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Using Apple Pay, why the merchant gets my credit card number ?

Using Apple Pay, why the merchant gets my credit card number ?

I am using exclusively Apple Pay when I can, because the merchant don't get the credit card number. The number he has can't be used. Especially great when the merchant get hacked and hackers monitors the transactions.
That's the power of Apple Pay and why I use it!

If you are using Lyft on your iPhone and paying with Apple Pay, I am inviting you to check your Ride History, and look at the method of payment used. It shows my VISA, with the 4 ending digits. A number I never provided to Lyft.

If you check the receipt on your email, it shows Apple Pay (Visa) as the method of payment.

How is it even possible for Lyft to get my real credit card member if I'm using Apple Pay?

What that means ? Payments done through apps on our iPhone using Apple Pay don't really use Apple Pay ? Apps have the possibility to get our credit card number ?
So, if I understand correctly, the credit card number is not stored securely... Am I right ?

Thanks for all the explication you can provide on how Lyft got my credit card number.

When I showed the issue to the Apple Store, they couldn't believe it. But I showed them. No one had an answer. Apple Pay is supposed to hide your credit card number. That's what they confirmed.

PS
I don't know if Uber get it too, but at least, they show everywhere that the method of payment is Apple Pay.

iPhone 6s, iOS 11.1, Apple Pay

Posted on Nov 18, 2017 5:23 PM

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Posted on Nov 18, 2017 6:01 PM

Check the answer from IdrisSeabright.


Using Apple Pay is a safety to not compromise your credit card number.

When you use Apple Pay in a store, on the printed receipt it shows a Visa with 4 digits, the one of your device. Check into your Apple Pay, when you open your wallet, press on the credit card, and then, the little "i" in a circle on the bottom right. Check then the info, and you will find the Device Account Number, which is the number supposed to be transfered to the merchant. And it's also the 4 digits I'm seeing on receipts.


In order to use Apple Pay with your credit card, the emitting bank of your card must have an agreement with Apple. Not every card works with Apple Pay.

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Nov 18, 2017 6:01 PM in response to Kurt Lang

Check the answer from IdrisSeabright.


Using Apple Pay is a safety to not compromise your credit card number.

When you use Apple Pay in a store, on the printed receipt it shows a Visa with 4 digits, the one of your device. Check into your Apple Pay, when you open your wallet, press on the credit card, and then, the little "i" in a circle on the bottom right. Check then the info, and you will find the Device Account Number, which is the number supposed to be transfered to the merchant. And it's also the 4 digits I'm seeing on receipts.


In order to use Apple Pay with your credit card, the emitting bank of your card must have an agreement with Apple. Not every card works with Apple Pay.

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Nov 19, 2017 9:39 AM in response to Michou69

Hi


When you pay using Apple Pay, whether in a store, within an app or online, your Device Account Number and a one-time, transaction-specific, dynamic security code are sent by Apple to your bank via their payment network.


Your card number is not stored by Apple Pay and it is never sent by Apple when you make a payment using Apple Pay.


What happens after that - when a payment request is responded to by a card issuer, via their payment network, with information sent back to the merchant - may vary.


Some users have previously reported that the last four digits of their actual card number are included on some receipts. For example: when using Apple Pay with Lyft, with Square card readers and at some Subway (food) branches.


MBNA and some other banks also advise, for example, that, when using Apple Pay, Mastercard must provide your actual card number to certain transit merchants in order to process real-time decisions:


Pay with MBNA using Apple Pay | MBNA


If you would prefer that Lyft did not include the last four digits of your actual number on your receipts, then you may wish to let them know.


As Apple does not reference this information within their support documentation for users, you may also wish to:


Either send feedback to Apple:


Or, if you would prefer to discuss the matter, contact Apple Support:

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Nov 19, 2017 11:00 AM in response to IdrisSeabright

Hi IdrisSeabright,

Thanks confirming that the merchant should never see the credit card number.
As you can see in my answer to Lawrence Finch, I never gave them my new credit card number.

So, I will follow your advice and contact the Customer Support to see what they can say about it.

I will post their answer here.

Thanks.

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Nov 18, 2017 5:58 PM in response to Lawrence Finch

That's what I thought.

My first use with Lyft was using my credit card.

But the number got compromised, and I received a new credit card with a new number.

I deleted the old one from Lyft and never provided the new one.

So, they got the number through Apple Pay somehow.

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Nov 18, 2017 5:39 PM in response to Michou69

The merchant shouldn't be seeing your card number:


The safer way to pay.

When you make a purchase, Apple Pay uses a device-specific number and unique transaction code. So your card number is never stored on your device or on Apple servers, and when you pay, your card numbers are never shared by Apple with merchants.

Apple Pay - Apple


I would contact Customer Support. Use the link at the top right of every page of these forums.


Are you sure you haven't entered a credit card in the Lyft app? Check under Payment in the Lyft app.

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Nov 18, 2017 5:33 PM in response to Michou69

Er, that's the entire method of how Apple Pay works. To set it up, you use your iPhone to take a picture of the credit card you want Apple Pay to use. When that's set up and you go to a store, swiping your iPhone transfers that credit card info to the merchant so they can get paid, and the charge goes to the credit card you stored.


You didn't think Apple Pay meant Apple was paying the bill, and then Apple billing you, did you?


As far as "hiding the info", it is. Your security code on the card isn't on the receipt. Nor is the expiration date. The last four numbers being on the receipt is common practice. It's for your convenience so you can track, and remember what bills were paid with which card. It's only one fourth of a credit card number. Nowhere near enough information to help a crook. First they'd have to try up to 10 to the 12 power of numbers plus the last known four, and 1000 possible security codes. It would only take about a trillion years to try every possible combination.

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Nov 18, 2017 6:08 PM in response to Michou69

Possibly. But credit card providers offer a service to approved vendors who have stored cards; if a card is reissued the vendor can opt to receive the updated credit card information.


I think you should follow up with Apple Pay as it could very well be a loophole, but there are other explanations.

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Nov 19, 2017 8:06 AM in response to Michou69

Michou69 wrote:


But the number got compromised, and I received a new credit card with a new number.

I deleted the old one from Lyft and never provided the new one.

Does the new one actualy have a different last four? The last four of my primary credit card have been very close over, I think, three different numbers. Credit card numbers aren't just random strings. Certain sections actually mean certain things (just like Social Security numbers). That's how websites can recognize the type of card you've entered and whether it's a valid number.


I don't know exactly how the numbers are assigned but I think it might be possible.

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Nov 19, 2017 10:01 AM in response to Michou69

Michou69 wrote:


Using Apple Pay, why the merchant gets my credit card number ?


There's less here than meets the eye. Open your wallet app, and examine the cards in it. The last 4 digits of your actual card will appear on the card images. It was true for all of my 3 cards that I use for Apple Pay. I suspect it is there so you can identify the card that was used. It isn't the full card number, only the last 4 digits.

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Nov 19, 2017 10:19 AM in response to Lawrence Finch

Lawrence Finch wrote:


Michou69 wrote:


Using Apple Pay, why the merchant gets my credit card number ?


There's less here than meets the eye. Open your wallet app, and examine the cards in it. The last 4 digits of your actual card will appear on the card images. It was true for all of my 3 cards that I use for Apple Pay. I suspect it is there so you can identify the card that was used. It isn't the full card number, only the last 4 digits.


Lawrence: that is normal and is to help users - on their own devices - to manage and distinguish between their payment cards, including selecting between them before making a payment.


However, a user would not expect, under any of Apple's documentation, that the same information (even those 4 digits) would either be shared with a merchant or included on a receipt issued by a merchant.


Documentation instead specifically states that the last few digits of the Device Account Number (the unique number / virtual card number that has been assigned to the combination of that payment card and that device) will be shown on receipts.


Hence Michou69's question.

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Nov 19, 2017 10:35 AM in response to Lawrence Finch

Which is why I have suggested contacting Apple.


Others have reported the same experience and it is understandable if they are concerned.


I have also seen it reported elsewhere that this occurs with cards from some issuers, but not others (including one where it used to do so, but now doesn't).

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Using Apple Pay, why the merchant gets my credit card number ?

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