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Level 1

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17" i5 MBP GPU Switching Observations

This is a culmination of my posts from another forum, I wanted to post my observations on here as well to see if I can get an 'Official Response' of some sort..

I noticed that you can see which GPU is active in System Profiler and started watching which one the system was using.

Some really strange observations...

Launching Tweetie, even when it is the only application open, makes the computer use the 330M. As soon as I quit it, it switches back to the Intel unless of course Aperture or something like that is open..

Right now with Firefox and a few tabs, Mail, Adium, Terminal, Calendar, Address Book, Word, Power Point, Excel and system profiler open (Just started launching random stuff to test), I am on the Intel. The second I launch Tweetie - 330M.

I am also noticing more weird instances of switching to the 330m, and in my opinion unnecessarily.

For instance, in Firefox, I can have a bunch of tabs open (Right now - Facebook, Macrumors, TUAW, Gizmodo, Engadget) but as soon as I go to my iGoogle page the 330m kicks in. As soon as I close it's tab, the Intel goes back on. My 2007 white Macbook was able to handle iGoogle without a problem, is it really necessary to use a discrete GPU for Google??... NO

It's also interesting to watch the battery while doing this. Right now, at 96% it says 7:22 remaining, upon opening a tab with Google, it goes down to about 6:00 remaining whether the tab is in the foreground or not.

Note - I am only referring to iGoogle - the classic Google page does not force the use of the 330m.

And my next observation may be even more annoying!

It also seems like I am getting 'stuck' on the 330m after a bit of usage. I noticed that after closing Aperture (on battery), I am still using the 330m. Figured it may be some other application requiring it so I quit everything that was running, including System Profiler and then relaunched just System Profiler, and I am still on the 330m.

Right now the only way I can get back over to the Intel GPU is by logging out (I think) or rebooting.

I hope other users are willing to look at their systems and see if what I am observing is 'normal', because I doubt I am the only one experiencing it. This all comes at a sacrifice to battery life and Apple really needs to address it quickly...

I hope that someone comes up with a way of giving the user more control over which card is active, be it Apple or someone else.

17" 2.53 i5 Macbook Pro, Mac OS X (10.6.3)

Posted on Apr 21, 2010 7:11 AM

60 replies

Rod Hagen

Level 7

32,000 points

Apr 26, 2010 6:19 PM in response to Tim Rand 2

Didn't realise you were still using Office 2004, Tim. I wonder whether the other person I came across with the AutoUpdate issue was too, and whether it also applies in 2008?

I guess Microsoft might update the 2008 version (despite the claimed impending arrival of Office 2011) to overcome the problem if necessary, but I doubt if they would do the same for 2004.

Cheers

Rod

Apr 26, 2010 11:44 PM in response to Rod Hagen

Hi Guys,

I can confirm that Office 2008 for Mac does not make my MBP jump to the Nvidia. Office seems to run fine on the Intel GPU. Hopefully Apple will sort this soon.

Rod Hagen

Level 7

32,000 points

Apr 27, 2010 12:58 AM in response to Don Trammell

Do you have the Office autoupdate daemon installed in your LogIn items folder, Don? It was this specific process which was mentioned in the other post I've seen regarding Office (uncertain of the version) and activation of the NVidia processor.

Interestingly, if Office 2004 exhibits the problem, but Office 2008 does not, it might suggest (though it far from establishes) that the problem here may involve software written using older programming guidelines, or now superseded processes, that may not play quite "according to Hoyle" with the new system.

Do you have all current updates installed with Office 2008, by the way?

Cheers

Rod

Apr 27, 2010 6:03 AM in response to Don Trammell

Also using Office 2008 and with Word, Powerpoint and Excel all open, still running on integrated GPU. I don't have auto-update enabled either. In fact, this post just reminded me to check for updates and there was one ready for download!

Apr 27, 2010 6:10 AM in response to Rod Hagen

Hey Rod,

Nope. I do not have the Auto Updater running. I usually prefer to do my updates manually anyway so maybe this is why. So far I've identified about 5 to 8 apps that kick in the Nvidia GPU. I was thinking if it would be a good idea to include in this thread a list of apps or to create a new thread detailing all the apps that are causing issues.

Apr 27, 2010 6:31 PM in response to dougjacobs

Further testing ALSO shows that iPhoto, iMovie, iWeb, iDVD and Parallels (running Win XP) and VLC will trigger the jump to the nVidia chip while on battery. It seems like we could produce a grid for this showing the programs that do and do not cause the switch.

It also makes me wonder if there isn't a System Defaults setting that could force it to stay on Intel when on battery.

Apr 27, 2010 10:15 PM in response to dougjacobs

MACNN wrote:
As predicted last week, Apple has seeded the first developer version of Mac OS X 10.6.4,
termed Build 10F37, to developers today. iPhoneinCanada as usual is on top of the details,
noting improvements to a handful of areas.
According to reports, the current build focuses on *Graphics Drivers*, SMB, Time Machine
backups, USB, and VoiceOver. The build does not include any further updates or enhancements.

I understand that developers are under NDA, but perhaps someone can test the issues outlined in this thread and report these Graphics Driver problems back to Apple.

Rod Hagen

Level 7

32,000 points

Apr 27, 2010 11:16 PM in response to Don Trammell

Hi Don,

I've created one over at http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2414239&tstart=0

As I've said in the thread, it would be good if people could use it simply as a place to provide information about programs that invoke the NVidia card, and not as a place to argue the issue about whether or not the auto-switching process is desirable or not - there are plenty of other places where that can be debated! Doing this will help to make sure that it is a useful resource for people who are running into battery or other issues.

Cheers

Rod

Kyn Drake

Level 7

21,585 points

May 6, 2010 7:01 AM in response to ReallyBigFeet

OpenGL, OpenCL, Quartz Composer, Core Animation and Core Graphics

Do we even know if the Intel HD processor is capable of these? I found a diagram of the "features" of the Intel graphics processor and it appears that, if you've got BluRay, it's a real boon, but pretty much the bottom of the barrel otherwise.

Mac OS X system preferences should provide a setting for the user to completely turn off the Nvidia GT 330M (like the previous generation Macbook Pro).

One thing that should be noted is, unlike "the previous generation Macbook Pro" this generation was forced to use Intel's HD chip. Just from that alone, it's impossible to have the same kind of choices as was afforded previously.

I'd like to "think" that with a little tweaking the system can push the 330 to the side, but, if Intel's chip is as weak as it's turning out to be, the only option to using the 330 would be to offload to the CPU which would have other sorts of implications.

KPDover

Level 1

5 points

May 10, 2010 7:44 AM in response to Kyn Drake

Found another app which causes the switch and is totally illogical: Socialite, which is an RSS reader. The moment it starts it switches to Nvidia, and goes back to Intel as soon as it's closed. No idea what could be so complicated about displaying some text and pictures.

May 11, 2010 1:27 PM in response to dougjacobs

I have another observation: when on battery, if I open iphoto, for instance, the reversion to 330M takes place correctly but it seems that the GPU is underpowered / underclocked by OSX. Indeed, if I try to enlarge any picture (by pressing the space bar) the size increase is not snappy but progressive....
This happens only if the iphoto window takes the whole screen (i.e. it is not in reduced window) and does not happen at all with charger connected...
Did any of you notice this kind of underclocking under battery? (honestly I noted something similar on the 9400m integrated in my old MB alu late 2008) and I am wondering if it is normal even on this beast....
Cheers and thanks
Emanuele

acribb

Level 1

4 points

May 11, 2010 1:34 PM in response to califfo1975

I too have the problem whereas the 330M will NOT shut off. After it gets used, it just stays on, even after I close all programs.

This is not right.

Apple needs to fix this by allowing some user control of the graphics cards, rather than having to rely on 3rd party software like this- http://codykrieger.com/gfxCardStatus/ which is currently being developed.

l.aluffi

Level 1

4 points

Jun 11, 2010 5:11 PM in response to acribb

Hi!

Just registerd to this forum because this very discussion.
I've found that "Virtualbox" application switches 330M, as soon as the application is lauched. No need to start any virtual machine, just the application dashboard. I'm thinking to file a bug to the Virtualbox homepage, but I guess the fault is in Apple, rather than in Oracle software.

Worst of all I've found that X11, even just started with xclock or just the bash terminal, switches the card on. A lot of battery wasted just to do nothing...

Kyn Drake

Level 7

21,585 points

Jun 12, 2010 12:53 AM in response to l.aluffi

Welcome to the discussions, l.aluffi.

Go ahead and report the problem to Oracle. Some devs have utilized some graphic card functions with the assumption that it would be able to be handled by the integrated card. This was true when the integrated card was Nvidia, not so with Intel's solution. Once they're made aware of this, they may be able to alter their code so that it doesn't call the extended functions.

l.aluffi

Level 1

4 points

Jun 15, 2010 6:20 AM in response to Kyn Drake

I agree. I haven't had time until now, but this evening I will file the bug to Oracle/Sun Virtualbox guys.

Discrete graphic card is triggered even only for the merely X11 Apple's environment, without any demand for graphic power. This is bad, because using xclock or glxgears drain the same power of a 3D application.

It seems a little bit harder to file a bug to Apple but I'll find the way.

17" i5 MBP GPU Switching Observations