entry and there are way too many shops out there with bad practices who simply don't know any better. But let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater. We are here to show consumers, and even the pizza techs, that we do know a heck of a lot about iPhone hardware problems, that we do use quality parts and stand by our craft, and that quality independent repair does exist.

Our goal is to inform and educate. No one should be choosing an independent repair provider based on price. Find an established business with excellent reviews, a solid warranty, and one that your friends and neighbors recommend. Anyone can pick up a paintbrush and hang a shingle saying "house painter' that doesn't mean there aren't great house painters out there. Let's work together to get some better answers on this forum so that the millions of consumers that can't feasibly go to Apple for every iPhone problem have some options!

The problem is that what you're doing here does nothing to inform and educate. Anyone can post here and say anything they like - it doesn't make it true, verifiable nor trustworthy. These forums have had posts from people claiming to be representative of universally reviled services and products (mackeeper comes to mind). That's the whole point - independent repair centers are impossible for any Apple device user or owner to evaluate until after their own personal experience with them. As independent repairers you have no accreditation of competency from the manufacturer nor are you bound by any level of service commitment that such accreditation requires from a company. It's purely your word, and I've learned to be far too much of a consumer skeptic to place much faith in that.

So yes, with my own money, I sure do throw the baby out with the bath water, as the whole tub is a toxic waste mess to be avoided at all costs from my personal perspective. Of course, as always, others need to make their own decisions.

A public web forum, populated mainly with complaints and people having a bad experience with a product is likely not a good place to change minds generally.

p.s. I hope you are aware, as you pursue your business, that many sharlitans exist out there - companies that blatantly or implicitly advertise themselves as "Apple Authorized" when they are no such thing at all. So be sure to be clear in your independence from Apple so your customers cannot claim to have been mis-led in any way.

ckuan wrote:

Well said Michael.

Especially now that the iPhones can be used for payment, a good and strong security construct (a finance industries requirement) would never allow any tampering. Error 53 is the result if parts do not match/paired, even IRs would not be of any help because they don't have the tools to overcome this.

The real security of the phone is the passcode. The Touch ID is only a convenience key for the passcode itself. The passcode protects the data in all phones, like mine, where we never set up Touch ID. In a phone with a missing/damaged fingerprint sensor, the Touch ID function is already disabled--just like in my iPhone. The security of my iPhone AND the security of a post-home button replacement phone is the same----the passcode is the protection.

The only difference between my iPhone and a post-home button replacement phone is that my phone still has the POTENTIAL for me to use the fingerprint sensor, and the other does not.

Apple takes the loss of the POTENTIAL for those phones to use Touch ID as a reason to brick the entire device. That is error 53.

And yes, IR can (and does) have the ability to solve error 53 in a minority of cases. We can repair torn home flexes on original buttons with microsoldering. We can swap the long flex--the highway between the fingerprint sensor and the board--if there is a microtear (as is likely for the OP here). We can solve problems such as a short in the line after water damage, or a bad connector on the home button or on the board. What we can't do is find your home button for you if you threw it away. 😟

love repair wrote:

No. Independent repair exists as a group of professionals specifically because it IS a big deal to replace an iPhone 6 screen with no experience.

Are you the chairman or spoke person for this group?

BTW, this is not a forum for your voice on how good you are.

In other words, this forum is not about you and your trade.

No. Error 53 is caused by Apple. While all quality repair shops, such as those posting on this forum this week never have to worry about error 53 because we fastidiously transfer the original home button, the fact is that devices prone to error 53 that no longer have the OEM fingerprint sensor are not in need of any repair. They work no differently than my personal iPhone 6---where I choose not to use Touch ID. They are no less secure than my iPhone.

Yes, Apple made the check when you update the iPhone iOS and found out that the iPhone was tampered with.

If you were the repairer, is it not your responsibility/warranty since you did the repairs even only after a while the error came up.

If it's not you what are you going to do about it? Throw him out of your group?

If Apple did the repair or replace in the same situation, they have the records and you'll get a new (refurbished) iPhone.

Anyway, repaired for me means it worked as before, if not, it was not repaired.

Whether you choose to use or not use the Touch ID is irrelevant.

It's not a coincidence. In the wake of error 53 coverage "independent repair is shady" I came here for intelligent discourse on repair option for Apple products. I was treated like crap and made a video about it, asking other quality independent shops to lend their voices to this forum to let the consumers judge for themselves what the best repair option is for them.

Yes, nothing but words, doing the talks is easy, is there a place where people who got scammed can report to, or best get solution?

For Apple services you can.

No one is advertising their business. Do you see a single link or reference to any specific business? If so, flag that post, that's not cool.

We are here to dispel the myth that independent repair is inherently shady and bad. We are here because we care about customers and are passionate about repair, and pointing customer to the right repair for them---which is sometimes a trip to the Apple store, and other times not.

You're right that there are a ton of "pizza techs" out there and we hope to educate the consumer about what quality repair looks like, and how to get the best value when trying to extend the lives of their devices.

It's only a myst when things turned out to be not true.

Again this is not a forum about your trade.

If an iPhone was rejected by Apple, wouldn't it be logical for the owner to find one of you for help?

If you guys are really that good and honest in your trade, there won't be any Error 53 would it?

Note: This is not meant to single out any one person, since I couldn't tell the different.

It appears as though you expect the independent repair people to resolve an issue created by Apple... If it's all about security why do 5s users not encounter error 53 as mentioned earlier, your passcode is really your security... These people are simply offering all information available instead of following apples footsteps and charging consumers for being of no help and then forcing them to buy a new device.

So you want accreditation for the independent repair shops?

Well, for me personally I was trained by Apple. I held title of Apple Expert and Apple Professional. You know what that means? I was trained by somebody how to repair iPhones, Macbooks and iMacs. The level of repairs that i currently do are beyond what people at the Apple store do. I did a ton of training with many other companies as well, and i did learn a lot. The problem is many other people took the same training and did not even care or take it seriously, yet they still got the same certificate of training.

Having a piece of paper means nothing at all. Since ALL of the companies do not provide training or a certification program like the Automotive industry has. There is no equivalent to ASE certified for mobile electronics. Not sure why the regulars here are so against 3rd part/independent repair shops fix a phone vs sending a car to whatever shop to get brakes or oil change done. That is a huge machine that costs a lot more money and can kill people. Heaven forbid a 3rd part shop help a customer in need to replace a broken screen on a PHONE. Some people are not close to an Apple store or the wait it is too long. I really think there should be a certification. In Dallas, TX there is a strip that has about 30 repair replaces in 3 miles. I bet not 1 of them would waste time on a certification. This would drive the bad repair shops out of business and legitimize the people that do things the right way.

Having a product as a company and no retail location for people to go and have the device serviced the same day or possibly next for a simple issue. That is a bad thing and the reason why 3rd party shops exist. Tell a business owner that he has to wait a few days to have his phone repaired. That is the issue, and it needs a solution.

Are you the chairman or spoke person for this group?

BTW, this is not a forum for your voice on how good you are.

In other words, this forum is not about you and your trade.

No. I am just a person who believes in repair, the environment, and helping people to extend the lives of their devices. I have a lot of knowledge of iPhone hardware defects, so I came here to share that knowledge with end users coming here to ask questions to help them troubleshoot their iPhone problems. I spend much of my life giving free advice to others about fixing phones and am well known elsewhere for this. I gave a few answers, and was insulted and criticized. I made folks that do quality independent repair aware of the fact that this forum has a lot of folks asking questions about solvable problems that are not getting information on how to solve these problems, and that the culture in here is quite anti-independent repair which is a shame for the consumer. Others felt the same way, so we have made an effort to provide information and let the consumers decide for themselves what the right repair is for them.ss

No one is advertising anything. We are simply trying to help users know what their options are. All of their options.

ckuan wrote:

Yes, Apple made the check when you update the iPhone iOS and found out that the iPhone was tampered with.

If you were the repairer, is it not your responsibility/warranty since you did the repairs even only after a while the error came up.

If it's not you what are you going to do about it? Throw him out of your group?

If Apple did the repair or replace in the same situation, they have the records and you'll get a new (refurbished) iPhone.

Anyway, repaired for me means it worked as before, if not, it was not repaired.

Whether you choose to use or not use the Touch ID is irrelevant.

Whether or not you choose to use TouchID is completely relevant. There is no "check to see if the phone is tampered with" The only check is to see if the original fingerprint sensor is working. A user who has paid Apple for the phone is allowed to not give a fig about the presence of absence of the fingerprint sensor. The lack of the fingerprint sensor does not inherently make the phone less secure because the passcode lock is the real key. I have the right to choose to rip out my home button and throw it away if I want to, it's my phone. Error 53 only exists because Apple overstepped the limits of their control of the phone. They do not have the right to reach through my ethernet cable and destroy my phone because of their vision of how it should work. Their control of the phone ended at the cash register.

With that being said, I agree, that if I damaged a touch ID for a customer's phone during a repair, then I owe them a new phone. Same thing if I broke an LCD while repairing a power button, I would owe them a new LCD. This is just common sense. We have known that the fingerprint sensor is married to the logic board since the iPhone 5s. Quality repair shops do not trigger error 53 and never have. The delicate home button has been considered sacrosanct for nearly two years.

Yes, nothing but words, doing the talks is easy, is there a place where people who got scammed can report to, or best get solution?

For Apple services you can.

The independent repair industry is no different than any other service industry. If your Asus computer from Best Buy needs a new SSD drive, do you go to a local computer shop, or do you insist that only the manufacturer's hands are qualified to touch the device? You read reviews, you talk to your neighbors, and you find a quality shop. If they break your device, and you're not happy with the shop's response you can leave bad reviews, and ultimately you can sue them for damages. Cell phone repair is no different than anything else. There are good shops and bad shops. This is not hard!
What is it about Apple hardware that makes it somehow sacred? Inside a phone is a battery, a bunch of screws, a board and connectors. It is a pile of legos, and is just as repairable as anything else!

And remember--THIS VERY POST is about a user who took a working phone to Apple and walked out with a brick AND was charged for it. The entire purpose of this post is a user saying "I am not happy with my service from Apple, and I can't get them to do anything about it!"

If an iPhone was rejected by Apple, wouldn't it be logical for the owner to find one of you for help?

Yes, and they do every day. Even for error 53----I have spent 8 hours in a row microsoldering 14 traces smaller than a human hair to knit back together two sides of a torn flex to clear error 53. And the whole time I was hating Apple for not just letting the poor user go on about their life and choose not to use stupid touch ID.

If you guys are really that good and honest in your trade, there won't be any Error 53 would it?

No one posting on this forum as a quality independent repair shop has ever caused error 53 through negligence. The primary cause of error 53 is a DIY repair attempt with damage to the home button, and pizza techs who didn't know any better and used convenience screens with aftermarket home buttons. Like you, I find that negligence disgusting. Because of the 5s, any competent tech should have been able to predict that it was in their customer's best interest to transfer their original home button. THIS is why these forums are important. Answering questions and sharing information could have prevented this.

Crittie wrote:

It appears as though you expect the independent repair people to resolve an issue created by Apple... If it's all about security why do 5s users not encounter error 53 as mentioned earlier, your passcode is really your security... These people are simply offering all information available instead of following apples footsteps and charging consumers for being of no help and then forcing them to buy a new device.

That is answered in this link:https://theoverspill.wordpress.com/2016/02/08/explaining-the-iphones-error53-and -why-it-puts-apple-between-conspiracy-an…

But you have to actually read it.

Jimaymay wrote:

So you want accreditation for the independent repair shops?

No, what I'd like, in an ideal world is integrity in the business. But by and large, I know, see and hear about more people being scammed and ripped off than satisfactorily served. So I will take my business where I prefer, and others are free to do as they wish. When my friends and family ask for my advice or opinion on iPhone or iPad repairs though, I recommend against independent cell phone repair shops, and will continue to do so.

Yes the author speculates that it's due to Applepay encryption. So if this is the case, only those Apple consumers that have an american Express card can even utilise this feature. I would imagine that's a minority of their consumers considering their devices are readily available for purchase worldwide.

and in response to Michael: I think we'd all appreciate that but really where is the integrity in ANY industry in this day and age? Are you as argumentive with a plumber fixing your toilet? It's extremely troubling when long gone are the days of honesty and integrity within the human race. However, your cynicism doesn't allow you to experience 'the real people' left that still hold these values (yes some of us still exist). Your preferences are your right which appears to be part of the debate here. I don't have a problem that you or anyone else prefer to steer clear of independent repairers, what does get under my skin is that a question is posed for everyone's opinion yet you all seem to believe that anyone else of a different opinion is giving wrong or incompetent advice. The poster will always make their own mind up after considering the information provided to them - as do you and I. A decent and honest repairer will inform the client of all information available and have no problem referring the client to Apple If the believe it's in their best interest. Let's face it, if the consumer is googling or posting in regards to an issue with an idevice, they are e already trying to avoid or have already spoken to Apple. There are also cases in which Apple is unable to help the client such as data recovery. You've no idea the feeling of saving 10gb worth of a mothers memories when no one else could or would help her, but hey we are all just dishonest scammers, so what would we know.

Crittie wrote:

It appears as though you expect Apple to resolve an issue created by the independent repair people...

Fixed that for you.

Wow! The level of maturity on this thread is clearly under par....

You certainly take your own liberties when interpreting peoples posts. I never once said that you or "all" are dishonest. All I said was that I have no way of knowing whether one repairer is or is not until after the fact. Hence I won't take the gamble with my own devices or money. And yes, I do indeed check out other service people (plumbers, mechanics, etc) thoroughly before agreeing to any work. But I have far better means of assessing their credibility than I do a local privately owned electronics repair shop or kiosk (And trades like pliumbers are regulated, so my recourse in the event I'm dissatisfied are greater too).

Crittie wrote:

However, your cynicism doesn't allow you to experience 'the real people' left that still hold these values (yes some of us still exist).

And thanks for illustrating my very point about posts in a public forum. You don't know me or a single thing about me. You know nothing about my life, my family, my friends, colleagues and acquaintances, my work, my recreation, my community involvement. Yet you feel free to make sweeping generalizations about me and apparently all the non-"real" people in my life.

AS I also said previously, anyone can post something here - doesn't make it "real" though.