User profile for user: DaveLoveHatesApple
DaveLoveHatesApple Author
User level: Level 1
22 points

How do I convince Apple support that my iPad battery is the problem?

I have a 1st gen iPad Pro 12.9". It's 4.5 years old. A week ago it started repeatedly rebooting about two minutes after boot. When booted it shows battery at 3% or 4% but once showed it at 100% (though it still shut down after a minute or two). At the Apple store it wouldn't boot on a standard 1.5A (7.5W) charger or from a 2.1A (10.5W) portable battery. It required the 3.6A (18W) charger from an iPhone 11 Pro to boot at all.


Once booted we were unable to run the diagnostic because it would power down too quickly. But we were able to go into settings and look at the log of kernel panics. The most recent panic was five days before the Apple store appointment, and the phone had shut down and rebooted at least 20 times since then, including four or five times in the Apple store. So these shutdowns were not being caused by kernel panics, which the Apple tech said they would be if this were a hardware problem, not a battery problem.


However, he ultimately declared this to be a hardware problem, not a battery problem because he said he looked in some document that said that this iPad model would draw its power directly from the charging wire, rather than the wire charging the battery and the iPad drawing from the battery. Thus, if it's plugged in and still won't stay running, the battery is not the problem.


This is a really big deal because replacing the iPad due to the battery costs $99 and replacing the iPad for any other reason costs $599. I think the tech's conclusion is wrong and it's unfair to make me pay $599 for a bad battery. Could I please get your help in putting together my argument for the $99 price?


* What document would he have read that said that about drawing power from the charging cable? Can anyone find a document to the contrary? I don't think this argument is valid because I replaced the battery of a 2013 Macbook Air. Before the battery replacement the battery had to be charged for about 10 minutes before it would boot, and then it would run all day while plugged in. So even though it was drawing its power generally from the cord it still required some amount of functioning battery to boot. Once I replaced the battery it would boot instantly when plugged in, even if we had run the battery down to where the machine shut off.


* The tech expected to find kernel panics in the analytics and said that these would indicate it was a hardware problem, not battery. He was surprised to not find them, but then changed his argument to the charging cable one. Do kernel panic logs always show up after a kernel panic? If an iPad shuts down spontaneously without leaving a kernel panic log, why is that happening? Any reason besides dead battery?


* This iPad seems to draw a lot of current. Back when it worked, if battery was half full and iPad was being used while plugged into a 1.5A (7.5W) charger we would generally see the battery level go down, not up. This would be unheard of on an iPhone, where using it while charging is the norm. As I see it, what's happening now is that it's drawing all the current its power circuitry allows for a device of this era (2015 before "fast charging") and is supplementing this with battery. But since the battery has failed, it can only do this for a minute or two and that's why it shuts down. Getting a new battery would allow it to run for many hours while plugged in or not plugged in.


* How many amps can this iPad actually draw while plugged in? How many amps can it draw from battery?


* The fair way to resolve this would be to actually replace the battery. If that fixes it, I pay $99. If it doesn't, I pay $599. But Apple is unwilling to actually replace the battery of this iPad and instead only offers replacement. This is unfair since it prevents us from establishing the truth that the battery was the problem.


* Since going to the Apple store when plugged into a 3.6A (18W) charger it now begins booting to the Apple logo and then shuts down after 30 seconds. It never gets to a normal screen. I would argue that the battery is holding even less of a charge so it's not supplementing the charger power as long as it was before.


Anyone have other thoughts or ways to frame my position to help me get treated fairly here?


Thanks,

Dave

Posted on Jul 2, 2020 11:55 AM

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User profile for user: DaveLoveHatesApple
DaveLoveHatesApple Author
User level: Level 1
22 points

Jul 2, 2020 3:46 PM in response to MichelPM

Thanks.

Well, I called Apple and as soon as I told him that the small 1.5A charger didn't work but the 18W charger did he agreed that the battery was the problem and he was fine to handle it for $99. So that's much better than the in-store tech.


The only nuance is that it looks like they will in fact be replacing the battery of my existing one. Weird. This is suggested by the fact that he read me some stuff about water damage and when they open it up if they see signs of water damage then it won't be $99. And also they didn't have an option to cross-ship the replacement. He said they're sending me a box, then I will send in my iPad, then they will replace the battery, and then they will send it back. It could be that they swap it for a different one instead, but it sounds pretty likely that they'll actually replace the battery. Interesting.

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User profile for user: apfelkopf
apfelkopf
User level: Level 5
7,321 points

Jul 2, 2020 11:59 AM in response to DaveLoveHatesApple

Sorry if I'm missing important information but I stopped reading when I read that you determined it's a battery problem. Are you saying Apple will not install a new battery if you ask for it because they think it's a hardware problem? In my mind they should replace the battery if you want them to replace the battery since you are paying for it anyway. Have you reached out to support via phone/chat? Because I have had a bad Apple store experience in the past and phone support ended up coming through for me.

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User profile for user: DaveLoveHatesApple
DaveLoveHatesApple Author
User level: Level 1
22 points

Jul 2, 2020 12:24 PM in response to apfelkopf

Apple tells me that for iPads they don't actually replace your battery. It's too hard because the screen is glued on. Instead they swap out the whole iPad. Thus, I can't just say "Please replace the battery. Here's $99." They replied with "We have to replace the whole iPad. That will be either $99 or $599 depending on whether the problem is the battery or something else."

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User profile for user: DaveLoveHatesApple
DaveLoveHatesApple Author
User level: Level 1
22 points

Jul 2, 2020 12:59 PM in response to apfelkopf

I agree that it's not impossible to replace an iPad's battery; it's just that Apple doesn't do it. I talked to one third-party company that does it, but their policy is to only do it when also replacing the screen because the probability of breaking the screen is so high because of the glue.

I will call them and try to get them to do the $99 replacement. The purpose of this thread is to prepare me for that conversation. Since I failed to convince the tech in the store I want to be more prepared next time.

Thanks for the link to Apple's battery repair page. That will be handy to have open.

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User profile for user: MichelPM
MichelPM
User level: Level 10
81,771 points

Jul 2, 2020 4:07 PM in response to DaveLoveHatesApple

You'll want to take a lot of photos/images of your iPad before shipping it.

Also, you'll want to insure your iPad for its full value when preparing to ship it to Apple.

Depending on how sturdy/robust Apple's shipping box is, you may want to consider using an additional larger shipping box and double box this iPad and use other internal packing materials to pack the internal box well inside of the other outer, larger packing box, to ensure/insure against any damage of your iPad in shipping and handling either from the shipping company or by Apple upon receipt.


Best of Luck to You!

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User profile for user: MichelPM
MichelPM
User level: Level 10
81,771 points

Jul 2, 2020 1:07 PM in response to DaveLoveHatesApple

Apple and Apple Stores do not ever repair iPads.

They issue in or out of warranty device replacements, in lieu of an actual repair, at a cost based either on a battery repair cost OR other iOS device repair cost.

Apple will NOT do an actual battery replacement on iPads..


Since your iPad's battery is too far failed for them to be able to fairly diagnose the device, I believe this is why the Apple Store only gave you the ONLY option to simply pay the more expensive iOS device damage replacement costs instead of the much cheaper battery replacement costs.


I suggest contacting/reaching out to Apple Product support and services.

Tap on the first link below and scroll down some to get to the Apple Product Support section and phone numbers for your location/region.


https://www.apple.com/contact/


OR


https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201232


You will have to do the convincing to Apple customer phone support employees that you iPad Pro issue is completely battery related as phone support will NOT be able to do a remote diagnosis.

If no joy initially, you can calmly ask to have your iPad Pro battery issue escalated up to more senior level Apple phone support employees and plead your battery failure case to them and see what the senior support Apple team members will, or won’t do for you.



Best of Luck to You!

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How do I convince Apple support that my iPad battery is the problem?

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