iCal and Time Zones

We didn't realize this, but there is a serious major gigantic problem with iCal's handling of time zones. You can try this out yourself on your own computer.

There are dozens of people complaining about this on the Apple Discussion Forums and on the Internet, and we didn't even realize it was a problem until we start traveling through multiple time zones ourselves. Regardless of whether or not you turn on time zone support in iCal, ALL THE APPOINTMENTS on your iCal calendar WILL SHIFT TIMES based on what time zone you're currently in (based on the date & time system preference that you set).

NOBODY in the world wants this to happen... nobody wants their calendar appointments to SHIFT ON THEIR CALENDAR! If you book a lunch appointment in New York City next week for 12 noon, you ALWAYS want this appointment to show up as 12 noon on your calendar -- NOT AN "ADJUSTED TIME" based on where you are located now.

For example, if you have a lunch appointment next week at 12pm in New York City, but you are currently in San Francisco when you set the appointment, the appointment will SHIFT THE TIME OF THE APPOINTMENT TO 3pm WHEN YOU ARE IN NEW YORK CITY (b/c you've adjusted your date/time system preference to New York). It gets even WORSE if you turn ON time zone support and start choosing a particular time zone in iCal's appointment details. If you do that, the lunch appointment looks like it's taking place IN THE MORNING at 9am while you're physically working on your computer in San Francisco, and then THE APPOINTMENT SHIFTS to the APPROPRIATE TIME when you're physically in New York City. If you look at your appointments for Saturday, you want to see your 12 noon lunch listed, not a 9am lunch listed.

This is truly insane. No other calendar program on the entire market, including Google's much superior calendar, acts like this. When you're in San Francisco and you look at your calendar for Saturday, you don't want to see TIME-ADJUSTED APPOINTMENTS FOR WHERE YOU ARE CURRENTLY PHYSICALLY SITTING. The lunch isn't taking place at 9am in New York City, it's taking place at 12pm in New York City. You want to see the APPROPRIATE TIME OF THE EVENT, which is 12 noon. You don't want to see 9am, just because you happen to be in San Francisco at the current time.

The *ONLY SOLUTION* for this is to turn on time zone support and then set each & every event to a "FLOATING EVENT", but there is ABSOLUTELY NO way in iCal to set "FLOATING EVENT" as the DEFAULT for ALL future appointments, and there's no way to go back and change all previous appointments to floating events. So you have to MANUALLY go through thousands of previous appointments and change EACH & EVERY ONE OF THEM to a floating event... and remember to take extra time out of your day to change all future events to floating events. But it gets even worse -- if you switch your events to floating events, they do NOT show up in the proper time on the MobileMe's website -- they still show up based on the time of the time zone in which you created the events.

The only other solution for this, which is much less desirable, is to go into your date & time system preference and UNCHECK THE OPTION to "set date & time automatically", choose ONE PERMANENT TIME ZONE FOR YOURSELF THAT WILL **NEVER CHANGE** INTO THE FUTURE, and MANUALLY adjust your clock in the date/time system preference whenever you travel across time zones. Note that this solution requires you to choose ONE PERMANENT TIME ZONE FOR YOURSELF FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE, and you must MANUALLY change the clock in the date & time system preference FOREVER.

Hardly a solution.

Apple needs to fix this IMMEDIATELY so that ALL events are floating events ALL the time by default! Or at least give users the option to CHOOSE this as the default. Every other calendar program on the market defaults to FLOATING EVENTS. But not iCal. This is truly crazy beyond belief.

This is one really annoying bug -- and ONLY iCal has this problem.

Thanks,
Scott

15" 2.33 GHz MacBook Pro Core 2 Duo, 2 GB RAM, Mac OS X (10.5.4)

Posted on Sep 26, 2008 9:11 AM

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Question marked as Top-ranking reply

Posted on Nov 30, 2008 10:27 AM

I am sorry, but I disagree with your analysis of iCal time zone functionality as "insane".

To have the world entirely you-centric is straightforward enough - don't use time zones at all: simply set the Time Zone in System Preferences to your home city; but when you move, leave this alone and change the time not the time zone. Turn off time zone support in iCal and never accept an invitation from someone who is in a different time zone.

Contrary to your assertion that no other calendar does this, most other calendars, including Google Calendar, work in precisely the same way as iCal and OS X because they are following the iCalendar standard. (Open Google Calendar, choose Settings and change "Your current time zone", and you'll see that the event times change. This is the equivalent to changing your location in OS X)

I work with people all over the world who schedule phone conferences etc in their local time. This has to be converted to my time zone for me to know what time that meeting's happening. If I move to another time zone before the meeting happens, I absolutely have to see the meeting time move as well - otherwise I will miss it. As an example, a colleague in San Francisco sets a meeting for Dec 12th at 9am. I am now in London, so this appears in my calendar as being at 5pm that day. When the meeting actually happens, I will be in Sydney and it will quite correctly show it occurring at 4am on the 13th.
29 replies

Oct 12, 2008 11:01 PM in response to Scott Rose

Hi there.

I agree the time-zone support bug is definitely insane. I am not even sure I understand why there is time-zone support for the calendar in the first place but no matter, it will definitely screw with all the times in iCal. I just recently moved to air syncing everything with MM and before that I don't remember this happening, but it is definitely happening now.

Apple, Apple, Apple........ please, please, please get this worked out! Fortunately I don't have to travel as much now but that won't last long.

Thanks for pointing this out Scott.

Nov 21, 2008 12:16 PM in response to Scott Rose

aaargh!!! this drives me bananas (i travel a LOT) and this is the first post i've seen that addresses the issue exactly as i'm finding it. if i make plans for dinner at 6p in new york next week (and i'm in houston when i make the plans,) ical does NOT help me by changing the time of my dinner to 7pm once i arrive at newark airport!

turning time zone support off does not solve the problem, as you so eloquently state, and i resent like **** having to go through my ENTIRE calendar and change EVERY SINGLE EVENT to 'floating,' both past and future. that's RIDICULOUS!!!!

if you do a google search--as i did-- you'll find this problem has existed for a long time. what i don't understand is why it hasn't been fixed yet. thanks for the post.

Dec 1, 2008 3:50 AM in response to Allan Ross

a. I mentioned Google Calendar because you cited it as a paragon. I wanted you to understand that it works the very same way as iCal.

b. I just don't understand why you want to use System Preferences to change your time zone - rather than just your time. That IS using half the functionality and you're defeating your own aims. If you turn off time zone support and keep your location static in the system preference, nothing will move around in iCal.

I think we have to agree to differ...

Dec 1, 2008 6:55 PM in response to Arkouda

a) The first post wasn't mine. Check the name on the OP.

b) Fair enough about UTC as a solution but I'm trying to manage my schedule not run the Dept of Defense. Without a cleaner solution or a better implementation of turning time zone support off. I'll stick with manually resetting the time in sys prefs when I am out of my usual time zone and leaving my time zone set as EST.

I appreciate your help on time on this but international standard or not it's the wording in time zone support that is to blame as you point out. Having meetings default to floating might be a solution. I imagine that option isn't available in iCal unless you have time zone support turned on as I don't see it as an option currently.

Interesting comment about world wide accessibility of personal schedules. If my life does come to that then I will have no choice but to use time zones on all my events I suppose but it sure won't be fun going back and adding in time zones to all my existing events.

Dec 23, 2008 9:32 AM in response to Scott Rose

I just missed my annual dental appointment because I didn't realize that iCal shifted the times when I changed time zones.

I still use the family dentist that I grew up with and I'm only home for a few days a year. They weren't able to reschedule while I'm here.

I understand that some nerds appreciate the sort of engineer-think behind this "feature," but I'm solidly in the camp that believes an 11 a.m. appointment is an 11 a.m. appointment, even if I schedule it when I'm in a different city.

Jan 22, 2009 12:16 PM in response to supstill

It's definitely sensible at first glance, but then new problems come into play. Things like arriving before you left because your plane went faster than the time zones, which will again cause events to be entirely incorrect lengths (ie, that flight wasn't -3 hours, and it shouldn't show up as ending before it began, because that doesn't happen no matter what time zone you're in, unless you invent both time travel and modify iCal to recognize it).

Labels for which time zones: absolutely.
Labels for start and end time zones: would make display even more confusing than it is now, causing events to be incorrect lengths. See my 8-hour-sleep point for clarification. Sounds good, could even be a setting somewhere, but Apple aims for simplicity and (where required) conformity to make things work together. This would also (to my knowledge) not work with CalDAV protocols, making your calendar appear differently to EVERYONE who doesn't have iCal if you have it mirrored online.

Dec 8, 2008 11:24 PM in response to Scott Rose

I have the same issue as the original poster. In general, I would like to see events in the time zone where I expect to be on the day they occur. So if I will be in New York on December 20 and I have a lunch meeting there, I want it to show up at noon on my calendar, even if I happen to be in Tokyo today. I find it annoying to see lunch appointments at 2:00 AM or (even worse) on a different date; it makes it difficult for me to form a mental plan of the day in advance. I think iCal's method is designed more to support people who don't travel much but have lots of phone meetings scheduled by people in other time zones; this is a different type of time zone "support" from what a frequent traveler expects.

The best solution I have seen is in Pimlico's DateBk4/5/6 application for the Palm. Both the event time and the local time are shown, next to each other, for every event that has a non-local time zone. Events always show up on their "home" dates, with an arrow indicating if they are shifted to an earlier or later date in the local time zone. This does have one drawback, though, when showing a phone meeting that is date-shifted: the meeting appears on the calendar page for its date, not yours. However, it's the desired behavior for someone who is actually traveling to the meeting.

Does anyone know of a Mac desktop calendar client that behaves this way?

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iCal and Time Zones

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