How do you copy over from one phone to another (both active) without the bloody iPhone backup password that no-one knows!!!

If you cannot remember the backup password, you will not be able to use that backup. The password is embedded into the file. You will have to delete the backup that is password protected, and restore the device to clear that information from the iPhone. See this about dealing with encrypted backups. About encrypted backups in iTunes - Apple Support

If this is an iTunes backup and you've forgotten the password, you cannot reset it: About encrypted backups in iTunes - Apple Support

However, you always have the option to backup to iCloud. This way you can transfer your data between both devices: How to back up your iPhone, iPad, and iPod touch - Apple Support

"There is no way to recover your information or turn off Encrypt Backup if you lose or forget the password."

About encrypted backups in iTunes - Apple Support

Here is the general answer - there are 3 ways if both phones have iOS 11: Transfer content from an iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch to a new device - Apple Support

If no one knows the password then you can't. All of that data is lost without the password.