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Level 1

25 points

Macbook for Aperture 3.3

So after the (not so captivating) WWDC I think it's time to go ahead with the new MacBook for Aperture. Prior to the new refresh I was planning to go with the 15" MBP but not the top one of the two. After the refresh I'm not so sure. The new retina models are nice but what a price!! I'm reluctant to drop that kind of money on a laptop TBH. The big problem for me is also that they have no FW or Ethernet connectors. It'll be my only laptop and at times there is a need for ethernet, if only to access a troublesome router or get faster speed. While I'm planning on a Thunderbolt external HDD for back up at soame stage I also have FW drives that I'd still like to access, so the sparkly retina machines (thankfully - esp when looking at the $3,000 + 750 GB SSD version) are out of the equation. Any upgrade will also bring me Mountain Lion and Aperture 3.3 of course.

I'm not that heavy a processor of pics to be honest but at times I do do a lot. I also use the full range of Nik Software. My Aperture library is only about 50GB at the moment so either the 500 or 750 HDDs on the 15" would suffice. I'd move my masters off to external referenced if it ever became an issue.

The question now though is which 15"? I'm sure the 2.3 GHz would be MUCH faster than my ageing MB (white) 2.16 GHz ICD2 with its 2 GB of RAM, esp if upgraded to 8GB RAM. The 2.6 is around $400 more here in Malaysia and I'm wondering if it is worth the cost given that the extra 250 GB of HDD I probably don't need. The only issue I suppose maybe the 1GB video instead of the 512 MB, given that Aperture is quite graphics intensive and, I believe, will prefer to use the discreet video card if it can, thereby also putting less strain on the rest of the system. Whichever I go for I'll likely upgrade to the anti-glare screen. Surprisingly it seems the 15" cannot be upgraded to 16GB RAM, the only other thing I'd consider.

Of course the 2.6 is probably the best option, it's just how much of a compromise the 2.3 would be.

Aperture 3, Mac OS X (10.6.8)

Posted on Jun 12, 2012 1:56 AM

29 replies

Jun 12, 2012 7:58 PM in response to TechAddict

TechAddict wrote:

1) How essential is an SSDD? May ageing 2007 MB 2.16 with it's 2GB RAM has coped well up until now, albeit the SBOD is proving more and more of a problem these days. Is an SSDD essential for good Aperture performance or does it just make it excellent? For many, good may well be enough.

It is about cost-effective 2012 purchase decision-making rather than about what may or may not be "well enough."

For all apps and the OS an SSD is simply the most important overall performance improvement available after all the "givens" like: -all 2011/2012 MBP CPUs are strong, -all 2011/2012 MBP non-integrated GPUs are strong enough, -all 2011/2012 MBPs are available with at least 8 GB RAM.

An SSD is not "essential" any more than fuel injection instead of carburetor in a motor vehicle is essential. But a rational person does not logically purchase a modern performance motor vehicle with a carburetor.

Note too SSD would probably make that SBOD go away because page outs caused by inadequate RAM would be to SSD instead of to HDD, and SSD latencies are orders of magnitude quicker than HDD latencies.

2) How much discreet video RAM does Aperture need? It seems to be the case that people have historically suggested the first machine in the old (2011) 15" MBP line, with 4GB and the 512 MB Radeon card. I ask this specifically because for those who don't feel the need to go down the SSDD route, that same machine in 2012 in it's base state is just $1,799 and fitted out with 8GB (which I think is essential) and anti-glare still only costs $1,999

Specific numbers are hard to forecast because a new box is for 2012-2016, which means it will live with OS and app versions we have not seen yet.

GPUs and RAM are the weak links in MBPs because MBPs only have 2 RAM slots and because the GPUs are mobile-strength and not upgradable. Historically Aperture has been very GPU-sensitive, but we have no 2011/2012 info in that regard.

The non-upgradable RAM in new MBPs is a horrible precedent a) because Apple RAM is always way, way overpriced and b) because non-upgradable prevents users from future upgrading when RAM is more needed as well as much less expensive.

From another post of mine regarding RAM:

------------------------------------------------------

• RAM is (finally) cheap.

• 64-bit operation is (finally) mainstream and largely functional among OS, apps and hardware.

• Memory bandwidth is (finally) improving.

• Under OS X apps like Photoshop have been capable of benefiting from at least 32 GB RAM for many years.

• Digital image file sizes continue to get larger. E.g. Nikon just upped the ante in files sizes with 36 MP images from the relatively inexpensive D800 DSLR. Others will follow.

• DSLRs now produce video - which adds Mac processing not previously needed. Many still photogs now also do video.

• Image processing continues to get more complex.

• 3D is becoming much, much more mainstream.

• More and more, lower level graphics folks are accessing pro-level tools.

Given the above, IMO designers will incorporate accessing large RAM amounts into their designs. Buyers should plan accordingly.

The life of a pro box is 3-5 years; appropriate RAM is not about what happened last year, it is about 2013-2017. Of course we will see increasing RAM demand.

My 02 FWIW. HTH.

-Allen

TechAddict Author

Level 1

25 points

Jun 12, 2012 8:55 PM in response to SierraDragon

Excellent points once again and TQVM. All helps. I'm happy to spend money on tech, just not waste it to have the latest and flashy toys just for the sake of it. In order of priority it seems the 2012 purchase decision needs try to factor in:

1) SSDD.

2) 8 GB RAM and preferably (to guard against redundancy to some degree) 16 GB.

3) VRAM (albeit onboard Intel RAM would probably cut it), discreet seems the better option with 1GB desirable

It seems to predicate towards a Retina 15" base model at least.

I explicitly say Retina because the other MBPs are also 2012 of course. They are upgradeable for RAM at the Apple store but what I'm not 100% sure on do the 2012 15" non-retina MBPs take RAM by way of slot or are they also fixed like the retina models?

If it's fixed it knocks the non-retina MBPs out of the contest for me because the RAM is only priority 2 and getting the non-retina MBP with a 256 SSDD which is priority 1 (I say 256 SSDD to compare to the base Retina) with anti-glare pushes it to $2,699 v $2,199 for the base retina model or $2,399 with the 256GB SSDD model pushed to 16 GB RAM (which seems more desirable than the 8 GB RAM model with 512 GB SSDD).

Decisions, decisions, but I feel the non retina models may be a non-starter. Have to say, I've never found an Apple purchase decision this tough before.

Jun 13, 2012 8:47 AM in response to TechAddict

TechAddict wrote:

Decisions, decisions, but I feel the non retina models may be a non-starter. Have to say, I've never found an Apple purchase decision this tough before.

The retina models may be a non-starter as well. They are unavailable, both locally and on-line. Just confirmed this with an Apple on-line sales person.

😐

Jun 13, 2012 9:41 AM in response to TechAddict

TechAddict wrote:

I've never found an Apple purchase decision this tough before.

Agreed, there are more permutations and combinations than normal, as well as ongoing surprise information like soldered RAM. However IMO you are dialing it down to digestible choices very nicely.

IMO the soldered RAM makes non-retina June 2012 MBPs unacceptably poor value. Other 2011/2012 MBPs are acceptable choices as long as built-in or retrofitted SSD is in the mix. RAM on such boxes can be 8 GB since they are upgradable to 16 GB in the future when RAM is cheaper, but 8-GB third-party DIMMs are now inexpensive enough that one may choose to go with 16 GB from the start.

For Aperture non-upgradable retina MBPs should be 16-GB RAM models only, because we are buying for 2013-2016 not just for today. The RAM from Apple is overpriced by more than $100 but it is what it is.

-Allen

TechAddict Author

Level 1

25 points

Jun 13, 2012 8:24 PM in response to SierraDragon

I have to say that the soldered RAM is a bit of a cheap shot IMHO and I'm also dialling in the option to cut lot losses and bin Apple altogether. For anything decent in terms or processing power Apple is forcing people towards their overpriced RAM, albeit it's better these days, but it's not replaceable.

It seems like SSD and 16MB RAM is going to be essential (but they are clearly going to sell the vast majority of machines without that spec - but then I suppose most don't do heavy photo processing) and that means top of the range 15" MBP or the base Retina at least.

Off to look at some comparable Windows machines. despite the investment in Aperture and Nik software, it may be better to cut my losses and go with more flexible machines. Problem is, that means Lightroom :-(

TechAddict Author

Level 1

25 points

Jun 14, 2012 12:53 AM in response to TechAddict

Just doing some pricing here. As an example, the older 15" MBP with 4 GB RAM is still sold by re-sellers here at it's previous Apple price. The old machine is not available in the Apple Store.

So. Old machine @ $1,799 + $150 for 16GB RAM kit + $399 for a Crucial 512 SSD = $2,348. At that price the top spec retina with 1 GB discreet processor, better CPU and a 768 GB SSD would seem to be a better investment. It's just the 16GB RAM that pushes the price to even more lofty heights.

Beginning to feel that the Retina with 256 GB SSD and 16 GB RAM is best option. I'd go for the 8GB is the RAM wasn't soldered. Thanks Apple.

Some really nice Win machines out there (Samsung 9 and Dell XPS 15) but I'm loathe to go to the Windows based solutions for library management. If I did go to Windows I think I'd use my Quad Core i7, 32 GB RAM, 2GB GPU, 256 GB SSD and 4TB HDD and just get an air to surf, or just stick to the iPad. Now there's a thought.

TechAddict Author

Level 1

25 points

Jun 14, 2012 9:15 PM in response to TechAddict

Decided I think. I did contemplate the purchase of a 2011 15" yesterday with a view to, as suggested by SD, upgrading RAM to 16GB, slotting in a 3rd party SSD and moving the 750 GB HDD (I thought it better to get the 1GB GPU) into the optical slot (or is merely putting the SSD in the optical bay possible??) seeing as the local reseller has carved $150 off the machines in the 2011 line up. The 512 MB at roughly @ $1,500 would be even cheaper BUT I'm not sure about buying a machine with only a 512 MB GPU given I use Aperture and all the Nik Software apps and given I want a 4-6 year life expectancy.

As such, I decided from the current line up that I'd likely opt for the 256 GB retina with 16 GB RAM. BUT. I have always used a 13" MB and I think I do prefer the size. I use it on my lap a lot. Given that a 13" retina is anticipated I may wait to see if that materialises. If it does, I hope that Apple give us merely a smaller screen and still allow a 256 GB SSD and 16 GB RAM. Given the retina premiums there seems little point in constraining a 13" retina with 4GB RAM and a 128 GB SSD, but, we will see.

Jul 2, 2012 7:05 PM in response to SierraDragon

SierraDragon wrote:

• Ethernet and FW ports are irrelevant, easily dealt with via cables.

OT:

Hi Allen,

Can you recommend an available FW--Tbolt or FW--USB3 adapter? Afaict, the Apple FW to Tbolt adapter is not yet in stores (though it is expected any day). At my local Apple Store, the colored shirt people hadn't even heard of it. Thanks. --Kirby.

Jul 3, 2012 10:40 PM in response to Kirby Krieger

Kirby-

Matrox appeals to me:

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/12/06/03/matrox_thunderbolt_dock_turns_macb ooks_into_desktops_for_249.html

All such devices are bleeding edge though.

-Allen

Jul 4, 2012 2:24 AM in response to SierraDragon

Allen -- thanks -- I like the _idea_ a lot, but it leaves me unable to access my Firewire drives now and in the future:

- not available until September (and everyone is missing their release dates for Thunderbolt peripherals), and

- still _does not have any Firewire ports_.

Is there any device you know of that allows me to use my kennel of trained Firewire external drives with my new MacBook Pro with Retina display? Until I can connect to Firewire drives my rMBP is just a show dog.

--Kirby.

léonie

Level 10

194,871 points

Aug 1, 2012 7:01 AM in response to Kirby Krieger

Still waiting for FireWire? Now it is there:

Apple's finally released the Thunderbolt to FW adaptor: 🙂

http://store.apple.com/us/product/MD464ZM/A

Cheers

Léonie

Aug 1, 2012 9:47 AM in response to léonie

Thanks Léonie 😎 . That link isn't working for me yet ("Page not found") but I have confirmed over the phone that the Apple on-line store has the adapters in stock. Local Apple Stores should be getting them soon (mine does not have them yet).

I moved all my needed drives to USB3 enclosures (purchased from OWC), but have been backing up to my Firewire drives via USB2, so will be quite glad to have the Thunderbolt-to-FW800 adapters.

léonie

Level 10

194,871 points

Aug 1, 2012 10:02 AM in response to Kirby Krieger

That is what it should look like; quite expensive, I think $29

Funny, that a link to the US store works in Germany and not in Pennsylvania!

BTW. I found the link in the GarageBand Forum, posted by HangTime - music lovers also need fast drives and fast macs.

Aug 1, 2012 10:03 AM in response to léonie

I'll try VPN to Hamburg 😉 . The on-line store isn't claiming delivery until 7 August at the earliest (no guaranty).

Macbook for Aperture 3.3