Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued.

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Posted on Jul 14, 2010 6:16 AM

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Jul 16, 2010 11:14 AM in response to Addriaan

Steve was quoted as saying:

"So I have some other updates. We're tracking some problems with the proximity sensor and we're working on it. White iPhone, we're going to start shipping at the end of the month."

That doesn't seem to indicate it is necessarily a software issue. I'm going to wait until a fix is confirmed before I go back to iPhone 4.

Jul 16, 2010 11:31 AM in response to lhf

I agree with this. They may not be able to fix it at all. I am at least glad that he mentioned it though so all the trolls can get off this thread acting like it is "all in our minds".

I can guarantee you he didn't just "mention" that because it was a few hundred people. This is a MAJOR issue.

CEOs like Steve Jobs do not mention trivial things in a press conference. This was his way of acknowledging it without panicking people.


lhf wrote:
Steve was quoted as saying:

"So I have some other updates. We're tracking some problems with the proximity sensor and we're working on it. White iPhone, we're going to start shipping at the end of the month."

That doesn't seem to indicate it is necessarily a software issue. I'm going to wait until a fix is confirmed before I go back to iPhone 4.

Jul 16, 2010 11:31 AM in response to lhf

@lhf

At the time Steve was talking about the proximity sensor, there was a slide on the screen that said "Proximity sensor - next software update". You can see it on Engadget's site. I agree though, I'm not confident that they know what the problem is or if they're sure it can be fixed in software. He glossed over this issue very quickly.

I can't believe not a single reporter asked or pressed him on the proximity sensor issue. Most of the questions were pointless.

Jul 16, 2010 11:35 AM in response to avanpelt

I agree. Going back to 3GS until I know this is fixed for sure. See you at the next software update!

I get the feeling that there are going to be some significant returns. I love Apple but I just get the feeling that the case thing is not going to go over too well and the proximity sensor needs to be fixed asap because now people with free bumpers are going to wonder what is going on with muted dropped calls etc...

avanpelt wrote:
MacSince85 wrote:
Proximity sensor issue was acknowledged! There IS a fix...SOFTWARE!


That's not what I read on Macworld's live blog. From what I saw, Steve said:

"Tracking some problems with the proximity sensor, and we're working on solutions, and we'll try to get it fixed in the next software update."

Key word here is try. I'm glad I didn't wait around for Apple to get over its arrogance and admit that they screwed up. Today was definitely not the day that happened. All Steve did was say that every other smartphone on the market has the same problem as the iPhone 4. That's untrue. If it were true, no one would rely on smartphones to conduct business.

Jul 16, 2010 11:35 AM in response to Sille22

I am not sure what to do now..

Yes they mentioned a software fix "may" fix the issue. But my time to return the phone is coming to a close.

I love my iPhone, but have been eyeing the Sprint EVO.

I also was upset at Steves stats from the event today. I had the antenna issue, but that went away when I got the bumper... I never called Applecare to report an issue. Because I never called them they stats say I am a happy customer.

I also did not call them about the proximity sensor issue because if I did I knew I wouldn't get a solution on the phone. So again with Steves numbers I am a happy Apple customer.

I have been vocal about these issue here on the official Applpe support forum, but I guess they dont take these complaints into account.

I think the only thing that may keep me an Apple customer is the rest of my family is on AT&T. And my wife and son also have iPhone 4's.

I am torn...

Jul 16, 2010 12:00 PM in response to scottct1

Just got off the phone, mine is going back. 20 minute call, about 1 minute to finalize it.
Now, off to att to reactivate my 3gs. I'm very disappointed in this whole issue. I feel apple really screwed us and they don't really care.
The conference was a joke, free cases for everyone and we'll try to get a software update to fix the other problems. Wow, how about you fix the problems NOW.
He was pretty pleased with the return rates being so low compared to the 3gs. I bet they jump alot higher in the next few days. People are getting close to the 30day mark. I would like to see what they are in a few weeks, but I doubt we'll ever know.

Edit: I just had a brain fart. He was comparing 3gs returns to iP4 returns for the same time frame, right. This year the time frame is 30 days for everybody (apple & att), was it 30 days or 15 days to return it last year?

Edit1: Wow, you can't say f.a.r.t. 🙂

Message was edited by: Can'tusemyusualusername

Message was edited by: Me

Jul 16, 2010 12:01 PM in response to Michael Empire

Was anyone else watching the "cover it live" feed? ...I must of posted 30 times about the PS issue, eveyone was edited-out. All my comments got through except for those. It was so incredibly lame the way the fanbois running that blogged did that ... I KNOW I wasn't the only one of us watching and posting about the "might be software" quote and quick mention and then lack of questions about it afterward ... I called last night, my day 30 and returned my phone ... I had to literally fight with Apple to give me my money back because this is my "second" phone. Don't let them tell you there's no way, no how you can return it if you already got a replacement. It might take you a lot of yelling and screaming plus a 2 hour phone and explaining yourself to 5 different Apple personal but, they have to refund your money if they can't provide a replacement that works. Once I threatened to call my credit card company and file a complaint, we started getting some where.

I'm now officially done with this thread. 

Jul 16, 2010 12:09 PM in response to lhf

lhf wrote:

That doesn't seem to indicate it is necessarily a software issue. I'm going to wait until a fix is confirmed before I go back to iPhone 4.


Of course it's software. Many people—myself included—have come to that conclusion in recent days. And anyone who has the intellectual curiosity to conduct a simple experiment could also prove it to themselves that it's just buggy software. That's what I did when I made this video ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dX7EPVDVEEg ), and you can repeat it for yourself.

Here's all you need to do:

1. Get the phone on an active call, or listening to a long voice mail, so that the proximity sensor is active.

2. Lay the phone flat on a table facing up.

3. Pick a point 0.75 to 1.0 inches above the phone's earpiece, and call that "Point A"

4. Place you hand directly over the phone at Point A, without touching the phone first. The screen will go blank (as it's supposed to).

5. Remove your hand, and repeat step 4 as many times as you want to prove to yourself that the phone consistently reacts to your hand's presence.

6. Now, cover the proximity sensor area by touching the glass directly with your hand, and watch the screen go blank, as expected.

7. Move your hand directly to Point A from there. You should go straight up from touching the phone to your previous "hovering" posiiton. The screen will come on, even though your hand is in the exact same place (Point A) that turned the display OFF before.

8. Lower your hand to touch the sensor again, and watch the screen go off. Raise it to Point A again, and watch the screen become active again. Repeat as necessary to see how repeatable it is.

9. Continue to go back and forth between the two modes described above until you're satisfied that it's predictable behavior.

The very fact that the phone responds differently to the exact same hand (or head) position depending on where you were previously is a clear sign that it's a software bug. Hardware doesn't care about what was, only what is. The software bug is the only thing that could make the activation distance "stick" at zero whenever there is direct contact, and then make the phone temporarily fail to recognize a small gap. After that, moving entirely away from the phone "resets" the sensor, and it is then ready to respond to a small gap.

This behavior agrees with the experiences of myself and many others who have scrutinized the proximity sensor problem. I think what happens is that at some point during a call, the phone is placed so that the proximity sensor is directly against the skin. Then, after that, if it's moved back to a point where it's looking into the ear again (maybe a half-inch gap), it won't shut the screen off (like in step 8 above). I've found that if I consciously put the phone in a position where it's looking into my ear a bit, and I'm careful not to move it higher so that my outer ear can't press against the glass in front of the sensor, the phone is happy to keep the screen off indefinitely.

Since the "normal" operation of the phone has the sensor looking into the ear a little bit (that small gap), some people never have it happen to them. That's because they only move the phone in a range that keeps a little space next to the sensor. They happen to use their phone in such a way that they never get skin-on-sensor contact, so they never get their sensor "stuck" on zero. And maybe some people always keep their prox sensor against some skin, and the fact that it's "stuck" at zero isn't a problem. But many people end up going back and forth a little...they happen to naturally hold their phone in a way where it's bound to see a small gap one moment, and direct contact the next. As demonstrated above, the software that controls the sensor HATES that.

It can definitely be fixed with software, and Apple will do that as soon as they have the time to properly test the fix. I'm usually a pessimist, but I'm confident in that right now.

Jul 16, 2010 12:07 PM in response to mbassoc2003

Now this is a funny comment. Yeah, very minor....so minor that the CEO of the second largest company in the USA and the LARGEST tech company mentioned it in his press conference regarding the flagship product. So minor that they actually created a slide for it in the presentation.

Who are you fooling.. lol..

I wonder why they didn't create a list or slide for all the other "minor" issues regarding the iP4 in this forum?

Wake up. This is the second largest issue and they will need to address it. You can ignore it and act like it is not there, but it will not go away unless they fix it. Mark my words it will not.

Have a great day!

mbassoc2003 wrote:
Very minor issue that doesn't effect most users. The majow issue is the antenna that has resulted in complaints from 1 in 200 users. That is a fault issue that any manufacturere would be delighted with. The sensor issue by comparrison is far smaller than that. It cannot even be replicated in the real world by most people.

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Issue with Proximity Sensor during calls - Continued.

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