Macbook Pro M3 Dual External Display Support

LRLLRL wrote:

I have the exact same technical problems plus closet full of every conceivable cable and hubs, slitters and docking stations. No solution and going broke.it seems to me that someone(s) have solution.

You can now use two external displays with a MacBook Pro that has the base M3 chip – when the lid is closed.

Use dual monitors with your MacBook Air and MacBook Pro with M3 chip - Apple Support

You will need to be running macOS Sonoma 14.6 or later. MacBook Airs and MacBook Pros with base M3 chips both have hardware support for driving a second external display (with limitations on resolution) when the lid is closed. With the M3 MacBook Airs, software to take advantage of that hardware was there from day one. With M3 MacBook Pros, it wasn't. So, at first, their specifications said they had a limit of one external display.

Now Apple has revised the MacBook Pro Technical Specifications to read

"M3

• Simultaneously supports full native resolution on the built-in display at 1 billion colors and:
• One external display with up to 6K resolution at 60Hz
• Close the MacBook Pro lid to use a second external display with up to 5K resolution at 60Hz"

But unless you are running macOS Sonoma 14.6 or later, you cannot take advantage of the feature.

<< that it can not handle a simple task like that. >>

Your old MacBook Pro 13-in did not support billions of colors, and was limited to external displays 2560 by 1440, just under 4 million pixels (on each of two external displays).

Your new Mac M-series (plain) directly supports a high-end display like, for example, the Apple Studio Display, which supports billions of colors, and features 5120 by 2880 pixels. That is just short of 15 million pixels at deeper color than was previously available, and that is short of the Mac's full capability -- it could drive a 6K display if one were commonly available.

As I read it, 'just the right' ONE external display can easily put up more than four times the number of pixels of the old MacBook Pro retina 2013 supports, and does that on one display instead of demanding TWO. This may not match the way older computers forced you to work, since older computers were not able to support a really large external display. But it is NOT a defect. The spec was available long before you could purchase the computer.

To support more fully-hardware-accelerated displays, each supported display requires some Hardware -- it requires a rasterizer/display-generator for each such display. (it also require a wide enough pathway to RAM memory to support moving that much data, more than 60 times a second, without fail).

If TWO fully hardware accelerated external displays (rather than the amount of information that could be displayed) is a requirement for your work, you need a more capable computer than Apple's entry level M-series(plain) processor MacBook Pro. That IS available (at extra cost).

NOTE: Apple has said they are working on changes that would allow the entry-level MacBook Pro M3(plain) to work like the Macbook Air M3(plain) and support an additional external display when the internal display is turned off. At this writing, the availability date for that feature has not yet been made available.

withinsight wrote:

My employer provided me with a Macbook Pro with the base M3 (not M3 Pro) chip, which only supports 1 single external monitor. Following the advice in this article, I've tried:

Anker USB-C to Dual HDMI• . Didn't support dual external monitors in extended mode (only mirror).

Baesus USB 6-in-1 Docking Station• . USB-C ports didn't support video with this adapter.

Startech USB to Dual HDMI• . Supports 2 monitors, using InstantView software.

However, the lag is so great with this third adapter that its unusable. Everything from mouse movement to the mission control gesture is so slow that its not acceptable for a work environment. You lose track of the mouse cursor when its on either of the external monitors. I've worked with Startech support, and tried everything from reinstalling the drivers, rebooting, upgrading the firmware on my 2 external Samsung monitors, changing the resolutions to "low resolution" mode, and the lag still persists.

Looking at the description of the StarTech adapter, I see that its workaround is "built with Silicon Motion's Content Adaptive Technology."

You could try a workaround based on DisplayLink, a competing workaround technology from Synaptics. OWC and SonnetTech sell dual-HDMI DisplayLink adapters, and SonnetTech sells a dual-DisplayPort DisplayLink one. I can't guarantee that your experience with the DisplayLink adapters is going to be any better than that with the StarTech one, but since the workaround technology is different, the experience might be better.

I think it is safe to say that none of the workaround technologies are going to make you very happy if what you are trying to do is to work with quickly-changing screen content, e.g., for video editing, or for gaming.

If you need the best video quality, the solution is to stick with the single monitor that your M3 MBP supports, or to get your employer to exchange your MBP for one with a M3 Pro or M3 Max chip. There is no hub or adapter that can give you extra first-class hardware-supported display outputs.

I'm at a point where I feel I'm out of answers. I know Apple is going to say "we don't officially support this", but the reality is this machine was not my choice, and I have a multi-monitor work environment that I need to use this machine in (and I'm likely not alone in this scenario).

If the reality is that you have a multi-monitor work environment in which you need to use a laptop, then the reality also is that your employer should have selected a laptop that supports two or more monitors. Apple doesn't hide the information on how many displays each of their laptops support – they put it right in Technical Specifications, which any competent IT Department or Purchasing Department should have been able to read.

Apple-Silicon 2020 M1 13-in MacBook Pro and Air and subsequent models with M-series (plain) processors are extremely-capable entry-level computers. They can support the internal display AND an External display up to the previously unheard of size of the Apple 6K display at billions of colors. But only ONE in addition to the internal display.

This may not match the way older computers forced you to work, since older computers were not able to support a really large external display. But it is NOT a defect. The spec was available long before you could purchase the computer.

The Apple standard for its built-in hardware-accelerated displays, makes them suitable for full-motion video for production/display of cinema-quality video with NO dropped frames, and NO dropouts or partial-blank scan lines due to memory under-runs or other issues. This requires a hardware rasterizer/display-generator for each fully-accelerated display.

If you need more hardware-accelerated displays than the built-in and ONE external display, and an un-accelerated iPad if desired, you probably need a more capable computer.

If you are doing ONLY program listings, spreadsheets, stock quotes and other slow to change data, there are some other solutions, but they require you to make some strong compromises.

Executive summary: More than ONE additional Hardware-accelerated display can NOT be added to the entry-level 13-in or 15-in M1 or M2 systems.

Jurias9 wrote:

What is more infuriating about this issue is that the M3 MacBook Air which uses the same chip as the made M3 MacBook pro is able to use up to 2 additional displays when the lid is closed which is fine.

With the lid closed. Which indicates that the M3 – like the M1 and M2 before it – is limited to two displays total. Apple added extra hardware and software to the M3 MacBook Airs – and maybe to the M3 chip itself – to allow you to switch one display output between the internal screen (lid open) and an external screen lid closed).

The second display output has a lower "up to 5K resolution" limit. If you are using a 4K monitor, that translates into losing the Retina scaling options between Retina "UI looks like 2560x1440" and non-retina 3840x2160. (It appears that the resolution limit applies to the pixel-doubled internal canvas, which for Retina "like 2560x1440" mode would have a resolution of 5120x2880 pixels, or 5K.)

Having to sacrifice the internal screen, and some of the Retina scaling options for the second screen, does not seem very attractive to me if you know that you are going to want to use two external screens in the first place. Why not go ahead and buy a machine that is designed to do what you claim that you need?

It doesn’t seem like a matter of capability but a matter of pushing you to buy the M3 PRO version of the MacBook Pro if you want to use 2 monitors or downgrade to an air which seems like a dirty business strategy.

It's not a "dirty business strategy." For any particular generation of Apple Silicon chips, as you go up the line from base chip to Pro to Max to Ultra, higher-end chips tend to get more of all sorts of things: CPU cores, GPU cores, RAM capacity, SoC-RAM bandwidth, etc. A Max chip that has a lot of CPU and GPU cores needs higher SOC-RAM bandwidth than a base chip, and this translates into the Max chip being surrounded by more RAM dies so that the Max chip can have more read/write operations to and from RAM "in flight".

There are advantages and disadvantages to this design strategy, but it is a design choice. And just because Apple doesn't give you all of the high-end features on the cheapest chip does not make it a "dirty business strategy."

Most people don’t need the M3pro or M3max, the majority of the people who buy a MacBook Pro over the Air is because of the extra ports or the cooling and the better build.

The 14" M3 MacBook Pro is the first MacBook Pro with a 'base' chip to get the Mini-LED-backlit display, the HDMI port, the SDXC slot, and the cooling. The 13" M1 and M2 MacBook Pros were very similar to 13" MacBook Airs – with some differences, like having a Touch Bar where the Airs had regular function keys.

All of these MacBook Pros are conceptual descendants of low-end 13" Intel MacBook Pros that had older Intel processors and only two USB-C (Thunderbolt 3) ports.

According to 9to5Mac, Apple has said that the M3 MacBook Pro will gain the same display support (& the same display limitations) as the M3 MacBook Airs in a future software update.

9to5Mac (March 4, 2024) – M3 MacBook Pro will gain multi-display support in software update

Apple has not announced a timetable for this update.

I am upgrading from an M1 Mac mini and have been using a dual monitor setup all this time but now I can’t do that with a better machine which is clearly capable of doing it since the air with the same chip can do it.

If you were planning to use a dual external monitor setup, you should have gotten a machine with a Pro chip or a Max chip. Even after Apple releases the software update, at a TBD date, the M3 MacBook Pro is never going to support using two external monitors as well as a M3 Pro or M3 Max MacBook Pro would, today.

gabor-m wrote:

1. What works for me...

My primary screen is my Macbook Pro M3 (Jira);

2. The second screen is an LG Ultragear (connected via HDMI [120Hz]) (web browsing);

3. the third screen is a 63" Samsung LED tv (wireless connection: Teams).

All the screens are works well, the wireless connection lag a bit, but the lag is so small so it does not interfere with my work.

As far as I know, you can have one AirPlay display, or one Sidecar connection to an iPad, and that doesn't count against the display limit in the Technical Specifications. It isn't the same as a first-class, hardware-accelerated display connection - but for some things, it may do.

If you have two Macs that are recent enough, you can set up one of them to be an AirPlay Receiver for the other. While I wouldn't advise going out and buying a Mac just to get this feature, if you already have two Macs that can use it, it costs nothing to experiment.

Continuity features and requirements on Apple devices - Apple Support

Set up your Mac to be an AirPlay Receiver - Apple Support

Use an iPad as a second display for a Mac - Apple Support

DisplayLink technology creates a "fake" display buffer in RAM, sends the data out over a slower interface to a stunt box with DisplayLink custom chips that put that data back onto a "legacy" interface. It is not a true "accelerated" display, and it can suffer from lagging. Just adding the DisplayLink Driver is not adequate to get a picture -- you need a DisplayLink "stunt-box" or a Dock that includes DisplayLink chips.

————

It may be acceptable for a second display showing slow-to-change data such as computer program listings, stock quotes, or spreadsheets, but NOT for full motion Video, not for Video editing, and absolutely not for gaming. Mouse-tracking on that display can lag, and can make you feel queasy.

In a pinch, it may even play Internet videos (as one user put it) “without too many dropped frames".

If you are only doing program listings spreadsheets, stock quotes, and other slow to change data, DisplayLink can work for you, but requires you to make some strong compromises.

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It is really nice to know that you can use a DisplayLink display if you MUST have an additional display for some of the types of data I mentioned. But that is NOT the same as the computer supporting a second, built-in, Hardware-accelerated display.

These displays depend on DisplayLink software, and are at the whim of Apple when they make MacOS changes. There have been cases where MacOS changes completely disabled DisplayLink software, and it took some time for them to recover.

--------

I think the Big Surprise for a lot of Hub/Dock buyers is that they thought they were getting a "real" display, but actually got a DisplayLink "fake" Display. If you got what you expected in every case, I would not use such pejorative terms to describe DisplayLink.

LRLLRL wrote:

Some one claims 100% success. Told me to do 2 monitors and for th 3rd one, get Apple TV box, connect to monitor using hHDMI-HDMI latest version to connect!!!I am trying to locate him and also like to understand the Apple TV box. Anyone else knows about this?

I don't believe that AirPlay and Sidecar connections count against the limit on the number of external displays. You can have one AirPlay display, or one Sidecar (iPad) display, in addition to everything else.

There are various ways to set up AirPlay displays, including

• "Smart" TV with AirPlay support built in
• AirPlay to something like an Apple TV set-top box, or to some Roku streaming sticks
• AirPlay to another Mac that is recent enough that it can act as an AirPlay Receiver

AirPlay is not as good as a hardware-supported connection to a real monitor, so don't expect miracles when it comes to resolution choices or to video quality.

withinsight wrote:

Following up here as the Sonnettech Displaylink USB 3 Displayport adapter is what did the trick for me. I remember reading somewhere that it had to be the USB 3 version with a USB-C adapter, and not the Thunderbolt, or USB-C versions.

SonnetTech has several similarly-named dual display adapters.

• The Thunderbolt ones use your computer's native hardware-supported display outputs. If you are not trying to attach more displays to your computer than it supports, they are the clear choice.
• The USB 3 DisplayLink ones rely on the DisplayLink workaround. I think SonnetTech used to call these adapters just "DisplayLink" adapters (no "USB 3"), which made it easy to confuse them with the Thunderbolt ones.
• The USB-C adapter also uses the DisplayLink workaround, but supports pass-through charging.

withinsight wrote:

Thanks for the alternative adapter recommendations. I'm doing web work, which really only requires a web browser and a text editor. I'm not doing anything graphics intensive; I just expect the 2 external monitors to move at the same speed you'd expect from the internal monitor. The current "I move my mouse, and it disappears on the external monitors only to reappear 3-5 seconds later isn't acceptable performance for any user, regardless of profession.

I can say that based on the Macworld article I shared in my original description, this *should* be possible. Startech provided drivers for both DisplayLink and InstantView; the former won't run on a silicon Mac running Sonoma so I'm stuck with the InstantView driver, which didn't seem to do the trick (and I tried everything).

If the Starlink product uses DisplayLink, then you may be able to use software at the Synaptics site. Synaptics is the "arms supplier" for DisplayLink. They make money off the sale of DisplayLink decoder chip sets, and provide the software that you have to install on the host computer (Mac, PC).

https://www.synaptics.com/products/displaylink-graphics

https://www.synaptics.com/products/displaylink-graphics/downloads/macos

I think current versions of DisplayLink software for the Mac may run as an application, rather than as a driver; this being related to recent security & kernel extension changes in macOS. The application needs Screen Recording permission.

https://support.displaylink.com/knowledgebase/topics/80209-troubleshooting-macos

https://support.displaylink.com/knowledgebase/articles/1932214-displaylink-manager-app-for-macos-introduction-in

It is surprising that the StarLink product would support both DisplayLink and "Silicon Motion's Content Adaptive Technology" (if it does). I would have expected it to support a single workaround technology.

I have 14” MacBook Pro M3 Pro. It works on dual screens but lags big time when it comes to use Cinema 4D software. My solution is to connect to one big wide screen like the Dell 38” wide screen monitor. And it works perfectly and smoothly. The wide screen is wide enough that it feels like two monitors combined. Maybe that will help on M3 MacBook Pro.

<< I am upgrading from an M1 Mac mini and have been using a dual monitor setup all this time but now I can’t do that with a better machine which is clearly capable of doing it since the air with the same chip can do it. >>

The MacBook Pro M3 (Plain) is just a later generation processor of SAME M-series (plain) hardware as you said you walked away from. You did not change anything except the slight speedup of an M3 over an M1.

• The M1 (plain) Mac mini support TWO hardware-accelerated displays. They are both external displays

• The M3 (plain) MacBook Pro supports two displays as well. Today, they are the built-in display and one external display. Apple has said they intend to support using the display-generator from the Internal display to drive an external display at some point in the future, when the internal display is turned off.

I saw the latest Mac OS update allows M3 connecting to dual external displays with MacBook in closed position.

https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0C9ZHT3HQ

work with 2 external monitors with DisplayLink, no problem