Wifi Constantly Dropping in Lion

I did restart, but not until after writing that your fix doesnt work for me, so perhaps I wrote back prematurely. I will report back later, I want to be sure about my final result first 🙂

saltatempo,

I also used the link you provided, and sorry to say - but it did not help at all. I also did a full restart and I also moved the router to b/g only to see if there is the root cause, but nada.... I use a mac mini I think it has a broadcom wifi hardware in it.

same sad Wifi issues here in Los Angeles with 2011 iMac purchsed last October. just spoke with Apple again and it is working for now. named a new location "wireless" and took it off automatic. seems too simple we'll see if fix lasts. have tried other fixes all mentioned here and nothing lasts. Apple gave me same story, call time warner & change router channel. microwaves and all sorts of things cause interference bla bla bla, insisting it is not the computer (all 4 other Apple devices in house are working fine with no connectivity issues) installed Lion almost immediately after buying iMac so can't really say if it was happening with SL on this machine. bummmmmmmed out in LA

Michael Sciascia wrote:

The common thread here is that Lion fails with wireless routers that work reliably for Snow Leopard, Leopard, iOS and Windows. It does not matter what the router is. The same computer re-booted into Snow Leopard has no WiFi problems. This is a Lion operating system problem, nothing less.

Actually, if it was a Lion problem, everyone running Lion would have a problem....

That is not the case.

The problem is, some people running Lion, and whatever wireless router they have, are not functioning together properly for them.

If people here were to put down what wireless router they have, then maybe we could gather more information..

Example:

If there were 500 people using Brand X wireless router, and 650 people using Brand Z wireless router, maybe we could look a little closer at that?

To say Lion is the problem is not true as millions of people are using Lion without any problems.

And that is a fact, no matter how anyone wants to look at it....

So, again,

The problem is, some people running Lion, and whatever wireless router they have, are not functioning together properly for them.

Joseph Kriz wrote:

To say Lion is the problem is not true as millions of people are using Lion without any problems.

And that is a fact, no matter how anyone wants to look at it....

So, again,

The problem is, some people running Lion, and whatever wireless router they have, are not functioning together properly for them.

Not many people here are patient enough or knowledable enough to go through the process of tracing down the root cause. They'd rather point fingers, holler, make phone calls and otherwise waste their time, waiting for Apple to figure it out without the key information that they actually have, because they "have the problem" and "can reproduce it".

Apple is now sending out logging changes to a bunch of people trying to help track down the issue for them.

What Lion likely has, as I've said before is a failure mode change that previously didn't disturb their experiences with WiFi. Probably changes in the network stack for other development, such as AirPlay, broke some timeouts or retry behavior, and their mode of failing connections is now causing them to see a bunch of problems.

So, we'lll all get to see the posts here and try and help, tell them some things to check, they'll not look back here for weeks, they call Apple a few times, get frustrated that the problem persists, try some hacking around to fix the problem, remember a couple of things said here, try those, stay frustrated and eventually go buy a new router, and presto, pronounced it fixed when the switch bands, or get a router without automated "channel selection on", or some other dynamic issue that is actually what is causing things to fail.

But, alas, there seems little hope otherwise...

Joseph,

C'mon now. If it worked in people's previous versions of OS X and not in Lion, then it is Lion.

Recalls on cars work the same way man. Not everyone experiences the symptons but the model still

has the issues. It's not that people are driving the cars on the wrong kind of roads, or that people are

driving the "flawed" cars incorrectly. It is that the manufacturer has a problem with the inherent design

and engineering of the car.

The same applies to this WiFi issue. It is a Lion problem that not everyone is experiencing. Something is inherently wrong in the design and/or engineering of the WiFi piece.

You must be the "face" for Apple on this forum, huh?

There is a common sense aspect here. If a network 'just works' with every single other device you run on it, and worked with Snow Leopard, there is SOME kind of Lion issue going on. The simple fact is the average user should not have to be spending days resolving a problem like this. Even those of us who have used Macs for 15+years are having major issues with this, what is the average consumer going to do? Yes, I was able to fix my problem. But it was just as much luck and perseverance. I went through hoops I should have never had to go through on a brand new machine with a fresh install of the OS.

Yes, millions of people are running Lion with no problems. But I am reading more and more about this issue not just on here, but on other forums I use. So while it's not happening to everyone, it is happening with a lot of people. There are a lot of people who will never join a discussion like this either. They will keep taking their machine to the Genius Bar over and over again getting no real resolution. People in these threads have had replacement machines and still had the problem. I have run into people who actually think this is just 'a problem with Macs' and are living with it. They shouldn't be, but they also shouldn't have to ever deal with this nonsense in the first place.

With all due respect, it's obvious that for the most part, it's got nothing to do with the make/type of router. I've been running wireless routers for years with various mac os and never experienced this before. The fact that there is no single fault can all be put down to the various environments LION is running in. In other words, it's the same fault but it's experienced in different ways by different users under different circumstances (probably because of differences in the routers).

It may very well be that some routers are more prone to dropouts but the fault can still be traced back to a bug or bugs in the way Lion deals with wi-fi connections. After all, Apple don't know what kind of router you are using; their software therefore has to work regardless of the kind of router being used (assuming it conforms and if it didn't, who would buy a router that didn't work properly?).

My beef is that Apple won't be square with us suckers, sorry consumers, and say, 'look it's a bug but we can't find it. Sorry, but everyone who is having this problem can avail themselves of free support for an extra three months or whatever...' After all Apple has made billions for its shareholders out of us testing Apple products, and paying for the privilege. Isn't capitalism wonderful...

wbowles wrote:

With all due respect, it's obvious that for the most part, it's got nothing to do with the make/type of router. I've been running wireless routers for years with various mac os and never experienced this before. The fact that there is no single fault can all be put down to the various environments LION is running in. In other words, it's the same fault but it's experienced in different ways by different users under different circumstances (probably because of differences in the routers).

It may very well be that some routers are more prone to dropouts but the fault can still be traced back to a bug or bugs in the way Lion deals with wi-fi connections. After all, Apple don't know what kind of router you are using; their software therefore has to work regardless of the kind of router being used (assuming it conforms and if it didn't, who would buy a router that didn't work properly?).

My beef is that Apple won't be square with us suckers, sorry consumers, and say, 'look it's a bug but we can't find it. Sorry, but everyone who is having this problem can avail themselves of free support for an extra three months or whatever...' After all Apple has made billions for its shareholders out of us testing Apple products, and paying for the privilege. Isn't capitalism wonderful...

That makes sense to me, but it's amazing how many people in these threads recommend just buying new hardware. If you are at your wits end and want to buy a new router, fine. But the fact that it has to be recommended as a solution is crazy to me. Or that some people think it's a reasonable solution.

Easily solved. Apple has a list of all the users here as well as all who have phoned them (myself included) about the problem. But I wait in vain for Apple to get in touch with me and ask me to log the problem for them so that they can fix it.

Thanks for noting this, Michael....useful to know that even the same computer runs fine if it boots in Snow Leopard!

What irks me is that Lion works just fine with Apple's router! But then maybe that's the only one they tested it with? Not likely I would have thought. Or maybe they want us all to go out and buy an Airport Extreme?

Fair point Joseph, but this issue is so widespread that Apple should then do some investigating and release a support document. It's unreasonable for them to expect us to be able to troubleshoot problems like software/network engineers or developers can. Apple has the resources to do this kind of testing, but self-organizing thousands of people around the world with varying technical expertise....that's kind of hopeless. Even in one country (for example, the UK) not only does every major provider use a different router pretty much, but even the same provider can have different models, making diagnosis by consumers impractical.

sgt_harris,

I agree...

We all know there is some problem with Lion and some wireless routers...

I certianly am not suggesting everyone run out and buy a new router...

Apple apparently made some changes..

Are they using newer technology now in this system that is causing problems with older wireless technology that some routers may have?

I don't know, I don't work for Apple and they aren't telling....

Maybe some of the older routers need a firmware update and those companies may be working on just that?

Something like Firewire 400 cables that won't plug into the new computers with a Firewire 800 connection...

You would either need an adapter, a new cable, or a new device that has Firewire 800...

Some people still refuse to list what wireless router they are using...

As you mention, people in the UK or other places around the world are using different devices...

As I mentioned before, I am using a 4th Generation Airport Extreme.

I have never owned any other brand of wireless router.

There are other good brands out there but it seems that Lion may not like some of them at this time.

Yup. Things would be so much easier if there was a clear cause of this issue (i.e. a specific thing that triggers this in Lion). I appreciate you're trying to help us find our way through this nebulous issue 🙂