Time Machine not backing up to WD My Cloud on Catalina

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Time Machine not backing up to WD My Cloud on Catalina

I have a late 2013 iMac running macOS Catalina 10.15.4. This is backed up via Time Machine to a WD MyCloud Gen 1 6TB HDD purchased Jan 2016. Photos from my iPhone are also backed up to a separate share.

As far as I know this has been working ok since the Catalina upgrade, but in May I found that it wasn’t backing my iPhone up. No firmware updates available but a reboot caused a firmware update to become available, so I let it auto update (04.05.00-342) and then managed to get the iPhone backing up again.

Then found that Time Machine was complaining about wrong username and password for the backup disc so I had to re-select it which caused it to create a new backup. I suspect that auto-updates have caused this to happen 2 or 3 times in the past, showing as randomly getting the wrong username or password.

After 2 or 3 days of trying to create a new backup it “discovered” the original backup and then started trying to add to this. It was extremely slow and the backups never completed.

Discovered that this was probably due to still using AFP protocol rather than SMB. Using tmutil setdestination allows it to connect but it won't backup. Have just run another full test on the WD which was successful. Kicked a manual backup off. Time Machine preferences showing zero KB of — available, oldest backup None, Latest backup none. The dashboard shows that 710GB is in use on the TimeMachineBackup share.

Telling Time Machine to use the afp connected disc it then shows 5.01 TB of 5.95 TB available but with no backups.

Can anyone help to get TimeMachine working again please and if possible with the original backup inherited.

Many thanks

Paul

iMac 27″, macOS 10.15

Posted on Jun 15, 2020 7:40 AM

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Answer 1

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Barney-15E

Level 10

122,144 points

Jun 15, 2020 8:07 AM in response to PaulRSte

Unless your NAS supports the Time Machine over SMB specification, then it won't work reliably. If it used AFP in the past, then it likely does not support the Time Machine over SMB specification unless a firmware update added that capability. The AFP implementation used by NAS manufacturers was not Apple's AFP and could not reliably handle Time Machine backups.

Check with Western Digital to see if they have implemented that specification. Them saying, "hey, we can do Time Machine" is not the same as "our server implements the Time Machine over SMB specification."

To get Time Machine working, use one of the supported disks: Backup disks you can use with Time Machine - Apple Support

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Answer 2

PaulRSte Author

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18 points

Jun 28, 2020 8:54 AM in response to PaulRSte

My MAC is currently backing up to time machine over SMB and has been running for almost half an hour.. Normally it never runs for more than 3 or 4 minutes before stopping with an error "Server connections interrupted". Getting the same error whilst trying to delete the backup file from the TimeMachineBackup share as advised above, even after updating macOS to 10.15.5. SO, what have I done today?

The MyCloud was installed whilst AFP was the preferred protocol, along with some s/w from WD which, I found out today, they don't use anymore.
Left hand panel of the Finder window has a permanent item WDMyCloud under "Locations". It disappears if you shut the MyCloud down and then relaunch Finder (Apple Menu/ Force Quit).
When you restart MyCloud the item re-appears and it maps an AFP connection to the TimeMachineBackup share. You cannot then map an SMB connection to this item, it has to be to WDMyCloud.local. Before you turn it back on though you can try to map it to WDMyCloud, but of course, it fails.
After 6 weeks of this i thought I'd go for broke and do a Factory Reset and delete the unwanted software.
Completed that and reconfigured it for TM backups. After finding that there is still an AFP share, I closed it down again and did a Force Quit on Finder
Whilst powering it back up I did a Ctrl-K in Finder (this gets round The operation can’t be completed because the original item for “folder name” can’t be found error) cleared out all the old servers and entered smb://WDMyCloud. I waited for the blue status light to come on, clicked on "Connect" and it connected.
Checked under Time Machine preferences and now the connection to WDMyCloud has an SMB connection (hover the mouse pointer over each disk available and it shows the address and protocol), and the WDMyCloud.local has an APF connection.
Time Machine set itself to auto backups and it's now been running for an hour and a quarter with 33GB of 387GB backed up.

I guess that the real test of this is what happens in the next few days. I've read of several fixes that worked for a few days and then stopped so the next obvious check is what happens after logging out and back in again, and doing a reboot. This backup has to finish first though.

I also need to be able to stop the AFP connection automatically happening. I thought that there might be something in AFP.conf but it looks as though it's in binary or encrypted. It could also be something that's in the bonjour configuration. Can anyone help with this please?

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Answer 3

Barney-15E

Level 10

122,144 points

Jul 2, 2020 12:17 PM in response to Chris Lyons

However, after all that my backup still fails even though the TM share is mounted as a SMB volume.

Connecting via SMB isn't the only part of this. The NAS firmware must support the Time Machine over SMB specification. If turning on Time Machine automatically enables AFP, I would bet that your NAS does not support the Time Machine over SMB specification. Time Machine needs special communication with the server to ensure the backup is written without error.

You would need to check with Western Digital whether your NAS supports Time Machine over SMB or if there is a firmware update which enables that feature.

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Answer 4

Jul 11, 2020 12:16 PM in response to PaulRSte

So, here goes. Lots to tell as I've been actively involved with an Apple support tech and have spent more than 6 hours over the past two weeks on the phone. Not pleasant, but fruitful. First your questions:

The WD device I'm using is a My Cloud EX2 Ultra. I chose this since it has 2 x 4 TB drives and I'm running in 2 TB RAID configuration. I've had this one about 2 years and only after updating to macOS 10.15.5 Supplemental, did my problems begin. I also chose this because I wanted an NAS device to squirrel away in the laundry cupboard where my Comcast router is located.
I have been able to make TimeMachine work in either APF or SMB modes. In APF mode the iMac "sees" the drive and it can be accessed under Location in the Finder's left hand pane. In SMB mode you've got to actually mount it on the Desktop by going through Finder/Go/Connect to Server and entering "smb://<my cloud name>/<time machine share name/". Once the share is mounted it will be visible in Time Machine's "Select Disk..." Basically what you've detailed above.

All that said, I could never get an initial backup to complete. I've got ~810 GB to do and it failed always anywhere between 200 GB and 300 GB. Sometime after it failed I could restart it be selecting "Back up now" and it would pick up where it had failed. I actually was able to complete a full backup this way but when I tried to get it verified, it failed the verify.

Now to where I am after hours with John. After sending files to Apple engineering for analysis using Capture Data, the next step was to remove any 3rd party software Extensions, LaunchAgents and LaunchDaemons and any Startup Items at the root level "Macintosh HD", by placing them in the Trash, BUT NOT EMPTYING THE TRASH because you could do nasty things to the computer. These files are in /Library/Extensions, /Library/LaunchAgents, /Library/LaunchDaemons, /Library/StartupItems. Since I was also running Norton Internet Security, I thought that I'd remove that also since it plants executable code in various folders. Just deleting the app leaves all sorts of stuff behind and I used a Terminal command string, available from Norton, that removes all the Norton associated files.

After doing all this and rebooting my iMac, I have successfully run Time Machine twice with the My Cloud in AFP mode. And both times the backup file verified as OK. As I type this, I'm ⅔ of the way through a third complete backup after replacing all the Extensions, LaunchAgents and LaunchDaemons - BUT NOT NORTON. If this backup completes and the file verifies OK, my next step is to reinstall Norton Internet Security and try running another backup. If after putting Norton back, it still works, it will be a muckin fistery, but plausible as I did get rid of a fair bit of older software that I had not used in 5+ years, therefore, not likely to ever need. Not a good example of a controlled experiment as there were too many variables. If adding Norton back causes backups to fail again then I'll be caught twixt Apple and Norton to find a solution or another AV program.

Stay tuned to this station .... Regards ... Chris

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Answer 5

Jul 13, 2020 12:14 PM in response to Chris Lyons

Paul;

After all my experimenting and lots of waiting for Time Machine to do its thing I learned two things. Apple does not support 3rd party NAS devices nor will they engage in meaningful dialog AND when I removed Norton Internet Security from my iMac and my wife's MacBook Pro, Time Machine completes backups without any problem. With the MyCoud configured in AFP with the Time Machine "switch" set to ON. My conclusion is that something in the macOS 10.15.5 Supplemental update broke Time Machine when Norton is installed. I shall now try and get the message to Norton to fix their problem.

I hope that this help those who may read this thread. At least I've got my immediate problem solved.

Chris

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Answer 6

Barney-15E

Level 10

122,144 points

Jun 15, 2020 10:15 AM in response to PaulRSte

Try removing all backups of that Mac from the drive, check your quotas for SMB sharing, and make sure you connect to the Time Machine backup via SMB (maybe by removing any AFP sharing from the NAS).

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Answer 7

Jul 11, 2020 12:21 PM in response to Barney-15E

Actually, my experiment is that Time Machine does work over SMB with the WD My Cloud EX2 Ultra that I have. The downside is that the macOS does not "see" the SMB volume and it has to be mouthed on the Desktop. Once there, the Time Machine app can be told to use the designated share for backups. See my "term paper" below.

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Answer 8

PaulRSte Author

Level 1

18 points

Jul 13, 2020 1:50 PM in response to Chris Lyons

Chris

3rd Party NAS Devices? I thought that that was the only type. I know Apple used to produce one but it's gone the same way as the airport wifi hubs. I do know there's a lot of issues with NAS drives on Catalina, not just WD either. I've seen quite a few posts for Synology kit as well along similar lines to this post. The WD MyCloud Home devices are in a real bad way. It seems that not only will they not support SMB 3, but it seems that WD missed the bit about Catalina not supporting 32-bit apps. Their app is essential to the way that the "Home" series works and so those users are really stuffed at present.

You didn't have a firmware upgrade for your WD did you, about the time that your problems started? That's what seemed to break mine or was at least the initiator to nearly 2 months of problems.

Good luck with the Norton thing anyway. If you have any further queries on this then just post on here.

Best wishes

Paul

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Answer 9

Jul 22, 2020 11:44 AM in response to PaulRSte

Paul;

I am not aware of a firmware upgrade to the WD EX2 Ultra, but it may well have happened as I had it set to auto update. What I do know is that within a day of updating to 10.15.5 Supplemental my TimeMachine backups broke. Apple recently release macOS 10.15.6 and I have not mustered the patience to try installing Norton to see if they fixed anything in the macOS. If I do, I'll be sure to post it here.

Cheers ... Chris

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Answer 10

PaulRSte Author

Level 1

18 points

Jun 18, 2020 9:06 AM in response to Barney-15E

Hi Barney-15E

There's an issue with Finder, supposedly in Catalina but I think it predates it, that when a network share is mounted (AFP or SMB) by selecting the device and then the share on the device, an attempt to open the folder from finder causes the window to close and gives the error message

The operation can’t be completed because the original item for “folder name” can’t be found.

Note that I had this same issue connecting to a share on a Linux PC.

It is therefore impossible to see the contents of the folder and perform operations upon them. NB that this also applies to backup discs selected from the Time Machine interface and to shares mounted by using e.g.

"sudo tmutil setdestination smb://guest:guest@192.168.1.71/TimeMachineBackup" as in WD answer id

https://support-en.wd.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/21360

Using "Connect to Server" from the "Go" menu in Finder (or the CMD-k shortcut) allows the folders to be opened and gives access to the subfolders and files.

A couple of questions then:-

Which folders and/or files need to be deleted and from where?
Is it worth taking a copy of the backup file(s) before I delete it. I have read in "man tmutil" that it should be possible to inherit a previous backup. The terminology does get a bit daunting though.

Kind regards

Paul

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Answer 11

PaulRSte Author

Level 1

18 points

Jun 20, 2020 8:04 AM in response to PaulRSte

I have also been running this issues past WD Support on the basis of:- "SMB3 has been supported on WD My Cloud since April 2017. How was this change implemented for existing users without them losing access to their current backup please?"

After getting me to run some diagnostics, their response was as below headed "WD Support Response." In light of their response is there any way of passing these details directly to support please?

Kind regards

Paul

WD Support Response

Staff Account (Victoria A)

18-Jun-2020 06:16:00 PM

Dear Stephenson Paul Robert

Thank you for your reply.

If you can access My Cloud shares through the Network section of your Finder, have enabled file sharing over SMB, and initiate Time Machine backup as per our instructions in the article 21360 we have provided, and backup would not start, we recommend to contact to contact Apple support, as they are developers of this utility. Your system can see My Cloud device but Time Machine does not work correctly.

https://support.apple.com/contact

If you have any further questions, please reply to this email and we will be happy to assist you further.

Sincerely,

Victoria A

Western Digital Technical Support

http://support-en.wd.com

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Answer 12

Barney-15E

Level 10

122,144 points

Jun 28, 2020 10:43 AM in response to PaulRSte

I also need to be able to stop the AFP connection automatically happening. I thought that there might be something in AFP.conf but it looks as though it's in binary or encrypted. It could also be something that's in the bonjour configuration. Can anyone help with this please?

Are you talking about the WDMyCloud config files? That is where you need to disable AFP.

I gave up on WD long ago, so I have no idea how their NAS is configured.

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Answer 13

Jul 1, 2020 11:42 AM in response to PaulRSte

Thanks PaulRSte. I followed your instructions to enable the MyCloud to mount as an SMB server. I also did not enable Time Machine in the MyCloud settings since that forces AFP to be turned on. However, after all that my backup still fails even though the TM share is mounted as a SMB volume. The only downside that I see from having SMB shares on MyCloud is that my iMac does not "see" the volume and it has to be mounted manually or set to mount at start up - no big deal. Time Machine remembers the path to the SMB share and "finds" the backup share even though there is no mounted icon on the desktop. Right now I've restarted the backup after a failure and it picked up where it left off. A freakin' mystery. Looks like I need to set aside another morning to intimate a new Apple support person. ARGHHH !!

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Answer 14

PaulRSte Author

Level 1

18 points

Jun 15, 2020 10:06 AM in response to Barney-15E

Support introduced April 12th 2017 as following extract from the current release notes shows:-

https://support.wdc.com/download/notes/WD_My_Cloud_Firmware_Release_Notes_04.05.00-342.pdf?v=409

Firmware Version 04.05.00-315 (04/12/2017)
Resolved Issues:

- Enhanced SMB server (samba) to support Apple Time Machine protocol extensions.
- Enhanced SMB server (samba) to operate using SMB-3 protocol by default.
- Resolved critical security vulnerabilities.
- Improved MyCloud Cloud connectivity across MyCloud web, mobile & client apps.
- Added analytics for network connection configuration.
- Resolved issue where analytics logs were not updated as expected.

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Answer 15

PaulRSte Author

Level 1

18 points

Jul 10, 2020 10:00 AM in response to Chris Lyons

Hi Chris Lyons

Sorry it's been a while to get back to you on this. I've been trying to collate everything together to provide a better answer to you. I've still not finished yet but if I could just have a little information please, i.e. what generation and model MyCloud are you running and which version of the firmware? Please note that currently WD MyCloud Home does not work with SMB3.

Note that I have tried turning AFP off like you mentioned but Time Machine would not run as "The network backup disk does not support the required capabilities." I had to turn that back on so this is why I'm wondering about which model you have and also what error were you getting? I do know that the gen1 and gen2 have totally different hardware and so run on a different set of firmware versions, 4 for Gen 1, and 2 for Gen 2.

The easiest way to map the network share automatically is as follows:-

Go to the desktop and find the TimeMachineBackup icon.
Right click on this and select "Show Info".
Find the "Server" info. It should show something like smb://WDMyCloud/TimeMachineBackup. Note that if it shows as WDMyCloud.local then that is wrong and you need to set MAC Backups to ON in theWD Dashboard, close it down and then follow my previous notes in remapping the share with SMB again.
If the URL is correct then go into Settings on your MAC, open Users & Groups, Select your user name, select "Login Items", then drag the TimeMachineBackup icon from your desktop into the Login Items.
After checking that this is working ok, you can tick the "Hide" box to stop this step showing at login.

Regards

Paul

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Time Machine not backing up to WD My Cloud on Catalina

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