Here is what I found that works!
There are several Font Folders: 1 in the system/library, and another in the main library. The system/lib fonts get updated with softare update, thre Library Fonts don't--I had some from the 1990s remember them?
The older fonts were broken into individual fonts types by family (ie helvetica, helvetica black, etc.) while for the new ones are there is just a single package that contains these variations. Using the app FontBook, I could remove duplicates with the exact names, Heveltica and Helvatica, but since one contained HelBlack and the other didn't, Hel Black remained in my Lib folder (This was one of the offending fonts, dating from 1997, so it had changed since then--just a bit).
Into the trash with HelBlack (and Condensed) and my issue went away instantly--no need to reboot or re open the apps (Mail and Safari).
To identify the offending font, copy a small portion of the bad text into a new mail message and use the show fonts command under Format to to determain the offender, then remove it from the Lib/Font (not the Sys/Lib/font) folder. (I had used TextEdit previously, but for some reason it uses the Sys Fonts, not the Lib fonts, so they diplayed correctly and didn't give the old names when I used the format window to determain the font.)
Worked instantly for me.