wizard_chef

Q: File management - import duplications - Photos

I have two questions regarding Photos.

 

1. The first has to do with file management. As I understand the posts about this subject, if I choose to use a managed scenario, Photos actually imports my file its own library. Since I am using iCloud, the photos have been uploaded to iCloud and smaller images reside in the Photos library. The iPhotos library is doubly backed up, both on an external local drive and also in a cloud backup service.

 

If the above is true, is there any reason for me not to move my original images in the Pictures folder to a large thumb drive to free up around 150 GB of hard drive space?

 

2. Duplications - Although I thought I imported all of my folders of images into Photos, it appears some did not make it. I would like to just import the whole Pictures folder once again into Photos, but I don't want to create duplicates. How do I do this, or is duplication prevention on import built into Photos? I assume if I designate the Pictures folder, all subfolders are automatically included in the import. True?

iMac, OS X Mountain Lion (10.8.4)

Posted on Oct 10, 2016 1:38 PM

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Q: File management - import duplications - Photos

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  • by Old Toad,

    Old Toad Old Toad Oct 10, 2016 2:27 PM in response to wizard_chef
    Level 10 (141,773 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 10, 2016 2:27 PM in response to wizard_chef

    1 - The iCloud Photo Library does not work with a "referenced" library.  It must be a "managed" library. 

     

    2 - If you're running a "referenced" library and move either the library or the referenced image files to another volume you will break the link between the files and the library and irrevocably damage the library.  If you import a folder into the library that has already been imported Photos will alert you with this window:

    Photos002.jpg

     

     

    If you need additional space on your boot drive and you're running a "referenced" library you can do the following;

     

    1 - open the library, select all photos in the library and use the File âž™ Consolidate... menu option.

    Photos001.jpg

    This will copy the files into the library thus converting it to a "managed" library.

     

    2 -  Move it to an external HD, formatted OS X Extended (journaled) and run it from there.

    3 - After opening the library on the EHD and confirming it's working as it should delete the library and the original referenced image files from the boot drive. 

     

    Note:  you will still need another EHD to run Time Machine from to backup both your boot drive and the EHD with your Photos Library on it.

    OTsig.png

  • by wizard_chef,

    wizard_chef wizard_chef Oct 10, 2016 3:17 PM in response to Old Toad
    Level 1 (8 points)
    Desktops
    Oct 10, 2016 3:17 PM in response to Old Toad

    In my post I said I was running a managed library.

     

    Old Toad wrote:

     

    1 - The iCloud Photo Library does not work with a "referenced" library.  It must be a "managed" library.

     

    2 - If you're running a "referenced" library and move either the library or the referenced image files to another volume you will break the link between the files and the library and irrevocably damage the library.  If you import a folder into the library that has already been imported Photos will alert you with this window:

    Photos002.jpg

     

     

    If you need additional space on your boot drive and you're running a "referenced" library you can do the following;

     

    1 - open the library, select all photos in the library and use the File âž™ Consolidate... menu option.

    Photos001.jpg

    This will copy the files into the library thus converting it to a "managed" library.

     

    2 -  Move it to an external HD, formatted OS X Extended (journaled) and run it from there.

     

    When you say "it" do you mean the Photos Library.photoslibrary file AND all of the original (referenced?) images, or just the library file?

     

    3 - After opening the library on the EHD and confirming it's working as it should delete the library and the original referenced image files from the boot drive.

     

    Note:  you will still need another EHD to run Time Machine from to backup both your boot drive and the EHD with your Photos Library on it.

     

    That's a pain. I'm running out of USB ports, even with a USB extender. I do back up in the cloud with Carbonite so I may consider that as a safe choice and forego the extra disk drive just for photo backup. I have 50 years of pictures, and they can soak up a large chunk of any hard drive.

     

    Thanks for the advice.

    OTsig.png

  • by Old Toad,Solvedanswer

    Old Toad Old Toad Oct 10, 2016 6:28 PM in response to wizard_chef
    Level 10 (141,773 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 10, 2016 6:28 PM in response to wizard_chef

    I missed that fact.  Yes, you can move the original image files that are outside of the library to an EHD as a backup and delete them from the boot drive.

     

    As for the duplicate detection, since you're using the iCloud Photo Library and have Optimize Storage enabled for the library I can only assume that it will still detect duplicates.  I don't use the iCPL so have no first hand experience in that.

     

    However, I would suggest you not enable the Optimize Mac Storage option unless you find you do have storage problems on the boot drive.  That way you can instantly use any photo for printing, slideshows, export, etc. without having to download the full sized original from iCloud first.  Many experienced uses have reported that it was a big inconvenience for them. 

  • by LarryHN,

    LarryHN LarryHN Oct 10, 2016 8:00 PM in response to wizard_chef
    Level 10 (85,697 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 10, 2016 8:00 PM in response to wizard_chef

    1 - No on several counts - iCloud ins not a backup service, it is a syncing service and any change made on any connected device is made on iCloud.com  and all devices - you must have a local backup also

     

    And the size of the local copies depends on teh settings you choose - with down all originals to this computer all photos are the original with no reduction - with use optimized photos then the photos may be smaller if space is needed on the device

     

    And the managed option is really the only viable option - referenced libraries are strongly not recommended with Photos - Disadvantages of a Referenced Library in Photos

     

    2 - Photos does look for duplicates during import and when it finds one it gives you the option of importing the duplicate or not - as to importing gthe Pictures folder - not a good idea since by default your Photos library is in the pictures folder

     

    LN

  • by wizard_chef,

    wizard_chef wizard_chef Oct 11, 2016 6:31 AM in response to LarryHN
    Level 1 (8 points)
    Desktops
    Oct 11, 2016 6:31 AM in response to LarryHN

    LarryHN wrote:

     

    1 - No on several counts - iCloud ins not a backup service, it is a syncing service and any change made on any connected device is made on iCloud.com  and all devices - you must have a local backup also

     

     

    That is not the question I asked. I know iCloud is not a backup service. My question has to do with how Photos handles data. If Photos is actually making a copy of my Photos and is not referencing the original copy of the photo in my Pictures folder, I don't see why I need to keep BOTH the Photos library file (which would have a copy of my images there) AND the original image, which is in a subfolder of the Pictures folder on my Mac.

     

     

     

    And the size of the local copies depends on teh settings you choose - with down all originals to this computer all photos are the original with no reduction - with use optimized photos then the photos may be smaller if space is needed on the device

     

     

    This topic seems to be related to how iCloud articulates with Photos on the local disk, but I don't see how that impacts keeping a copy of the images in both the Photos library and also in subfolders of the Pictures folder.

     

     

     

    And the managed option is really the only viable option - referenced libraries are strongly not recommended with Photos - Disadvantages of a Referenced Library in Photos

     

    Not using referenced. Said that in my original post.

     

     

    2 - Photos does look for duplicates during import and when it finds one it gives you the option of importing the duplicate or not - as to importing gthe Pictures folder - not a good idea since by default your Photos library is in the pictures folder

     

    What is seems to do is offer you the option of importing the unduplicated images during an import, unless I am misinterpreting the display. I don't see any option to select duplicated images.

     

    Isn't there a clear explanation of how Photos does its image handling out there somewhere? I have spent a lot of time looking for that information, and I have yet to find a single source that is clear, concise, and understandable. I am getting the impression that Photos is for the casual user with a few hundred photos who doesn't want to deal with issues like image management of a large group of photographs.

     

    LN

  • by manivo,

    manivo manivo Oct 11, 2016 8:20 AM in response to LarryHN
    Level 1 (138 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 11, 2016 8:20 AM in response to LarryHN

    I do not know the rules used to identify potential duplicates.
    But recently I imported a lot of duplicates, accidentally:

     

    I had about 300 photos already imported to Photos 2.0.

    File names being like this: DSCN2915.JPG

     

    Then I found some more photos from the same event, on a backup.

    As I was not sure if they are already in Photos, I imported them.

    Photos told me they are all new. And I did not check, just say OK please import.

    Later I discovered that they are all duplicate.

    For some reason I do not know, this photos ended in .jpg and not .JPG (all caps).

    It seems that Photos thought the photos are new, because of jpg instead of JPG.

    For some of those duplicates, the photo in my Photos database was already rotated, while the photos from the later import where still to-be-rotated. Maybe this also made Photos think they are not the same.

     

    So I have re-check manually the photos of this event to remove the not recognized duplicates.

     

    Does anyone know the rules used by Photos for checking duplicates? (edit: sorry, I should open a separate post for this)

  • by LarryHN,

    LarryHN LarryHN Oct 11, 2016 8:42 AM in response to wizard_chef
    Level 10 (85,697 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 11, 2016 8:42 AM in response to wizard_chef

    I know iCloud is not a backup service.

    then why did you make this statment

    The iPhotos library is doubly backed up, both on an external local drive and also in a cloud backup service.

     

    and you never ask about two copies inside Photos adn outside of Photos - yoou ask about duplicate detection when importing into Photos

    This topic seems to be related to how iCloud articulates with Photos on the local disk, but I don't see how that impacts keeping a copy of the images in both the Photos library and also in subfolders of the Pictures folder.

    which is why the =answer relates to duplicates when importing

     

    I am getting the impression that Photos is for the casual user with a few hundred photos who doesn't want to deal with issues like image management of a large group of photographs.

    What ever - you seem to prefer mis-statements and aruging and do not really want help so I am out of here

     

    BTW I have a 20,000 photo library and an 80,000 photo library - Photos works great on both - several other expert users here have over 50,000 photo libraries

     

     

    Have a nice day

     

    LN

  • by wizard_chef,

    wizard_chef wizard_chef Oct 11, 2016 1:28 PM in response to LarryHN
    Level 1 (8 points)
    Desktops
    Oct 11, 2016 1:28 PM in response to LarryHN

    Larry, I DO appreciate help, but I get frustrated when people don't read the post. If you had read my reply to Old Toad's answer, you would have seen this statement:

     

    " I do back up in the cloud with Carbonite so I may consider that as a safe choice and forego the extra disk drive just for photo backup. "

     

    I never said that I depend on iCloud for backup, which I do not.

     

    Old Toad says it is safe to move the "original" photos that now sit in subfolders in Pictures onto an external drive and delete them from the boot drive. Do you agree this is a safe option (moving does not include, of course, the Photos library file)? My Photos library (and all original photos) is backed up in the cloud with Carbonite, and I will have a second copy of my older photos on an external drive. New photos will be imported to the Photos library. Photos for sharing or editing outside the Apple sharing system will be exported.

     

    Am I missing something with this plan? I don't want to lose my photographs.

    Ernie

  • by Old Toad,

    Old Toad Old Toad Oct 11, 2016 3:02 PM in response to wizard_chef
    Level 10 (141,773 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 11, 2016 3:02 PM in response to wizard_chef

    I missed the Carbonite sentence.  If you're backing up the Photos library package to Carbonite that will not return you a working library if you try to restore it.  The volume format used is not one that supports the complex ecosystem of files, permissions, links, etc. that make up a Photos Library.  For other files it would be OK. 

     

    If you don't have a local backup of the library on a volume formatted OS X Extended (journaled) you don't have a backup.

  • by wizard_chef,

    wizard_chef wizard_chef Oct 11, 2016 3:05 PM in response to Old Toad
    Level 1 (8 points)
    Desktops
    Oct 11, 2016 3:05 PM in response to Old Toad

    I've been using Time Machine for several years to do a redundant backup to a local terabyte drive. Now, whether or not the volume is formatted OS X Extended or not, I have no idea. How does one find out, or does Time Machine automatically do that?

  • by wizard_chef,

    wizard_chef wizard_chef Oct 11, 2016 3:09 PM in response to wizard_chef
    Level 1 (8 points)
    Desktops
    Oct 11, 2016 3:09 PM in response to wizard_chef

    I see. It's in the "Get Info" information. Yes, it is OS X Extended (Journaled).

  • by Old Toad,

    Old Toad Old Toad Oct 11, 2016 3:11 PM in response to wizard_chef
    Level 10 (141,773 points)
    Photos for Mac
    Oct 11, 2016 3:11 PM in response to wizard_chef

    Then you're covered.