It's like the calculator missing in iPadOS.
There is the third party AppCleaner at least which is good and free at least but Apple is frustating me sometimes.
Some people probably don't realize that their old third party apps are still stocking files ont their hard drive years later I guess. A built-in solution should be there
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The problem is not all developers pay attention to fine detail when it comes to properly installing and uninstalling their software. This is a cross-platform problem on ALL operating systems. Developers spend a great deal of time on the software itself but they are not SysAdmins and they don't understand how things work in the operating system in the same way.
Windows suffers the same problems. On Windows there is Revo Uninstaller. On macOS there are several similar utilities to remove left over junk. But again, it's ultimately up to the developers. Ventura added an SMAppService API to handle helper executables within an App bundle so they can be executed when trashing the App. I've seen this prior to Ventura but it was only for removing a SystemExtension. What's new is all the extra potential to remove other fluff. Such an executable helper could also clean out configuration files and settings in Library folders.
"In macOS 13 and later, use SMAppService to register and control LoginItems, LaunchAgents, and LaunchDaemons as helper executables for your app. "
That means the developers can definitely uninstall LoginItems, LaunchAgents, and LaunchDaemons when the App is trashed. If they use the new API system call SMAppService. This was announced at WWDC2022. Apple is listening and has added this capability now it's up to the developers to actually use it in their Apps.
Ultimately, it's always up to the software developer to construct an installation and removal process that is reliable and clean. Sadly too many are not doing a good job of it. There are exceptions, but they are few and far between.
I would love to see Apple publish some best practices white papers for developers that are easy to find. Maybe include references to them in Xcode. Specific topics to include how to install your software and ensure it can be fully uninstalled. With some detailed examples and even a sample project and tutorial.
The topic is vast and complex and will vary quite a bit but developers need to learn how to install and uninstall their software properly. Commercial software vendors need to start taking it seriously. Even Microsoft had to write Fix-It packages that run scripts to uninstall Office on Windows among other things. For macOS, Microsoft released an Office-Reset tool which is just some packages to reset Office to defaults and to remove Office Apps. Looking at these packages in Suspicious Package I can see it's really just scripts to clean up things just like a typical Fix-It package.
Suspicious Package is a great tool to examine the contents of a macOS installation package. Primarily you would need to know what to look for in regards to finding a malicious payload. But it definitely documents what the package is doing and where everything is going so you can use it to help you manually clean up residue left over after removing the app. Another tool called, Apparency will examine an App bundle.
So again, it's a complex problem that plagues the entire computing industry and has not been fully solved for any operating system.
I"m basing my recommendations on hundreds of topics here in these forums where CMM was installed and when uninstalled fixed the problem. Plus the fact that it's not needed, frequent shutdowns and booting back up will do much of that. Also Safe Mode boot occasionally will do even more.
However, you can believe whatever you like as the final decision is yours.
Since uninstaller are available from the app's providers and there are some good cleaner apps available, why should Apple need to also provide one? We can't speak for why Apple does or does not do something. That is up to them to decide.
Ok, alright. But even big developpers don't provide uninstallers everytime: Microsoft says just put their Mac app in the trash. For example, I just found that the Microsoft Teams app (which I put in the trash and deleted a while ago) had 1.66GB of file in the ~/Library/Application Support folder! I would love to see a system notification prompt me to remove the 1,66 GB of junk! If I had use AppCleaner app, me I know this app but not does everyone! I was stupid of not using it, right?
Excuse my english...
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Yeah, with the App Store, no problem.
It does know better how much storage is used by the apps. It just doesn't provide the location, but they are well-known locations. It's not difficult.
Ok thanks for clarifying thing about the System preferences' storage management.
I think every app should be required to tell the user exactly what it installs and where.
I agree with that. I still think Apple should also show the potential leftovers.
Actually a third party app like CleanMyMac and AppCleaner knows the files stored accross you mac for each apps you have in Applications folder.
CleanMyMac is the worst app you could run on your Mac. It is responsible for more problems in these forums than any other app. Most of the experienced contributors here consider it akin to malware.
I've never had a problem using the app provided uninstaller. What problems do you have with those. The App Developer is the only person that knows where the files are installed, so they should be the ones to make the app to remove those parts.
I've never seen a removed app "stock" any files on my Mac. When installed and operating, they do create data that belongs to me which I can delete if I want. I guess I'm confused as to your understanding of how this all works.
Ok, great for you. Good point for a conflict it may cause. For the space, I'm concerned, don't even have space to update to Ventura 13.3. I will start be removing the 1.66 GB Microsoft Teams' leftover!
Thanks for your answer. Of course I can do that! I have a hard drive which I use for Time Machine primarly. Personally, I prefer to use the cloud to upload some GB because it goes well and it makes space on my computer when I click on free up space (for Onedrive). I will do this in the next month, no stress
You are most welcome. A couple of additional thoughts. I suggest using different external drive for your file transfers. Best to use a Time Machine backup disk only for that purpose. Second. keep in mind that iCloud is not a backup service for Macs. It is designed for cross platform sharing, although it does have some backup features.
Thanks for you reply. You right than I should not install an app without an unistaller but that's not always given. Storage management in settings sure doesn't know better files locations and the storage they occupy than some mac cleaning apps.
My point it still that there are better things Apple could do in this area.
Have a nice day.
blockchainomg wrote:
which is a good site, right?
It's an ad. CleanMyMac is successful primarily because it paints the internet in ads. Don't let anyone tell you that advertising isn't effective. Advertising is extremely effective.
Ok, yeah but also Macworld says: "Any recommendation (or criticism) is based on our experts believing that the product is the best (or not the best) in its class."
Yes surely Microsoft and Windows have the same problems. It's interesting, SMAppService API, but could it also cleans Application Support, caches folders?
I agree there are things to improve for all systems.
Thanks for your best answer.
Alright thanks to for the warning.
By the way, I just discovered that AppCleaner was not able to find the Application support folder that was in Google/Chrome path which I find by myself. Nothing is perfect.
macOS Ventura doesn't include a complete app uninstaller because Apple wants files to accumulate in your mac?
