Dvorak/Qwerty OSX capitan

dialabrain wrote:

Luis, are you running 10.11.3? Because if I'm using the Dvorak - Querty layout and hold the command key then try and type Q it just wants to quit whatever program I'm in.

That is what Command-Q is for, isn't it?! 😁 The question would be "which Q?" (as in the Q in Qwerty or the Q in Dvorak layout?)

Yes, I am running 10.11.3.

The keyboard acts as the screenshots of the Keyboard Viewer would have me expect. When the command key is held down, the layout automatically switches to Qwerty, so Command-Q works just as it does in the usual Qwerty layout (the Q being at the left next to the tab key).

(And so do Command-O, Command-A, Command-H, the ones I tried, and I would expect everything else).

As someone who (despite being Portuguese) prefers to use the US layout, I fail to see the point of this "hybrid" layout (after all, if one uses Dvorak for text why change it for commands?), but nevertheless it is working here as intended.

juang54 wrote:

Has anyone figured out how this keymapping is supposed to work? It sounds like such a great idea; but it advertises that the Command key changes the mapping to Qwerty... (for one keypress or until the next invocation of the command key?), what I find is that once I have selected the D/Q keymap (which resides in the menu bar since I installed it there), and touch the command key, the next thing I type comes out Dvorak. If I HOLD the command key, well then the operating system thinks that I'm holding down the command key and interprets the next keypress as a "Command plus whatever", only in Dvorak. Has anyone solved this riddle? Thanks! JG

I tried both Dvorak and Dvorak - Qwerty on my mac, and they both seem to work as advertised, as witnessed by the Keyboard Viewer and by actually trying a few commands in Safari and Mail.

The Dvorak - Qwerty automatically switches from Dvorak to Qwerty when the command key is held down. The Dvorak does no such switching.

Dvorak - Qwerty (no command key down):

Dvorak - Qwerty (command key down):

Hi juang54,

Welcome to Apple Support Communities.

It sounds like there's an issue changing input sources using the Command key on your MacBook Pro. The article below provides a lot of great information about switching input sources and it may explain why the issue is occurring because the process for selecting the next input source is Option-Command-Space bar.

OS X El Capitan: Use input sources to type in other languages

Switch between input sources

Click the Input menu in the menu bar, then choose an input source. If an input source is dimmed, the current app doesn’t support it.

You can also press Option-Command-Space bar to select the next input source in the menu, or Command-Space bar to select the previous input source. If Spotlight or a Finder window opens instead, you need to change the conflicting keyboard shortcuts.

Cheers.

juang54 wrote:

Well; that's just it: it doesn't work as it claims that it is supposed to. I am interested in it because I type using the Dvorak keymapping. If I go to use Finale, however, or any program which uses keyboard shortcuts I tend not to "touch type" them, because I have my other hand on a piano keyboard, or the number row (which designates what duration of note I wish to enter), and cannot spare the time to put both hands in Home position; in such cases the offered D/Q trick would be cool- it's just that it doesn't work...

Does anyone at apple monitor these forums?

You seem to be expecting to use a command without holding down the command key. I don't think that is how it works, and never was.

Quoted from atmac.com - note the last line, specifically the word "while":

There are four types of Dvorak layouts available with the Mac:

• Dvorak – The standard Dvorak layout
• Dvorak Left – Puts the most used keys under your left hand
• Dvorak Right – Puts the most used keys under your right hand
• Dvorak QWERTY ⌘ – Switches back to QWERTY while you hold down the command key

juang54 wrote:

If I HOLD the command key, well then the operating system thinks that I'm holding down the command key and interprets the next keypress as a "Command plus whatever", only in Dvorak.

I think I remember reading once that this is in fact the purpose of the Dvorak Qwerty layout: While typing Dvorak for text, you can switch to qwerty for the keyboard shortcuts (not the text). Why this might be useful I don't know.

I do know that it has always worked this way at least since 10.7.5.

Luis Sequeira1 wrote:

I fail to see the point of this "hybrid" layout (after all, if one uses Dvorak for text why change it for commands?)

I think it is often used by coders/programmers who want to switch to Dvorak but find it hard to change to that layout for certain shortcuts they need to use very frequently.

juang54 wrote:

Well; that's just it: it doesn't work as it claims that it is supposed to.

So in the top right corner of your screen in the "flag" menu it says Dvorak Qwerty ⌘, and when you are using a standard Apple app like TextEdit and do Command Q, the app does not quit?

I don't think I have heard of anyone else having that problem.

These are user to user help forums.

juang54 wrote:

If I invoke the D/Q mac keymap and then try, while IN FINALE, a Command, (Right, that's what Mac advertises!), control E, what I get is whatever mac understands as a Command E: it Does Not satisfy Finale's need for a Control E.

I think you are mistaken when you think Apple is talking about "a command". The layout is called Dvorak Qwerty ⌘. It is supposed to work for shortcuts that include the ⌘ (Command) key. Not for shortcuts that use the ⌃ (Control) key, the layout does not switch to qwerty when you press that.

I believe that your interpretation of how this keyboard layout works is not the correct one.

You are expecting the mac to use the command-key as a way to switch layouts, and act as if the command key is not held down. That is not how it works.

If you hold command and press "q" (where "q" is the first letter in qwerty layout) your application WILL quit, it will NOT type "q".

If you hold command-control-e that is what the application gets, NOT control-e; and so on and so forth.

Think about it: if it worked the way you describe the command key would simply be unavailable. Maybe you can create such a keyboard layout that works the way you want, but dvorak-qwerty does not work that way. Never has.

Yes, he wants the keyboard to switch to qwerty for all shortcuts. But it only does so for those which include the ⌘ (Command) key, as implied by the name of the layout. I suppose Apple could have made this layout also switch to qwerty for shortcuts when the ⌃ (Control) key is used on its own, but Apple apps rarely have such shortcuts, so they perhaps didn't think it was important.