Have 802.11g device that can’t see AirPort Extreme router?

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fjoyner Author

Level 1

13 points

Have 802.11g device that can’t see AirPort Extreme router?

Can’t get my hot tubs wifi 802.11g to see and connect to my router/time capsule.

AirPort Express 802.11N (2nd generation)

Posted on Dec 17, 2017 12:23 AM

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Answer 1

Dec 17, 2017 7:23 AM in response to fjoyner

Can other wireless devices "see" and connect to the AirPort?

If yes, this tells you that the AirPort Extreme is working correctly. In addition, there are no settings on an AirPort wireless router that will tell or allow another device to "see" the AirPort, since the AirPort broadcasts the same signal to all wireless devices.

In other words, it is up to a wireless device to see and connect to the AirPort.

Check with the support folks at the hot tub for suggestions. 802.11g is ancient technology, and it is very possible that the 802.11g device will not be able to see and connect to a modern router with modern wireless security settings.

If you have the time, we can go through a few more checks......like turning off the wireless security on the AirPort to see if the hot tub can connect that way, but even if it might, you would never want to run your wireless network permanently without using wireless security.

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Answer 2

Tesserax

Level 10

148,345 points

Dec 17, 2017 9:06 AM in response to fjoyner

In addition to Bob's comments, more likely the hot tub's wireless may only be capable of connecting to either an unsecured or, to a WEP-secured Wi-Fi network ... and the latter being the reason it cannot connect. The WEP security level is basically useless and the newer AirPort base stations do not support this.

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Answer 3

fjoyner Author

Level 1

13 points

Dec 17, 2017 4:01 PM in response to Bob Timmons

Thanks for your reply. The hot tub sets up similarly to other 'home' devices in that you set your iPhone to the tub's wifi, then add your network to it with your SSID and PW (for WPA/WPA2 - which it says it supports), then when you change your iPhone back to your home network, the tub's software should work. Unlike other devices (smart switches, etc), the tub's software doesn't seem to 'find' the router and accept the SSID/PW I've input.

My actual point in asking, other than my having missed anything obvious, is whether the Airport Extreme could be locked in a mode such that it doesn't accept any devices other than 802.11acn, for example. Or, IOW, will the AirPort automatically recognize legacy devices like 'g' and 'b' and so forth?

The company isn't going to update their hardware just for me to a more current standard, so I pretty much have to deal with what is. And I have relocated the router to within only a few feet of the tub, so it wouldn't seem to be a distance problem.

So, could 'g' devices be locked out? The AirPort seems to be so "user friendly" that finding out exactly what its settings are is difficult on more than just a very simplistic level.

Thank you again.

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Answer 4

fjoyner Author

Level 1

13 points

Dec 17, 2017 4:03 PM in response to Tesserax

Thanks, but like a lot of 'home' devices, you connect to it unsecurely, then input your SSID and PW for WPA/WPA2 and then it should 'find' the home network and work from there. It's just not happening, so I was wondering if 'g' devices might somehow be locked out by software settings in the AirPort.

Thanks again....

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Answer 5

Dec 17, 2017 5:56 PM in response to fjoyner

whether the Airport Extreme could be locked in a mode such that it doesn't accept any devices other than 802.11acn, for example

No

Or, IOW, will the AirPort automatically recognize legacy devices like 'g' and 'b' and so forth?

The Airport will recognize devices that connect using the "ac", "n", "g", or "b" protocols that are using WPA/WPA2 Personal or WPA2 Personal wireless security.

could 'g' devices be locked out?

Not unless your "g" device has some unusual special requirement that has not been mentioned yet. For example the tub might require that the wireless network name not exceed 8 characters, or not use capital characters. Ask the support folks at the tub what exactly the requirements might be for their device to connect.

The more specifics that we have, the better chance we will have to find some combination that might work.

As I noted....if you have the time.....change the AirPort router to "No Security" temporarily as a test to see if the tub will connect that way. If it won't, then it will never connect with any kind of wireless security enabled, and we are basically stuck with no where to go.

A year or two ago, I tried to connect a wireless thermostat to the AirPort network here. It would never connect, even with no wireless security enabled. Another brand of thermostat connected on the first try.

On the other hand, if the tub will connect during your test with no wireless security on the network, then that at least narrows things down to wireless security compatibility issue. But, there are only two wireless settings on the AirPort....current WPA2 Personal, and older WPA/WPA2 Personal settings.

The AirPort seems to be so "user friendly" that finding out exactly what its settings are is difficult

You know that the AirPort will handle "ac", "n", "g",and "b" wireless signals. Your next step would be to find out whether the tub will connect with no wireless security. If you decide to perform that test, please report back on your findings.

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Answer 6

fjoyner Author

Level 1

13 points

Dec 18, 2017 10:52 AM in response to fjoyner

I have 2 AirPort Time Capsules, one (#1) does DHCP and NAT and the other (#2) is in bridge mode to cover the full home. I set the #1 to no security. The choices on the hot tub software are None/WEP/WPA/WPS. I chose None and then it would not let me proceed without entering both the SSID -and- the PW, which of course there was not one at that time. I'm starting to think the tub software is just archaic and may not be of any use to me at all. I can only use it if I set the iPhone to the tub's router and use it locally only. What a pain. Thanks for trying to help all.

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Answer 7

Dec 18, 2017 11:03 AM in response to fjoyner

I'm starting to think the tub software is just archaic and may not be of any use to me at all.

I think I mentioned that the tub was using ancient wireless way back at the beginning of this thread, but I do have a few more ideas if you have the time.

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Answer 8

fjoyner Author

Level 1

13 points

Dec 18, 2017 12:30 PM in response to Bob Timmons

All the time in the world. Since it at least offered WPA I had hoped it would just 'work' like the smart plugs and switches, but they do poll and tell you what wifi's are available and you just choose yours and then add the PW. This software doesn't do that. My normal SSID had an apostrophe and both lower and uppercase letters in it. Surely that wouldn't be enough to have it not work?

Thanks again.....Monday is problem solving day for me. I hope.

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Answer 9

Dec 18, 2017 1:06 PM in response to fjoyner

My normal SSID had an apostrophe and both lower and uppercase letters in it. Surely that wouldn't be enough to have it not work?

It sure would. Finicky wireless devices demand a very simple type of network. That's why we kept asking about what the requirements of the tub might be.

Make sure that you have separate names for the 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz SSID

Point the tub at the 2.4 GHz network name

Wireless name uses only normal letters and numbers.......no special characters

Wireless name is short......no more than 10-12 characters. Less is better

No blank spaces in the wireless network name

Try things first with no wireless security. If the tub will still not connect it likely never will.

If the tub connects using no security, then try WPA/WPA2 Personal security.

If the tub connects using WPA/WPA2 Personal, then try WPA2 Personal.

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Answer 10

fjoyner Author

Level 1

13 points

Dec 18, 2017 1:32 PM in response to Bob Timmons

I would have gladly shared the wifi/tub requirements, but except on just a very fundamental level, they offer very little information and there is no contact point for support besides the canned instructions on their website. They plan on never hearing from anyone. It's a bundled deal, the person that sells the hot tub doesn't have a clue about the wifi and the people that put the tub together in AZ just plug in the 3rd party wifi and call it good. You're kind of on your own it would appear. Everyone points their finger the other way. The lady that owns the hot tub store (and has for decades - and does good business) told us the other day that she doesn't have wifi at home. 🙂

Ok, I will simplify the name....I was fearing having to rename the network. I'll have to re-install every home device and there are....well, quite a few. Price of success, if it works out that way. I will try the tub alone first of course.

Oh, I will have to rename both routers, yes? I suppose they have to match....the main and the other one in bridge mode.

BTW, every device of any sort that I've used for at least the past 10 years has not balked at the SSID I've been using. That's another reason that wasn't my first point of attack. Maybe I'll name it boring123. 🙂 stupidhottub might work, too, but that's pushing it with 12 characters.

Thanks.

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Answer 11

fjoyner Author

Level 1

13 points

Dec 18, 2017 2:13 PM in response to fjoyner

Success to a point. Still could not try it OPEN since it keeps requesting a PW regardless. So, I now have it working in WPA/WPA2 Personal with a minimalist SSID, both routers using the same SSID and the 5GHz side named differently.

I found out the hard way that I can only use 8 characters for a PW. It's been so long since I used that protocol that I forgot.

Thanks for sticking with me.....I will move on to WPA2 Personal.

What a goat rope this has been!!!

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