Mac alternatives for affordable 5.1 AC3 encoding?

Last year I looked into the alternatives available to Mac users for encoding 5.1 mixes for distribution. I use MOTU's Digital Performer which lets me do everything except actually encode the 5.1 mixes DP can generate for me, leaving me with 6 mono files. I needed the last links, which are encoding and burning. Here's what I found:

Dolby Digital encoding: DVD Studio Pro 3 (A.Pack) and 4 (Compressor) both allow encoding from six mono channels. Now that DVDSP4 is only available as part of the Final Cut Studio, the price has more than doubled if all you want is the audio features like I did. There's still copies out there to be found if you know where to look (Amazon, etc.) so grab them now at under $500 if Dolby Digital encoding is important to you. Other encoders start well over a thousand sometimes, and a Dolby Digital Pro Encoder for under $500 seems like a deal when you check out the other options. I bought DVDSP4 and love it for encoding my mixes and making DVD menus, although I wish there was a cheaper DD encoder. If there is for the Mac, I couldn't find it.

(Note that although Roxio's Toast says Dolby Digital encoding is available too, it's only two channel. From what I gathered, Dolby basically gives away the two channel encoders while the 5.1 and up encoders are where the money is made. I could be wrong here, but either way, don't expect to buy Toast and encode in 5.1 as the mixes will fold down to two channel during burning.)

DTS encoding: I wrote DTS asking them about affordable options for using their codec to encode my 5.1 mixes. They pointed me to a product from Immersive Media Research called Vortex Surround Encoder. After reading about it, I ended up buying it. Although the DTS encoder is only 44.1, the results are fantastic and the product is much cheaper than the DVDSP4 product if all you want is multi-channel mixes that most people can play back since DTS is included on almost all preamps/receivers/DVD hardware these days. I think the price was around $99 or $150. I've never tried to import my DTS mixes into DVDSP4, although I have no reason to believe there would be a problem as DVDSP4 is DTS "aware" but doesn't encode it through Compressor.

I've used VSE to make files and burn them to regular CDs. For playback, if you use the optical output from the CD player to the preamp/receiver that's capable of DTS decoding, you're set as a DTS digital stream will be sent to that device from the CD player. I've even used it to make and play back DTS encoded discs and DTS files via iTunes to the cheapy 5.1 monitor system attached via optical from my G5. (hint- boost the volume from iTunes to max!)

DVD-Audio encoding: Since I own a DVD player capable of DVD-Audio playback, I downloaded the demo of discWelder Bronze from Minnetonka Software's website and after trying it out I decided to buy it for $99. During my demo period though, the gods smiled and Minnetonka arranged a deal with MOTU for DP users so that the price was cut in half, so it cost me only $49. It's the highest quality encoder I've got, but since I'm the only person I know capable of playing back DVD-A mixes, it's impossible to share my mixes with my friends. The Bronze version is no-frills; it will encode and burn to a DVD-R without menus as this is just audio. If you want menus, you need their other products, but I don't think there are Mac versions available just yet. But even for $99, this is a bargain if you can playback DVD-A. At $49 it's a darn steal.

SACD encoding: forget it. Too expensive as it requires hardware and special facilities.

Finally, the latest issue of Sound on Sound (Feb 2006) features the exact procedures used to create a 5.1 Dolby Digital mix from DVDSP4. It's rather simple, and even fun in a way once you figure out DVDSP4's interface. The mistake I made at first was not including enough video. For example, if my encoded song was 4 minutes but my jpeg only lasted 10 seconds, I only heard the first 10 seconds of audio. The video has to be as long as the audio- just stretch it out in the window to match the length of the audio. It's mentioned in this article.

Hope this helps!

If I remember correctly, I bought VSE right from the company's website at http://www.im-research.com via the sales email link. I checked my records, and I paid $150 for it back in September. I don't know what the current price is though, as the website is lacking a "store" or other sales page and I couldn't find anything with prices today. Boy, I wish IM would not keep this product a secret- us non-pro's need all the cheap software we can get! They do have decent descriptions of the product online as VSE does more than just DTS encoding, even though that's all I use it for now.

Like I said, I do believe that DVDSP4 should have no problem importing any encoded files created with VSE if you ever get that too. And since it's "only" encoding at 44.1KHz, remember that these won't be hi-res like DVD-A so you'll have to suffer with CD quality. But this is an affordable way for us Mac users to make a 5.1 encoded disc that we can actually share rather easily. Plus it's better than the lossy AC3 in the end anyway.

As for playback, to expand a bit on my previous post, there is some good info available from the net on playing back DTS files from a Mac. Google can point you where to find it. Basically, if you can find an older DTS title like the Wings' Band on the Run or the horrible mix of Venus and Mars, those were originally issued as CDs with DTS encoding. Better yet, do a search as there are some free DTS files available for download. That way you can be sure you'll have no problem making discs and playing back on your Mac if you need to do that outside of your regular stereo or whatever. Then again, maybe a regular movie DVD with a DTS soundtrack would work too.

Cheers, and I hope you have as much fun making surround mixes as I've had the past year or so! It's kind of like going from 2D to 3D as it's hard to go back to two channel sometimes. Good luck!

-Marty

Hi again-

Okay, about DVD-A: you asked about playback options, specifically the cable issue (six analog or one optical specifically.) It depends...how's that for an answer! Actually, it depends on your player and preamp/receiver. I take it since you knew enough to ask the question in the first place, you're familiar with the copy protection involved with both DVD-Audio and SACD for that matter. They were originally not allowed to be sent digitally from the player to the preamp. I believe it's the way the labels wanted to try to put the copy genie back in the bottle that they lost from CDs. Anyways, unless you've got something like D-Link from Denon (for only their DVD and receiver) or even some FireWire units that talk the same encryption on both ends for digital it won't work. Me, I have to rely on the six audio RCA cables to get the signal from my Denon DVD player to the Outlaw Audio preamp. The normal digital cable I've got connected will not pass the DVD-Audio or SACD stream along from the player. Another case of me, the end user, being treated as guilty until proven innocent. But that's another story.

DTS CDs: I've found that the medium I use, either DVD or redbook CD, is rather irrelevant when it comes to providing a DTS stream to my preamp- it likes both equally well, and recognizes them identically as DTS. The most important thing is the digital steam that's DTS encoded- once it leaves the player, it looks the same going across the wire. At least that's been my experience. That's why DTS originally could release DTS CDs- as long as their was a digital connection to a preamp that can decode DTS, a normal CD player works fine. In fact, I can also use the six channel input to play it back as my DVD player decodes the DTS stream internally and often do. My 14 year old CD player won't decode DTS, but with the digital out it can only pass the stream along to an outboard decoder.

As an aside, I can expand on this a bit. To augment my modest home studio monitors (two Event 20/20's), I bought an okay 5.1 speaker setup, the Alesis ProActive one that is more or less a rebranded Logitech but with six analog 5.1 inputs (important to me for mixing from my MOTU 828) and detachable speaker wire because I'm a prude that way. Anyway, out of the box and connected via one optical cable from my G5, I could get it to play anything except my DTS encoded tracks. Actually it played them- think white noise. Not good. I did some Googles and found out that the volume coming from the Mac had to be pretty much pegged to the max for the DTS decoder in the ProActive brain to recognize the digital stream. Once I did that, I got the DTS 5.1 soundtrack just fine.

Too bad about IM not being prompt. Like I said, I like the product and I've had no issues and I've needed no support as the product is self-documenting. It does one thing and does it well for me. Hopefully someone from their sales team will find this thread and convince the company to arrange at least a basic sales page with the website. As I said earlier, I did many Googles over the course of maybe a month and never found the right query to hit IM's page, and it was DTS that finally pointed me to their website.

DVD Studio Pro is worth it, if only to allow you to share your recordings to create DD mixes with pretty menus and the such. If IM ever gets off their butt it's worth at least a demo since you could encode and burn both DD and DTS tracks to the same DVD and see what you'd like better.

DVD-Audio is (was?) a good format (pet peeve- let me leave the TV off please- I hate having to navigate a menu to start track 1!!!) Of course there's enough confusion in the home theater world now that explaining to someone that you'll need six more cables isn't easy. Chicken and egg too- the software titles never panned out for the masses. And don't get me going with Sony screwing up yet again by not releasing stuff like the entire Pink Floyd catalog in SACD at launch of that format. I've heard enough 5.1 mixes of both classic and new recordings to know that I'm completely sold on the notion of surround music. Unless you like classical music, the choices are a bit thin of course. I do agree with you- hopefully the HD versions of DD and DTS will give the industry a kick in the backside to release more multichannel music.

Hmmm...encoding DTS via Virtual PC, eh? Shouldn't be too bad. Then again, if enough people from Apple who have the power to do something realizes that you, me, and at least a few others are interested but have to resort to a Windows solution for a multi-media codec, maybe they'll release such a beast. Then again, I'm one of the many waiting for a decent alternative to Quicken since Intuit screwed up the initial OS X version and never quite fixed it...

Cheers!
Marty

Hi goalie81

Found your long Feb 6 post extremely interesting, especially regarding the article in Sound on Sound Feb 2006.

Could you confirm that the article is "Technique - Distributing Sound Mixes"?

This magazine is not sold anywhere near where I live. The article is not available as a PDF to buy or download from the SOS website.I'm working out what to do next to get a copy of the article.

A long while ago, I did a small 5.1 demo in DVDSP2, but gave up. The article you mention might get me back on track again. now that I have DVDSP4.

Regards. Robert.

Finally, the latest issue of Sound on Sound (Feb
2006) features the exact procedures used to create a
5.1 Dolby Digital mix from DVDSP4. It's rather
simple, and even fun in a way once you figure out
DVDSP4's interface. The mistake I made at first was
not including enough video. For example, if my
encoded song was 4 minutes but my jpeg only lasted 10
seconds, I only heard the first 10 seconds of audio.
The video has to be as long as the audio- just
stretch it out in the window to match the length of
the audio. It's mentioned in this article.

Good reading here. If any of you don't know about this, the best site for Mac audio info is here: http://www.bigbluelounge.com/

I'm not connected with that site; it's just a place I go for info.