Windowserver/ Kernel crashes on 2020 iMac Sonoma 14.5

Greetings!

I have been experiencing intermittent windowserver kernel panics/ crashes over the past few months. They seem to come in groups of crashes and then stop for weeks at a time. I have not been able to correlate any action on my part. I use an additional Apple Thunderbolt Display with a Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) to Thunderbolt 2 Adapter. Before posting, I have searched for the issue in multiple support forums, reset display settings by removing plist/ rebooting, removed OBS, and used Etrecheck reports to remove multiple "minor issues." Please find latest Etrecheck report attached. Thank you!


iMac (2017 – 2020)

Posted on Jun 9, 2024 4:56 PM

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Posted on Jul 19, 2024 6:23 PM

Latest updates. I've confirmed crashes and freezes only occur when external monitor is connected via Thunderbolt/ USB-C. I have tested with no other external peripherals but still crashes with external monitor, but no crashes without external monitor plugged in. I have tested the monitor with my MacBook air- no crashes.

Brought imac to Apple Genius Bar today- they plugged in an iPad and seemed to run the same test as the diagnostics test I ran at home. They found no fault, and said 'it must be software related' and recommended I erase/ reinstall os and manually reinstall files/ apps. Frustrating. A waste of a trip to the store. Asked them for quote for an installed logic board: about $550 plus tax. Hesitant to spend an afternoon manually erasing HD and reinstalling OS and files after reading @Tim_McManus' posts. @Tim any updates on your iMac pro crash issue?

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Jul 19, 2024 6:23 PM in response to tvdon1

Latest updates. I've confirmed crashes and freezes only occur when external monitor is connected via Thunderbolt/ USB-C. I have tested with no other external peripherals but still crashes with external monitor, but no crashes without external monitor plugged in. I have tested the monitor with my MacBook air- no crashes.

Brought imac to Apple Genius Bar today- they plugged in an iPad and seemed to run the same test as the diagnostics test I ran at home. They found no fault, and said 'it must be software related' and recommended I erase/ reinstall os and manually reinstall files/ apps. Frustrating. A waste of a trip to the store. Asked them for quote for an installed logic board: about $550 plus tax. Hesitant to spend an afternoon manually erasing HD and reinstalling OS and files after reading @Tim_McManus' posts. @Tim any updates on your iMac pro crash issue?

Aug 31, 2024 1:53 PM in response to tvdon1

A final update on this unresolved issue. Best of luck @FUNos! Thanks for your help.

As mentioned, I've pinpointed the issue to T2 security chip crashes that occur only when an external monitor is connected to Thunderbolt 3/usb-c port on the iMac. I have reproduced these crashes with both Apple Thunderbolt Display connected via Thunderbolt 2 to Thunderbolt 3/usb-c adapter and an Acer monitor connected via an HDMI to Thunderbolt/USB-c adapter.

I have erased the imac and reinstalled the OS, then manually added all apps and docs (did not use migration assistant). Even with absolute bare-bones apps installed, still reproduce the same issue.

Welp. That's it for this 2020 IMAC. Apple store insists there is no hardware problem and it's out of warranty anyway. Will just deal with intermittent crashes.

Jun 11, 2024 5:26 AM in response to tvdon1

I spent hours and days over the course of a month trying to pinpoint the cause of these random crashes and restarts on my 2020 iMac to no avail (I purchased it used in early 2023). Like you have experienced, they seemed to come in waves. What I quickly learned was my experiences were not unique and they even occurred when I had zero peripherals connected to the machine but for the bluetooth mouse and keyboard. I even reformatted the disk and installed 3rd party software one at a time with pauses. It was very frustrating and I can't tell you how many reports I sent to Apple when that dialogue box appeared explaining what I was doing at the time. Eventually I just sent them Steven Wright jokes in the verbiage field. Then I gave up caring altogether and enjoyed the lulls. I haven't had any crashes in many months now although I am experiencing some random freezes forcing a hard shutdown on my part. But I'm not going down another rabbit hole although I suspect these freezes are caused by either of the two TB docks I have connected.


Anyway my friend, here is a Terminal command that might help indicate your root shutdown cause (Change 24 to any duration required). It takes a while to spit out the code(s).


log show --predicate 'eventMessage contains "Previous shutdown cause"' --last 24h



Then search "george garside previous shutdown causes explained" for a dynamic list of what some of these codes mean (my first post was rejected because I included the direct link).


Good luck.


Jul 20, 2024 5:15 AM in response to tvdon1

What brand external monitor are you using? Was it connected directly to your Mac? Have you tried connecting it via a dock?


I am not sure what "Tim" has to say about reformatting as I can't find any of his posts but with all the time and effort you spent troubleshooting, a disk wipe and reinstall will be a cake walk. Tedious yes, but I would be doing that before throwing money at a major parts swap either of which may or may not address the issue. I do this act every couple of years and even though it didn't resolve my previous unexplained period of crashes, it's always good to start with a clean slate. But don't be hasty and put all your confidence in a cloud service because you likely have files parked in folders that are not synched. This is where your Time Machine, clone copies and manual saves to external drives will save the day.

Jun 11, 2024 11:13 AM in response to FUNos

Great- just ran it for the last 2 crashes. Looks like the cause is:

-20 BridgeOS T2-initiated shutdown. The T2 chip in your 2018+ MacBook Pro or other Mac (list in link) initiated a shutdown.


Did a quick search on this issue. I'm going to assume it's something to do with my apple thunderbolt display, the TB/usb-c adapter, or the peripherals connected to it's usb hub. Currently testing.

Thanks again @FUNos. Your thoughts are greatly appreciated!

Jun 20, 2024 4:13 PM in response to tvdon1

Update: still getting reboots/ crashes coded -20 and -63. Lastest tests, I've removed all USB devices from the external Apple Thunderbolt Monitor USB hub- still crashes. I replaced this Thunderbolt 2 to Thunderbolt 3 adapter- still crashes. Also tried "reviving" the imac firmware per this process- still crashes. I've seen multiple posts mentioning that wiping the drive and reinstalling the OS did nothing, so not going that route. I suppose the next step is testing by simply not using an external monitor. Not ideal for my day-to-day needs. If anyone has further info, please post- thanks!

Jun 21, 2024 7:35 PM in response to tvdon1

tvdon1 wrote:

Would it be possible to go into a little more detail as to how you diagnosed this to be my logic board or external hard drive? Did you see something in the logs?

Nothing specific. It’s just an educated guess. It’s a process of elimination combined with other people’s recent experiences and limited opportunities to affect change. In the past, kernel extensions were very popular and were common causes of panics. They were easy to remove at home and test. But they are rare now. Certain 3rd party hardware devices can cause panics and those are easy to remove and test. Beyond that, there simply isn’t anything you can do.


Sometimes people swear that a software update caused the panics. Whether that’s true or not, it’s relatively easy to test.

Jun 10, 2024 9:33 AM in response to Barney-15E

Thank you.

I do not use/ have never used Photos.app- there are no photos or albums inside of it or designated to it. I have opened it and let it sit. Is there something else I have to do?

Entire latest kernel panic log was too large to post, so please find the beginning of kernel panic log attached. I will attach end to another reply.

Thanks.


Jun 11, 2024 10:03 AM in response to tvdon1

You can run that command line anytime and put 240 hours, for example. It will take longer to process but will show you the shutdowns experienced over 10 days. For what it's worth, it was nice to know what triggered a shutdown but sometimes I didn't get a code report and in the end, I was never able to pinpoint any specific cause.

Jun 11, 2024 11:30 AM in response to tvdon1

Ah yes, the T2 security chip! This was a common theme seen in my quest for answers. I recall others zoning in on that as well, but I didn't always get that specific code after a crash/restart. I also recall feeling as you did when I was able to point the finger at something, anything. In the end, I just accepted it and it went away lol. Thanks for the memory jog and kindly post back if you have other eureka moments.

Jun 20, 2024 4:43 PM in response to tvdon1

Are you running TGPro system fan monitor? This 3rd party utility kept alerting me to a faulty fan but other tests did not concur. I ended up removing it. I only mention this because there was some coincidence in the timing of my issue and this subsequent software removal. I can’t say for certain though if it was the sole cause or even part of it.


The benefit of reformatting in this regard is you can troubleshoot after each different software install. It is a tedious chore.


There is also a way to disable the T2 chip, albeit temporarily. I recall doing that act but I also recall something sketchy about it.


I feel your frustration. This crash/restart/repeat is random and not a one-off thing. My system often crashed several times a day or once every few days. There was no rhyme or reason. But like I previously mentioned, I gave up with this all-consuming task and just suffered through the events. Eventually the issue went away. Hopefully you’ll get your own reprieve soon.

Jun 21, 2024 6:16 PM in response to etresoft

Thank you @etresoft! And thank you for Etrecheck, assuming you are the creator!

Costwise, a logic board replacement for my 2020 imac means tossing this one and buying a new computer, so I'd love to try and learn a bit more. Would it be possible to go into a little more detail as to how you diagnosed this to be my logic board or external hard drive? Did you see something in the logs?

Thanks again for your response.

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Windowserver/ Kernel crashes on 2020 iMac Sonoma 14.5

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