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Level 1

10 points

How to change tempo without affecting the music (only the grid)

This is a very basic problem. I have been laying songs (audio files) onto logic and recording vocals over them, and now that I am finished with the recording, i realize that in order to copy and paste the choruses EXACTLY throughout the songs, which can be quite arduous the way I have been trying to do it, one needs to have matched the proper tempo with the the music being used.

I neglected to do this at the start of these projects, and it has come back to bite me because when I try to change the tempo now, it completely throws my vocals out of whack because my voice is off beat. This is where the problem lies. I know had I addressed this at the beginning, I would be smooth sailing.

I also tried setting the tempo at the proper rate on a new logic project, but when I drag everything over from the original project, the same problem occurs.

In reality, I need the grid to match up so I have the proper means to line up my vocals exactly so the choruses are consistent throughout the song (obviously I can do it manually in a way regular listeners might not notice, but Im dissatisfied with that, I want it to be perfect)

Again, I know that if I had matched the tempo properly with the audio file (the music) at the beginning, there would be no problems, and I'd be able to record over it and then use the bars to align my vocals perfectly.

If some one would be so kind as to get back to me on this, it would be highly appreciated

Posted on Nov 11, 2009 4:29 PM

Best reply

christianobermaier

Level 3

775 points

Posted on Nov 11, 2009 4:45 PM

Check out Region>Lock SMPTE Position.

Christian

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28 replies

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Nov 12, 2009 2:12 PM in response to christianobermaier

lol, so true..

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Nov 12, 2009 3:57 PM in response to iSchwartz

This was helpful, and I appreciate all you guys' help.. But the problem is still here..

ischwartz, even after following your instructions, once i change the tempo, the automation completely disappears. It disappears on the automation arrange page (which depicts the automation data as bars like a bar graph type deal across regions) and also disappears on the regular arrange window (the squiggly yellow lines depicting volume automation data become straight yellow lines across each track.

any ideas?

iSchwartz

Level 5

4,321 points

Nov 12, 2009 4:07 PM in response to Ojan36

JG, thanks for the awfully kind words about my posts! And right back atcha, my fellow duck!

Ojan, when you say the automation disappears, do you mean:

• it gets erased (yellow lines disappear from the arrange page, or, the regions in the automation-arrange page disappear)?

• it flies off to some nether part of the song?

• something else?

BTW, by any chance is your song start marker set to somewhere before or after bar 1 1 1 1?

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Nov 12, 2009 7:46 PM in response to iSchwartz

I'm sorry for not responding promptly. and youre the one helping me out, so if anything it should be the other way around. I'm not used to getting such swift responses, so I figure I'll make a post, and come back and check in a couple hours.

Anyways, when i say the automation disappears I mean the yellow lines do stay, but all the ups and downs and zig zags i made for the volume disappear. so the "automation curves" disappear, and the yellow line is there just straight across at 0 dB on some tracks, +6.0 dB on others, depending one where I had it.

The regions in the automation-arrange page also remain, but they are completely blank, the white bars depicting the changes in volume disappear. Just blue areas with nothing inside.

It does not fly off anywhere, its just gone. And my song start marker is at bar 1 1 1 1.

Hope to hear back from you soon. Thanks!!

iSchwartz

Level 5

4,321 points

Nov 12, 2009 8:13 PM in response to Ojan36

Hey, no problem with replying when you did. Sometimes I'm glued to the internet, sometimes not. Anyway, yours is an interesting problem so let's go to the next step!

BTW, are you working on L8 or L9?

After reading your post I double-checked my procedure to make sure it's kosher (technical term). It is, but... my first attempt at locking everything and changing the tempo resulted in mayhem. Scratched my head for a while, then did a bunch of undo's and tried again. This time everything worked as expected. This was a reminder that Logic is kinda like that... Try something the first time, it goes bonkers (so does they guy doing it). Try it again and it works. Been this way forever. Kinda like kicking your equipment rack to get the compressor to work for another few weeks before it goes kerflooey again. Anyway...

My suggestion is to try it again. If it doesn't work, hit UNDO enough times until you get back to square 1 and then try one more time. If that still doesn't work, post back and if I'm not busy I'll take a look at your file, if you want. Details on how we would do that to follow, pending success or failure of your re-try.

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Nov 13, 2009 11:06 PM in response to iSchwartz

Thanks for being so patient, again you replied almost instantaneously and here I am not responding after more than 24 hours...

Im working on L8. Ive tried and retried again and again and the same thing happens. Ive also tried it on other projects with no better results. I got so frustrated I kind of just left it alone for the entire day, but I need to get this right so I can complete these songs.. so I guess I'll be hearing back from you...

thanks again!

iSchwartz

Level 5

4,321 points

Nov 14, 2009 7:14 AM in response to Ojan36

Hi Ojan,

If you want, send me a file and I'll have a look. I've set up a temporary email address for you. If you opt to send me a file, save under a new name with the assets box unchecked , zip (compress) the file, and then email it to the address listed in my profile (look under "geographic location"). That email address will expire after I receive your file.

Message was edited by: iSchwartz

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Nov 14, 2009 7:18 PM in response to iSchwartz

I just sent you the file. The tempo is currently at the default 120. the tempo I need to set this song to is 97bpm.

The problem is identical for each of my 12 songs. This one is the most basic, in that I have automated it the least.

It would also work for me if we could set the tempo to the desired speed on a brand new project, and then just drag over the audio files from the original and get it to work that way.

Please let me know what happens, thanks!

iSchwartz

Level 5

4,321 points

Nov 14, 2009 7:24 PM in response to iSchwartz

Hi Ojan,

Thanks for sending the file! 🙂

I took a look at it and was able to lock everything (all regions and automation) and change the tempo without seeing the automation fly off or disappear. I even added a tempo event at mm 26 and changed it independently of the original tempo event. Everything worked as I would have expected.

I'm not sure how to advise you at this point other than to try again... And if it doesn't work, maybe you should make a video (like a screen capture movie) of you trying this on your system and post it to youtube so that we can see the problem with the automation in action.

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Nov 15, 2009 2:38 PM in response to iSchwartz

Wow, I was hoping that wouldnt happen, because now I don't know what to do. The same thing is happening for me, nothing has changed. As soon as I change the tempo all of the yellow automation lines go flat across all tracks..

Do you have any other idea as to why this could be happening? Could I be missing a detail in the instructions you gave me? Please let me know of any nuances that are crucial along the steps to successfully changing the tempo while keeping automation in place.

Maybe I can add a tempo event across the entire song and get it to work that way.. how would I do that? Thanks again Schwartz, and get back to me when you can.

iSchwartz

Level 5

4,321 points

Nov 15, 2009 3:00 PM in response to Ojan36

Here are the details again. Basically the same as before, but slightly more descriptive and complete. Here are two procedures. But before you try either of them, set your bar ruler to display TIME (see below for details).

_METHOD #1_
1• in the arrange page, select all regions (CMD-A). Then SMPTE-lock those regions.
2• open the automation event list on any track containing automation (using your key command)
3• open the automation event arrange window (standard key command CMD-1)
4• select ALL (standard key command CMD-A)
5• SMPTE-Lock the automation regions (using your key command)

Now adjust your tempo. When you're done, make sure to SMPTE-unlock automation and regions.

_METHOD #2_
1• in the arrange page, select all regions (CMD-A). Then SMPTE-lock those regions.
2• open the automation event list on any track containing automation (using your key command)
3• click the hierarchy arrow in the event list. You'll now see a bunch of regions in the list named "Automation"
4• select ALL (CMD-A)
5• SMPTE-Lock the regions (using your key command)

Now adjust your tempo. When you're done, make sure to SMPTE-unlock automation and regions.

A few more things...

Before you do either procedure, set the bar ruler in the (normal) arrange page to display Time. Assuming you get everything locked according to either method above, when you change your tempo you will NOT see automation or regions move in the arrange page. This is absolutely normal behavior when the bar ruler is set to display Time. If the bar ruler is set to display Beats, you will see automation and regions expand or compress as you change the tempo (and that's normal too). But the acid test to make sure you're doing this right (and that your system is acting right) is to set the bar ruler to display Time first. Then try either method. If, when you change the tempo nothing moves in the (normal) arrange page, all is well.

Good luck!

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Nov 15, 2009 6:50 PM in response to iSchwartz

Man, still no luck.. Setting the bar ruler to Time didn't make a difference, unfortunately. The yellow bar just goes flat.. Do you think the link button is relevant here?

Could I try accomplishing this by "adding a tempo event"? If so, how would I go about doing that? Or, how about starting a new project, setting the tempo, and then dragging the regions over while still keeping it all together.. I would be happy with that too..

Ojan36 Author

Level 1

10 points

Dec 19, 2009 11:46 PM in response to iSchwartz

ISchwartz, i am still struggling here with this locking issue!! the regions are locking fine, but the automation is NOT locking on any of my projects... After locking it, exactly how you've taught me to, I can still click and MOVE automation, which results in the flattening out of the yellow automation curve across the entire track (whatever track's automation I clicked on and moved).

So Ive narrowed it down a little (after a month...) The problem is that I am not able to SMPTE lock the automation. I hope you can still help me trouble shoot. THANKS

How to change tempo without affecting the music (only the grid)