Installing OS 9.1 or 9.2.1 or 9.2.2

Hello

I recently bought an older G4 733 Qucksilver, and it appears as though the dude that I bought it from, didn't do a proper erase (complete erase).

Reason I say that is that the computer still tries to boot into OS 9.2 but gets stuck in the process, then I have to do a force shut down.

I tried to boot off my full retail OS 9.1, but it won't boot - probably because the OEM OS was 9.2 to begin with, and so you can't go down to a lower level OS.

Ok that being said, I'd like to know what version of OS 9.2 it was originally running in? 9.2.1 OR 9.2.2 ???? Does it matter? Yes I think so ....

Why do I need OS 9 FULL and NOT Classic, because I have Tascam Automation software that will ONLY work in the original OS 9 environment.

Sooooo perhaps I should just pick up another install disc for 9.2.2 (even if the original OS was 9.2.1)?

And one last question, when Apple says that 9.2.1, and 9.2.2 contain improvements for running in Classic Mode, that doesn't imply that when you get to 9.2.2, you're really not installing the APPLE ORIGINAL OS 9 does it?
My intent here is to run OS 9.2 in it's original FULL Apple version. Classic will NOT work for what I'm trying to do ....

Thank you so much
Mike

Power Mac G5 Desktop (Single Processor 1.8) & G3 Blue & White 350 mhz OS 9.1, Mac OS X (10.4.6), G5: 4 Gigs RAM - ATI 9800 Pro AGP - #2 Internal HD's #3 Lacie Ext. HD's

Posted on Jan 8, 2007 7:23 AM

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Jan 8, 2007 9:13 AM in response to ENIGMACODE

Hi, Enigmacode. The 733MHz Digital Audio G4 (Model #M7681) was shipped with OS 9.1, and the 733MHz QuickSilver G4 (model #M8359) was shipped with 9.2 (later with 9.2.1). If you have the Digital Audio 733 or the QS 733 that was shipped with 9.2, a retail OS 9.2.1 CD will boot and install on it. If you have the late-production QS that was originally shipped with 9.2.1, Apple unfortunately hasn't made it clear whether that one can use a retail OS 9.2.1 installer or not. There is no retail OS 9.2.2 installer disc, so if a 9.2.1 disc won't suffice, the only source for a bootable OS 9 is an original disc that was shipped with the Mac model in question.

See this article, and pay special attention to the numbered notes at the end.
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Jan 8, 2007 9:39 AM in response to eww

Hi eww - Thanx so much for your reply

The model G4 Quick Silver 733 that I have is: M8493
Serial Number: XB1340Y1KSL

So unfortunately it appears as though this may be one of those later models that will NOT boot into a Full Retail OS 9.2 disc - Perhaps?

*But I want to get one point clarified:
I assume that ANY Replacement Hard Drive that I might buy, will NOT solve this problem. As you say, you may need the ORIGINAL (Gray Colored OEM OS 9.2 disc), that came with the computer to format ANY other Hard Drive as well - yes?

Thank you eww
Mike
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Jan 8, 2007 10:01 AM in response to ENIGMACODE

Hello again eww

I just called Apple, and gave them the serial Number and Model Number - they said that as long I use an OS 9.2 Full Retail Disc, (as you pointed out), the processor 'WILL' allow a Hard Drive to boot into it.

So with this understanding, I can either keep the existing HD and reformat it with OS 9.2, or replace it.

But again just to make sure (as you pointed out), there is NO such thing as an OS 9.2.2 Full Bootable Disc - correct?

As long as I use an OS 9.2.1 Full Retail Install Disc, this particular system should boot into that disc.

And as I understand you, the 9.2.2 part is in the form of an Update Patch - correct?

Thank You
Thank You

Mike
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Jan 8, 2007 10:06 AM in response to ENIGMACODE

Hi, Mike -

I assume that ANY Replacement Hard Drive that I might buy, will NOT solve this problem.

Correct. Changing a hard drive will not have any affect upon what OS the machine can boot to; that ability is a function of the hardware, specifically the main logic board and the processor on it.

Your QS 733MHz model, provided it was not one of the 'Education' models, should have no problem using a retail OS 9.2.1 Install CD. Even if it is one of the special-priced 'education' models, it probably can use that CD.

Basis - the CPU speed and form factor (M8493) cross-referenced with this Apple KBas article -
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=42739

It can also use the original Software Install install CD that came with it, which had a model-specific version of OS 9.2.

Either of those disks can be used to reinitialize and reformat the drive you now have, provided the drive is healthy. To do that, boot to the CD and run Drive Stup from the Utilities folder on the CD.
Using Drive Setup

When asked, select Mac OS Extended as the format.

Once the drive has been formatted, quit Drive Setup and (while still booted to the CD) install the OS - double-click the item Mac OS Install, follow the prompts, and accept a standard install.

Note - it is not advisable to post serial numbers in public forums such as these. However, there appears to be an error in the number you posted - I entered it on Apple's Support mainpage (lower right, About Your Support Coverage section), and it came back as 'no info available'.

Edit -

Confirming, there is no full-install OS 9.2.2 CD suitable for that model - all such CDs are model specific to the machine they shipped with; there has been no retail OS 9.2.2 Install CD released.

You can often get retail OS 9 Install CD's at sites like these -
http://store.yahoo.com/hardcoremac/index.html - Apple Reseller
http://www.welovemacs.com/software.html

EBay is another possibility.

Regardless of the source, be sure to get a retail Install CD - those are white, with a large gold 9 on them; the retail OS 9 Install CD's have a universal installer; model-specific Install CD's do not.

After installing OS 9.2.1, you can download and install the OS 9.2.2 download update from here -
Article #75186 - Mac OS 9.2.2 - Download and Info

Be sure to download the language version that matches the language version of the installed OS 9.2.1.
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Jan 8, 2007 10:27 AM in response to Don Archibald

Hey Don

Hey eww

YOU GUYS ARE THE BEST!

Yes I understand everything you said 🙂

Just one more thing to get your GREAT opinions:
The reason for my picking up a 2nd Power Mac 733 Quicksilver, (besides my G3 Blue/White which I'm going to sell), I'd like to run 2 OS's on 2 separate HD's in this Quicksilver. I was told by a few folks here, that yes it is possible. Here's my plan: First install 9.2.1 on the existing OEM 40 Gig 5400 RPM drive. Then pick up another 120 Gig (MAX), 7200 RPM 8 MB Cache 2nd internal Hard Drive, and format that drive with Tiger. I'll put this G4 Quicksilver in my recording studio to use it with an older Tascam Automation Program that will only run in OS 9. I'll beef up the RAM, and video card to an (ATI 9000 128 MB), so that I can also use Garage Band 3 in Tiger.

Quite an endeavor - but I like a challenge - sound like it will work?

Thank you so much
Mike
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Jan 8, 2007 10:41 AM in response to ENIGMACODE

Hi, Mike -

Your plan sounds quite workable.

Your QS 733MHz model is already pre-equipped to accept a second internal hard drive. Make sure it is ATA (or PATA), and not SATA.

The only additional item you may need to get is a set of four screws to mount the drive in the drive sled which should already be in the machine. A small package of those probably came with the machine, but were probably lost (not unusual). They are quite standard - most computer repair shops will sell you a few for not much, maybe even give them to you. Or, you can look for short (1/2 inch or so) flat-head 6/32 machine screws at a hardware store. I'd try a computer repair place first.

You can set the jumpers on the second drive to Slave, with the jumpers on the first one set to Master - or vice versa. Which is set to which is mostly not important - those are just addresses to a Mac, and confer no priority. Do not use Cable Select jumper settings; Macs earlier than the MDD models do not handle CS well.
Power Macintosh G3 and G4: IDE Master and Slave Support and Configuration

Exception to jumpering - if the machine is configured as the Target machine in a Firewire Target Disk Mode setup with another Mac, only the hard drive jumpered as Master will appear on the Host machine's desktop.
Article #58583 - Firewire Target Disk Mode

When formatting the second drive using OSX's Disk Utility, be sure to select the option to install OS 9 drivers. If that is not done, then when the machine is booted to any OS 9 it will not be able to 'see' that drive.

One of the (several) advantages to having each OS on its own drive is that you can use the other drive as a full-time on-line backup drive for each.
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Jan 8, 2007 3:46 PM in response to Don Archibald

Hey Don I gotta tell ya, you have been extremely helpful!

One thing I've learned here at the Forums, is that very knowledgable people (although admirably so), may not always possess the ability to transfer that knowledge in a thoughtful, patient manner.

"When formatting the second drive using OSX's Disk Utility, be sure to select the option to install OS 9 drivers. If that is not done, then when the machine is booted to any OS 9 it will not be able to 'see' that drive"

Ok let me get this clear; so then even though, I will be installing OSX in it's 'own' separate Hard Drive, I will still need to choose the option to install OS 9 drivers?Even though, (I assume), OS 9.2 should have it's own drivers? Perhaps I'm missing something?

'ATA' for that other Hard Drive - yes that's right. And as I understand it, this system (733 Quicksilver), will only see a 120 Gig Maximum size HD. That's why I already have a 120 Gig Seagate picked out.

And as I also understand it, an improved Video Card should probably NOT exceed something like an AGP ATI 9000 128MB Mac Edition.

Like this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ATI-Radeon-9000-Pro-Mac-Edition-128MB-DDR-in-a-Box_W0QQitemZ 280067188860

*I belive there might be issues with faster newer AGP Video Cards.

Thanx again Don - I'll be checking back
Mike
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Jan 8, 2007 3:59 PM in response to ENIGMACODE

Hi, Mike -

"When formatting the second drive using OSX's Disk Utility, be sure to select the option to install OS 9 drivers. If that is not done, then when the machine is booted to any OS 9 it will not be able to 'see' that drive"

Ok let me get this clear; so then even though, I will be installing OSX in it's 'own' separate Hard Drive, I will still need to choose the option to install OS 9 drivers?
Even though, (I assume), OS 9.2 should have it's own drivers?


The OS 9 drivers that OSX's Disk Utility needs to be instructed to install are drivers that are placed onto the hard drive itself. The presence of those drivers determines whether OS 9 will be able to mount the drive (make its icon visible on the desktop) and thus be able to have read/write access to it.

OS 9's Drive Setup installs drivers (ones which OSX is able to use without any difficulty) onto the drive automatically - if you've ever used Drive Setup, you may recall that one of the options in its Functions menu is to Update Drivers. In addition, an OS 9 Install usually includes an (attempt to) update the drivers on the hard drive as part of the standard install process, unless that function is intentionally disabled.

OSX's Disk Utility does not always install the OS 9 drivers by default (which is one of the things that I find very odd in the way that utility was programmed), and so, if it is desired that the drive be accessible when the machine is booted to OS 9, it is necessary to ensure that those drivers are installed.

This Apple KBase article discusses that briefly -
Article #106849 - Disk Is Available in Mac OS X But Not in Mac OS 9

***

And as I understand it, this system (733 Quicksilver), will only see a 120 Gig Maximum size HD.

Yes. Actually, the limit is 128GB, but the closest standard drive size is 120GB. Drives larger than 128GB will appear as being only 128GB. This is a hardware limit of the buillt-in controller for the ATA bus.

It can be got around by installing an appropriate PCI card to which larger drives can be connected.
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Jan 8, 2007 7:27 PM in response to Don Archibald

...and so, if it is desired that the drive be accessible when the machine is booted to OS 9...


This will generally be the case on any machine that has a bootable OS 9 on one drive and OS X on another — because to be able to switch Startup Disk settings from OS 9 to OS X, OS 9 must be able to access the other drive and see OS X on it. If the OS X drive didn't have OS 9 drivers installed, OS 9 wouldn't see anything on it.
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Jan 8, 2007 7:52 PM in response to eww

eww & Don thanx so much!

Yes I understood everything you guys said 🙂

"And as I also understand it, an improved Video Card should probably NOT exceed something like an AGP ATI 9000 128MB Mac Edition.

Like this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ATI-Radeon-9000-Pro-Mac-Edition-128MB-DDR-in-a-Box_W0QQitemZ 280067188860

*I belive there might be issues with faster newer AGP Video Cards with this system (G4 733 Quicksilver)."

You guys agree?

Thanx again
Mike
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Installing OS 9.1 or 9.2.1 or 9.2.2

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