I just met with Emagic developers--they care for us.

Folks, I just got back from the Los Angeles Logic User's Group meeting and was very impressed and moved by the representatives from Emagic, now working for Apple.

I especially was moved by Manfred Knauff, Engineering Product Manager, an extraordinarily intelligent, deep, compassionate man, who says he reads the forums. SO OUR FEEDBACK HELPS.

I could empathize with him and the developers: they have an enormous list of feature requests coming from every angle, each person’s request seeming to be the most important to them, emphasized by some egos in the audience hogging the stage.

At the start of the meeting there was a rule for no complaining and no asking about future fixes, feature additions by a rep of the users group. But at the end they opened an invitation for feature/future requests. I mentioned how I love Score (my area of interest) and “would like to see it go further.” Manfred was keenly aware of this—in fact is helping in the development of Score—and insinuated that good things are to come.

But now I see that it is a process that takes time, based on the resources available. For example, take Ultrabeat. Created by the ingenious Steffen Gehring was beta tested by only a handful of people.

Another “God of Logic” was Steffan Diedrichsen, who created such plug-ins as EVP88, EVB3, Space Designer, ES1, ES2 and others. He was clearly a clever individual to come up with these programs, but I was also struck by how much he cared about the quality and soul of the final sound. He’s a jazz musician and loves music.

Let me emphasize again that the Emagic guys are smart, humorous, and care about Logic. They are doing the best that they can.

Dual 2.0 ghz G5, 2MB RAM, Mac OS X (10.4.4)

Posted on Jan 23, 2006 10:08 PM

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45 replies

Jan 24, 2006 6:03 PM in response to William Levine

not to be a drag, but i thought that it was apple that now develops for Logic. And as far as a company carring for thier customers, 400 dollars for support of a product after spending $1000 is ludicris.
I use to be a serious gung-ho logic supporter. Telling all my friends to switch and to use logic it is so great, but using it now just seems like i am wadding in mud. the enthusiasm has depleted since apple has taken over. I hope you guys have a better experience in the following years. got to go to digidesign.com and motu.com to check out what they offer.

Jan 24, 2006 6:05 PM in response to David Slater

I was also at the meeting yesterday and couldn't be more pleased with the guest speakers. I agree with everything William said in his posts and feel a lot more comfortable and excited about the future of LP. I think I gave a big sigh of relief when the engineers explained their process on fixing all the little bugs that annoy us users. They really do read our requests, on this site and other sites, and know that we are often frustrated with this product. However, as hard as they are working, they can only do so much at one time. And even though we all feel that "our" issue is the most pressing, we need to understand that the engineers take everything into consideration and try their best to make everyone happy. Every program is going to have its bugs and issues, and I am much more relieved after meeting with the reps last night, knowing that they really care about how we feel torwards Logic Pro.

Jan 24, 2006 6:33 PM in response to frequent popsicle

I use to be a serious gung-ho logic supporter.
Telling all my friends to switch and to use logic it
is so great, but using it now just seems like i am
wadding in mud. the enthusiasm has depleted since
apple has taken over. I hope you guys have a better
experience in the following years. got to go to
digidesign.com and motu.com to check out what they
offer.


I'm right there with you...

Jan 24, 2006 8:03 PM in response to auxn

got to go to digidesign.com and motu.com to check out what they offer
I'm right there with you...


funny after using Protool for the past while I am getting fed up with them for the similar reasons as you guys feel
getting charged for point upgrades (cept it is like $150 for them) and hardware breaking (you should see the power harness issues with the 002R) and you can't use the software as the hardware is basically a HUGE DONGLE, plugin's that cost an arm and a leg, unhelpful tech support, arrogant users on there "user to user" forum, (BTW posts get deleted there as well if they violate the TOU)

the OTHER dongle breaking (while not Digi's problem it is annoying to not be able to use a program or plugin that I might need while my key is sent back to iLok (BTW it was a manufacturing defect, weak solder joint in the key)
OH YA that is another thing having to pay like $1000 just to import OMF's or display timecode (DV toolkit), having no upgrade option when they come out with a new version, (new version of DVtoolkit being $1200+ now) being limited to only 32 tracks (unless you fork out more for one of the toolkits)


grass isn't always greener

DAVE

Jan 24, 2006 8:22 PM in response to David Slater

I would personally never submit to Protools LE--it's far too limiting of a program, and quite frankly, is not even on the same level as a program like Logic. LE is the poor man's PROtools HD, what can you expect?
There are however, other alternatives which are looking better and better everyday.
I'm not going to be too hasty, I will see how this 7.2 upgrade works for everyone (I'll be d*mned if I pay for it before I know if my issues have been fixed)--but if things dont get dramatically more stable with 7.2....
"This relationship is over"

Jan 24, 2006 8:33 PM in response to David Slater

david, you point has been in my head for awhile about pro tools. totally a hard way with them also. i have been reading the motu boards also, and it seems that they have the same hard time. logic is working, but i feel like a money pit has spawned in my creative field. i will be slow to move, but the thought of moving doesn't scare me anymore. i will just be patient and see if the clouds let the sunshine in.

Jan 24, 2006 8:43 PM in response to auxn

I> would personally never submit to Protools LE


for what I needed at the time it worked out (as long as I got the DVtoolkit) and it was the program I knew from film school so I knew it would handle it (didn't know about logic at the time)

It still works fine, barring the odd powerharness failure (I am just going to consider other alternatives when I have the money (and I would still be saving if I was going for an HD system, well maybe not but still having to pay 10x the amount to get a similar system and you still don't get all the software instruments Logic gives ya)

is not even on the same level as a program like Logic.


I was comparing more along pricing lines rather then . . . well ya I guess I was a little confusing (sorry falling alseep as I write this)

well I guess it would be better to say to get a program with similar features to Logic from Digidesign you should be prepared to pay 10x the amount

DAVE

Jan 24, 2006 8:57 PM in response to David Slater

for what I needed at the time it worked out (as long
as I got the DVtoolkit) and it was the program I
knew from film school so I knew it would handle it
(didn't know about logic at the time)


Agreed-- LE Is all a lot of users need, and thats all good.

(and I would still
be saving if I was going for an HD system, well maybe
not but still having to pay 10x the amount to get a
similar system and you still don't get all the
software instruments Logic gives ya)


Wont argue there at all either!


As far as Logic goes--I really really love it--I've been with it since 5.x on PC, it was rock solid! I love all the plugs/instruments/etc, I like the way the program handles, but it comes down to stability for me, and it's just not there anymore. Like I said, I wont give up yet--I'm hoping 7.2 fixes this terrible terrible mess.

Jan 25, 2006 12:15 AM in response to David Slater

Here's the bottom line;

When Apple focuses the necessary finances and man power on a product, it shines. How many innovations have we seen over the past 18 months with the iPod, the dual cores, the quad cores, the new intels, the Final Cut Studio Pack, etc. These innovations took more than a handful of developers left over from an aquired company (this is in no way a slag against the guys from Emagic, on the contrary it is a sympathetic nod at the apparant lack of resources at their disposal).

It is NOT a question of Apple having the resources, it is a question of whether or not they are ready to step up and put Logic to the forefront of there development agenda.

To use a phrase Apple has marketed so effectively, it is time to 'think different'. Logic deserves to live up to the Apple name.

We are waiting.

Jan 25, 2006 2:07 AM in response to William Levine

I said I would post something nice if my experience improved at NAMM in my message that got deleted from the forum, which was partially negative, but certainly not deserving of censorship. Anyhow, it let me know that they do read our posts, which was confirmed at the show. I spoke with some non-Apple teachers that had positive things to say about Apple teaching Logic in schools. I got some good advice on issues I was having from knowledgable Logic and Sountrack reps. I got the impression that Apple's intention is not to let Logic fall by the wayside, and the emphasis on easier software is more of a gateway strategy to graduate people to Logic Pro. That's all I needed.....a little impression of a commitment from them.....you know, human contact for people who spend way to much time on computers.

Jan 25, 2006 3:18 PM in response to William Levine

Hey guys. I am the one who organized the meeting. After the Apple store closed I went and had dinner with the whole Emagic/Apple team and we had such a great time.

So yes, I can confirm that the Emagic team is still alive, still based in Hamburg, and still working like crazy to create the best possible DAW software for us. A couple of people work sometimes from Cupertino (Gehrard Lengeling usually spends about half the year there). They all travel and they are actually all in Cupertino as I type this. But most of the work is done in Hamburg.

Big thanks to Manfred, Steffen, Steffan and Clementz for showing up to our user-group meeting and answering all our questions, and to Bill (from Apple) for making all of this possible in the first place.

David Nahmani.

Jan 25, 2006 5:35 PM in response to david nahmani

David N.,
thanks for the great meeting with the Emagic/Apple team. As you can see, even just the knowledge that users and developers can communicate is a needed therapy for the achy, techno souls.

We now know we can post feature requests in various forums and they most likely will be read and added to the already long list.

It sounds like you have a direct line to the "Logic Legends" and I felt it was helpful to them as well.

Thanks again to you and Apple.

William

Dual 2.0 ghz G5, 2MB RAM Mac OS X (10.4.4)

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I just met with Emagic developers--they care for us.

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