Why doesn't Time Machine Backup show iCloud synced files in history?

Sorry for the late reply. Had a Time Machine backup issue, lol.

Some of the other posters have mentioned key points already, but I'll put in my thoughts and hopefully clarify as best as possible.

I've read over similar issues/complaints about Time Machine and iCloud for a few years, and I, like many, have things I wished worked a certain way. Some do, some don't.

The first important thing to clarify is the difference between iCloud and iCloud Drive and how they function. Many people use both terms interchangeably, but to avoid confusion, don't. iCloud is just the main synching and storage service Apple offers for your files. Depending on your settings, this will function in specific ways.

Your iCloud Drive is just a specific location (think of it as if you had an external drive connected with whatever files you have inside it) where you store your chosen files. These files will take up physical storage space on your Mac's internal storage. This is where "Optimize Mac Storage" within "System Settings" plays a key role. If you have "optimize" turned on, then for files, apps, etc., that are inside iCloud Drive, they will be like an alias/shortcut to the actual files that are fully stored on Apple's iCloud servers for you.

For those files/apps that you recently have opened and/or previewed, the full file/app is now taking the full physical space on your internal Mac's drive. After some time (time is determined by your computer system, NOT you) of not opening/previewing these said files, they will become an alias/shortcut once more, in turn reducing the file size and conserving your internal Mac's storage space. That's the key point of "Optimize". You can always choose what is fully on your Mac's drive and what is only on iCloud servers. That's what the "cloud" symbol is all about. This is referred to as "Download" or "Remove Download". There's a faster way to download or remove download from entire folders and any sub-folders with all related files, rather than one at a time.

Again, don't get confused thinking iCloud Drive's contents are fully and physically present on your Mac's internal drive. No "cloud" icon means they are, the "cloud" icon means they aren't fully there, but are stored on the iCloud servers. Most importantly is to be aware that this is all about keeping those files/apps synced with your other Apple devices. Don't think of this as a backup, because that is not technically what it is. It's like when people use the Trash can as a temporary storage place. Don't do that; it leads to confusion and deleting stuff you may not have wanted to. Hopefully, you wouldn't do that with an actual physical trash can. That's not its purpose.

Now, Time Machine. This is your actual backup (in a sort). As you may have read elsewhere, it's a good idea to have 3-4 backups on separate devices and locations if your files are that important. I keep all my files pretty well organized, and yes, I have a system I'm comfortable with and works for me. The Time Machine backup is something you should do regularly, but from experience, whenever done, don't go around moving or deleting stuff. Trust me, I've made that mistake!

Be aware that if you delete any file/app within your iCloud Drive from any device, it will delete it from ALL devices. This is why so many have restated to not think of iCloud Drive as a backup because it is not. It is just another drive that is synced with your other devices.

When you run Time Machine to back up your computer, the contents within your iCloud Drive are backed up in the state they are currently in. Meaning, that if any of those files/apps have the cloud icon, only the small size alias is backed up and not the full file/app that is stored in iCloud servers. So, should you need to restore that file/app from a Time Machine backup, it probably won't be available since it is just pointing to the actual real file/app unless you haven't deleted it and it is still on the iCloud servers from Apple.

If possible, get a separate external drive to copy and backup all your important files/apps (if able, all the contents of your internal drive) making sure that they are the actual full-size files/apps (if your internal drive's storage space permits) to back up to that external drive. This is the best, in my opinion, approach to make sure you back up everything you have. Once that is done, then on a separate external drive do your Time Machine backup of those same full-size files/apps.

Do you also keep your photos and videos within the Photos app? There is a safer and more practical approach to back up, also depending if, within the actual Photo's app, you have "Optimize Mac Storage" or "Download Originals to this Mac". I can send a link to a video explaining how to do this.

As with most people, I think, we have smaller internal storage drives on our Macs and then opt to buy external drives to expand storage capacity since most internal drives on Macs are usually quite pricey. I understand everybody's situation is different. I highly recommend viewing videos from MacMost on Gary Rosenzweig's website or his YouTube channel. I've learned a lot over the years with him. I've been on Apple computers since the 1980s so I think I've acquired a certain degree of know-how 😎 .

In God's Harmony

Any help here?

léonie

Apr 7, 2020 11:31 PM in response to MichaelGli2

Time Machine will backup iCloud Drive, as long as you have not enabled "Optimise Mac Storage". If "Optimise ..." is enabled, it will be a game of chance, which documents have been downloaded from iCloud are locally available on your computer, when Time Machine is running.

Does Time Machine backup iCloud Drive? - Apple Community

Well, according to what I read, if "Optimize Mac Storage" is checked then you have no control over what will or will not be backed up that's in iCloud, Apple & the OS will choose.

The iCloud service is a combination of backup and sync. It stores your files on its cloud servers. That is the backup. Any files that you have on your computer within iCloud Drive are backed up, whether they have the cloud icon or not, and synced with your other Apple devices if you've set it up to do so.

To clarify, any file that has the cloud icon is fully stored on Apple's iCloud servers, but only the alias/shortcut is stored on your computer. Files within your iCloud Drive on your computer that do not have the cloud icon (these are the full actual files) are both stored locally on your computer as well as on Apple's iCloud servers.

Anything that exists on a physical drive on any of your devices within the iCloud drive also exists on Apple's iCloud servers. Deleting any file from any of your devices will also delete it from Apple's servers due to the syncing process. If what you want is to be able to delete a file that resides within iCloud Drive on your computer, but have it remain intact on Apple's servers as your backup, then understand it is not possible to do both. You can't delete a file from iCloud Drive and have it remain on Apple's iCloud servers because that would defeat the syncing portion of the service.

iCloud is a combination of simultaneous syncing with backup storage. You can't separate the two features.

This is why I suggest having a complete backup of all that is important on a separate external drive. You should consider having one external drive for Time Machine (hopefully with the full-size files/app at the time of backing up), and another external drive for a full backup of the full-size files. On that drive you can later delete, add, etc. as you want, just don't do that from the Time Machine drive because it will cause havoc on the file structure. Time Machine has a complex system of backing up. It works differently than just dragging or copying/pasting to an external drive.

In God's Harmony

L3LL3 wrote:

My hope is that Apple changes this and introduces a backup that works in iCloud as well (or at least clarifies that Time Machine is a terrible choice if "Optimize Mac Storage" is activated.

You can tell Apple what you'd like to see here:

Product Feedback - Apple

I realize it's been a year since this post, but I hope you were able to resolve your situation and understand how Time Machine and iCloud Drive with/without Optimize works. If not, I'd be happy to give my explanation of how it works.

You are welcome. I believe that Time Machine should be redesigned so it downloads full files located within iCloud Drive on the local computer during the backup process, just as they are on the iCloud servers. This seems to be essential for those with smaller internal hard drives. Not everyone has a large enough internal drive to store all within iCloud Drive, hence why many need to choose "Optimize" within System Settings. Having to fully download individual files/folders and monitoring local disk space while making a backup to an external drive becomes very tedious. Just a thought.

In God's Harmony

L3LL3 wrote:

IdrisSeabright wrote:

You can tell Apple what you'd like to see here:

Product Feedback - Apple

That's already done. I have very little hope that it matters though. Apple seldom cares about single opinions :(

You don't know, however, it this is a single opinion. It could be that lots of other people are making the same suggestion. Yours may be the one that makes that pushes it over the line into something that Apple will look at.

L3LL3 wrote:

Sure, but from own experience Apple don't really care about feedback, nor about bug reports. Nevertheless, in this case the company should really have used their own heads from the start ;)

There are some recent examples of how feedback changed Apple's mind. Notably how watch faces are changed on an Apple Watch. With the release of watchOS 10, Apple changed it from a simple swipe to a press then swipe (probably due to all of the feedback complaining about how easy it was to accidentally change a face). Many people didn't like it. Much feedback was submitted. Apple shortly added a toggle switch. They did not, however, make changes to what happens when you swipe up on the Apple Watch, even though people provided feedback about that as well.

Do I suspect, in this case Apple is not going to make the change? Yes. But I think it's probably because they did use their heads and they have reasons for doing it this way. But, you never know.

No idea, but iCloud is no backup, stuff can go away in the blink of an eye, it's meant for syncing between devices, but I've seen them synced to non existent.