Previous 1 2 Next 27 Replies Latest reply: Jun 17, 2014 9:34 AM by rjb1
bradsarno Level 1 (5 points)

Warning.

 

When creating DDP master file sets with Waveburner, beware that your track markers can move and no longer be where you had placed them in the Waveburner session. DDP files are strictly for professional mastering and delivery for replication. It's tragic that Apple has offered this professional feature that is dangerously non-functional in Waveburner. Just the other day we were finishing a critical deadline project for Decca/Universal Records set for a very large release. We had the master assembled and playing perfectly in Waveburner 1.6.1. Then we created a DDP file set from Waveburner. Then we used Sonoris DDP Player to audition and confirm the audio was clean with no glitches. The audio was sounding fine, so we initiated the DDP upload to Decca/Universal Records FTP site. As we continued to audition the audio, I noticed visually that the tracks were jumping after the audio had started. So we aborted the upload and looked more closely at the issue. Sure enough, Waveburner's DDP file had scooted all the track markers late by a little bit, literally chopping off the start of every track by about a second or so. I had to go back into the Waveburner session and literally move all 32 track markers early to compensate for this DDP glitch. We finally were able to generate an acceptable DDP, but not without a major panic and headache.

 

The Mastering data (PQ sheet) that was printed from the Waveburner file did NOT match the actual time codes found in the DDP file set. This too is absurd. The PQ sheet data is used along with the DDP so the replicator can confirm that everything matches. But the codes don't match at all. This is a serious problem for Waveburner.

 

We now know to steer clear of Waveburner's DDP function. It's catastrophically broken. For many people who own Waveburner, they may not also own the professional DDP players required to play back a DDP and confirm its condition. I wonder how many people have generated DDP masters from Waveburner and sent them off to be replicated only to find that their track starts had all moved from where they placed them in the Waveburner session. It's a scary thought.

 

Apple, you simply can't offer this DDP feature in Waveburner until you fix it. DDP is a seriously professional method of master delivery and currently it's a severe failure. I and a few others are warning the mastering community of this danger. Waveburner has such incredible potential with it's deep functionality, but it still has a few issues that are keeping it amateur, consumer software at best and not the pro app it claims to be or is destined to become someday. I truly want it to get there, but until it does, I'm simply afraid to trust it. If it does get its bugs worked out, I'll be a huge supporter.

 

Brad Sarno

Blue Jade Audio Mastering

  • bradsarno Level 1 (5 points)

    Bump...  this is too vital an issue to let disappear in the pages of old topics.

     


    Brad

  • biigniick Level 1 (0 points)

    i agree.  this has bitten me a few times

     

    - nick

  • koldhands Level 1 (0 points)

    Was about to press send on the FTP transfer of a DDP file for a client and then read this! Thanks for the info and let's hope apple fix it asap. Although I can't imagine it's high on their list of priorities.....

  • curvebender Level 1 (0 points)

    I've learned this the hard way..

     

    When I finish my mastering in WB 1.6.1, I export a DDP-file.

     

    Then I open the DDP in Wave Editor (Audiofile Engineering) where I manually move all the markers to their correct starting points, because Wave Burner messes those up at export!

     

    Then I export the project from Wave Editor as a DDP, and send it to the CD plant.

     

    Really, Apple should get this fixed ASAP. (I filed a bug report a long time ago to Apple about this..)

  • David Pick Level 1 (0 points)

    Useful info - anyone know if it's been fixed?

     

    Also discovered after delivering a DDP file for manufacturing that WB does not export an MD5 checksum.

  • bradsarno Level 1 (5 points)

    To my knowledge, nothing has been done. No updates addressing this.

     

    Fortunately there are other simple utilities for creating MD5 checksums.

     

    I've completely given up on generating DDP's with Waveburner, far too risky. I have to use other programs for that.

     

     

     

    B

  • treading Level 1 (20 points)

    Is there a simple method to check the accuracy of the DDP files before sending them off

  • biigniick Level 1 (0 points)

    Yeah, if it was made with WaveBurner, it's wrong. . .

     

    Sonoris DDP creator/player is great WaveLab7 is great and Sonic PMCD is also great.  None have an interface as stupid simple as WaveBurner, but if it needs to be done right you can't use WaveBurner to generate your DDP.

     

    - nick

  • tommybanana Level 1 (15 points)

    The way of checking is to import the DDP in an editor such as Wave Edit and checking it .

     

    I was having trouble with Waveburner. When dithering from 24 bit to a test burn CD it was introducing a bunch of clicks in one track.  I bought Waveedit for the Ozotope SRC but found the mastering workflow really hard to understand. However it has really good quality sample rate conversion and dithering. And you can import and export DDP.

     

    Apparently Wave Edit are revising the mastering workflow so it could be a good solution for Mac once that is done.

     

    So I did all audio processing ie SRC and dither and save as 16 bit in Wave edit and sequenced the tracks and added fades and metadata in Waveburner. Fades and stuff is so easy in Waveburner.

     

    I had given up on Waveburner after finishing the master then hearing the clicks and finding this thread. How could I be sure the DP is ok even if a CD burnt from WB is OK - which it was once I stopped WB having to dither. But I opened the DDP image in WaveEdit just to check and everything looks fine - track indexes in the right place, sounds identical.

     

    So now I am going to burn a CD in WE from the DDP image outputted from WB and opened in Wave edit.

     

    NB This is all Waveburner 1.6.1 on OS 10.6.8 and WaveEdit 1.5.6.

     

    If that is cool on a listen I am going to go with the Waveburner DDP. And then use Wave Edit next time ( once they improve the workflow) or waveburner if they fix the idiotic stuff like can't import AIFF files.....dither causes clicks.....

     

    It is amazing that noone has got their act together for a MAc mastering product that isn't really expensive.

    I guess Wave Edit are favourites cos right now Waveburner isn't it.

  • tommybanana Level 1 (15 points)

    After reading this thread again, I am going to export the DDP from WaveEdit just to be sure.....

  • tommybanana Level 1 (15 points)

    AAARGH

     

    So on listening to test CD (in iTunes through my focusrute soundcard) I am getting clicks - but not in the same place!!

    ***!! Is that cos my system is suddenly clicking for no apparent reason or are there errors in the audio CD that create cicks intermiitently but not always in the same place?

     

    Definitely giving up on WB - can't bear this.....

  • tommybanana Level 1 (15 points)

    FWIW Remastered CD completely in WaveEdit. Listening to Test CD now.

    NO CLICKS!!

     

     

    Waveburner....could be so great. So not great. Don't use.

  • tommybanana Level 1 (15 points)

    FWIW remastered CD entirely in wave edit. Listening to test CD. No clicks.

     

    Waverburner ...... Could be so great! So not.

     

    My advice. Don't use it.

  • tommybanana Level 1 (15 points)

    I felt so strongly for some reason I said that twice.......!!

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