How do I connect an Electric guitar to a Mac by Firewire?

Question

Level 1

7 points

How do I connect an Electric guitar to a Mac by Firewire?

Please forgive my lack of technical knowledge, I don't play guitar so the terminology is way beyond me. I am trying to find the best (and economical as in value for money) way to connect a guitar to an Intel Mac mini via Firewire port.

My daughter is getting an electric guitar for Christmas (Cort MGM-1) and a Roland Cube amp. She's been playing acoustic for five years already and is very good on guitar (now studying Grade 4). She will most likely want to record her guitar playing into software on the Mac, and I wondered what the experts here would recommend as being worth looking at.

Apple has a few pages given over to this here
http://www.apple.com/pro/techniques/connectingguitar/
which mentions using analogue via the mic input, or digital using an "interface" but the problem I find is they only recommend USB connections, and these are pretty expensive anyway. Still, if that's the price, so be it. I would prefer to use Firewire over USB every time, if possible.

The Roland website says you can connect the guitar directly to the Mac with a cable from the amp, but threads I have read and help I have so far received on a Mac magazine forum indicate the need for a separate "audio interface" and others talk of needing a pre-amp. I am getting confused! Is the Roland amp not also a pre-amp.interface itself?

My budget is pretty low now too (actually it's been exceeded, but I'm aware of the "Buy cheap, buy twice" argument and want to think ahead. Her sister plays Flute and Clarinet and they both sing, if that is any help.

I know there are some really professional and top grade experts on this forum, and I would welcome your suggestions, recommendations and opinions. Please help me work out what to do!

TIA

C2D iMac 24", PowerBook G4, PowerMac G5 DC, iMac CD, Mac OS X (10.4.11), PowerMac Server runs OS X Tiger 10.4.11

Posted on Dec 13, 2008 8:57 AM

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Answer 1

Foxboy71

Level 4

2,378 points

Dec 13, 2008 10:41 AM in response to Basilisk

Hi,

do you think about future recording sessions with your family? Ahh - and yes: Buy cheap buy twice is a good statement on the case...

If money is crucial, buying a USB Interface is probably more bang for the buck. It's easy to recommend good stuff if money is not important.

Look for the following specs: 2 Channel input, preferably a combination of XLR / TSR Jacks with switchable input sensitivity (HI-Z switch for direct guitar input).

I have got a tascam Fireone Interface with integrated Jogwheel for Logic. Kind of fun, but the preamps are only so-so and the knobs are plastic and not very precise. But it has Phantom Power for Condenser mics. However, nowadays it is only about 130 € if you get one with a special offer or so.
There are some of these Interfaces below 200 €, but it's not easy to find one that fits all needs and has good sound. M-Audio Firewire solo, maybe, just below 200 €.

But i would recommend a USB Interface for your purpose. Maybe an Edirol UA-25, or especially for Guitars the Line6 Interfaces maybe a good thing. Line6 Toneport or POD Studio UX1 (100-150€) or something like that. But don't go below this in quality - you'll pay twice, like you said.

So with USB you are 50-100 € below Firewire while getting almost the same performance. Unless your USB Port is heavy laden with other stuff, go for USB.

Also consider buying a good, sturdy, renown microphone to record voices & woodwinds & everything. A good one-for-all-mic is the Shure SM57 or SM58 (for vocals). You'll find one of these in nearly every studio around the world. For the woodwinds, i would recommend a condenser, but the SM57 will get you through the first steps with acceptable results.

Fox

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Answer 2

ILUVMYMAC

Level 1

110 points

Dec 13, 2008 10:43 AM in response to Basilisk

All you really need is a cable,Connect your guitar cable to the audio line in jack on your Mac using a 1/4-inch to 1/8-inch adapter. for about 6 bucks that will get you going.

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Answer 3

Dec 13, 2008 11:05 AM in response to Basilisk

To add to Fox' advice, you might want to consider the Presonus Inspire which is an small, easy to use firewire interface that would allow recording with mics as well as having Hi-Z instrument inputs.

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Answer 4

Dec 13, 2008 12:01 PM in response to Basilisk

Another option is the headphone socket on the Roland Cube, it doubles up as a recording output, just run it straight into the Macs audio input. To record by firewire, you will need a firewire analogue-to-digital interface, and these are generally quite a bit more expensive than USB versions.

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Answer 5

Foxboy71

Level 4

2,378 points

Dec 13, 2008 12:22 PM in response to ILUVMYMAC

😉 traitor, you've revealed the No.1 top secret information 😉

Of course this is a way to get things started.

Fox

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Answer 6

Larry Mal

Level 2

369 points

Dec 13, 2008 2:56 PM in response to Foxboy71

I wouldn't worry about Firewire. Not that important for doing one or two guitars, or a guitar and a vocal.

Look into Line 6's Toneport series. It's a USB powered soundcard, and allows for microphones as well, and it has guitar modeling amps that are pretty good. Good price. I've outgrown mine, but never had any problems with it.

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Answer 7

Basilisk Author

Level 1

7 points

Dec 13, 2008 5:46 PM in response to Foxboy71

Thanks a lot to everyone for such a wide range of ideas. I've spent most of the day researchng them, and it is confusing. Now we have a number of options that also include software, eg ProTools or Cubase LE 4 or Ableton or some other program. That means even more research! And won't that double up what we are already doing with Garage Band or Logic? SOrry, I'm just a poor Sax player used to playing the dots, unamplified!

One big reason to go with Firewire (apart from its just better anyway) is the USB ports are pretty full on the Mac IIRC but the Firewire is totally unused.

As for plugging the cable straight in the back of the Mac into the Analog In port, that would only allow a single stereo input or two mono ones, and that could be limiting. I agree though that it would allow for something to be done pretty immediately.

I liked the Shure mic recommendation, I hadn't thought of that but it was extremely useful information which was great for you to add in. Very wise advice. Not sure if its a condensor mic or not, and not really sure why a condensor mic is supposed to be better. They are more expensive though but nothing in this world should be acquired because of price alone IMO; sometimes the minimum cost of something really useful is higher than just the minimum cost of purchase.

When I get one of these interfaces, where in the daisy chain should it be placed?

Guitar - Amp - Interface - Mac

OR

Guitar - Interface - Mac

OR

Guitar - Interface - Amp - Mac

or doesn't it matter?

If it is placed in the chain, should the amp effects be restricted to "Clean" leaving the interface or the software to do the effects, or can you change settings in as many places as wanted? I am guessing this is only a question when connecting to the Mac?

Sorry to ask so many questions, as you can see, I am getting hold of bits of ideas here and there, but there are still big gaps in my understanding. You've all brought me forwards a lot since this morning, I owe you all a great big thank you!

To sum up (please correct me where I am wrong or incomplete) what I am looking for then is an Analog to Digital converter with a Firewire (or USB perhaps) connection to the computer. These come in different flavours, often with "free" software, and can add effects in the computer just like some amps can. They all cost something like £100 to £200 upwards (same price as the amp really) and are in effect "amps for the computer" - or is that totally wrong?

As I said, I value your input and corrections.

TIA

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Answer 8

Foxboy71

Level 4

2,378 points

Dec 14, 2008 2:14 AM in response to Basilisk

Hi,

the Shure Sm58 is a dynamic microphone. You'll need a lot of gain on it, also, so you better have good pre-amps in your interface. Condensers provide you with a higher level to start with, making things easier for the preamps. Also, condensers usually have a better range up to the higher frequencies, so if you're recording instruments with many high frequencies like a violin or flute, you'll probably get better results with a good condenser. A very useful allround-condenser is the AKG C1000S. I work with them for almost 2 decades now, and you can do almost everything with them, from speech, vocals, instruments, overheads, stereo recordings and so on. The only limitation is: You shouldn't place them in front of a very loud instrument (trumpet) or amp, because then you'll get distortions.

So for recording loud stuff like the guitar amp, the sm57/58 mabe a good, if not almost optimum, choice.

The interface is the last step before your comuter, so the "chain" should be:
Guitar-Amp ))) Mic-Interface-Mac
Or direct: Guitar-Interface-Mac
Or most simple: Guitar-Mac

I would not do:
Guitar-Amp-Interface-Mac
because, if you want to record the sound of the amp, you'll probably better record the sound that's coming out of the amp's speakers with a mic.
If you want to record the clean Guitar signal, better go directly into the interface and use Logics Guitar Amp Pro Plugin to shape the sound.

Cheers,

Fox

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Answer 9

Dec 14, 2008 8:52 AM in response to Basilisk

If want to record more than a couple things at once (might be true for a "family band") then I would recommend running your instruments and Mics into a mixer (e.g. Behringer UB1002 - $69US) and having the output from the mixer go into the audio in jack on your computer. However if you want to record multiple parts individually you WILL need an audio interface which allows multiple inputs at the same time (minimum 2). Firewire is definitely superior to USB for audio work but at the lower price points I am not sure it is a big advantage. Being open to both with give you more options.

You say you are on a "budget" but want to "think ahead". Let me tell you right now that building a "quality rig" cannot be done a "budget". For example just to get a good Mic Preamp will run you at least $500US or more. Then there is the issue of the analog to digital converters. There is a noticeable difference between an Apogee Duet preamp/AD vs an audio interface that costs half as much. You pay for what you get.

I recommend that you use a high output dynamic Mic (e.g. Sennheiser E835 - $99US).

You won't need any additional DAW software as Garageband will allow you to do quality 24bit multitrack audio recordings. It is a very powerful program considering it is "free". Later, you can "upgrade" to Logic Express, Cubase, etc. for more power.

And yes, always try and record the "raw" sound of the guitar, voice, horn, etc. as this gives you artistic freedom during mixing to experiment with different effects/plugs/etc.

Good luck!!!

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