Quartz Extreme

John A,

More details would be helpful. What add on graphics card do you have, if any?

You say "it talks about Quartz Extreme." Do you have it or are you thinking about buying it? If you have it, please describe it.

"does this happen automatically?"

If the card has a coprocessor, the software has to support coprocessing. Software does not really benefit from a dual processor in a Macs just because the hardware is there. For example, Word does not benefit from a math coprocessor but Excel will go out and look for one and automatically put it to work. It is all in the details. Thanx

Jim

John,

Thanx 4 the update. You have now exceeded my level of inteligence. This is more of a software question about Panther and I am a total novice at X. I ask my son to teach new tricks to an old dog.

If you also post here:

http://discussions.apple.com/category.jspa?categoryID=161

- probably under "Using Mac OS X -

you will also attract a newer crowd than us in the old folks home! Good luck.

Jim

Hi John.

Allow another old dog to help Jim.

Quartz Extreme (QE) was introduced in Jaguar to improve 2D performance and allow certain transparency effects. For Beige owners, there is a basic hardware limitation.

QE is, by default, enabled only for graphics cards in AGP slots. The Beige has only PCI slots, so QE does not work by default. There is a Terminal hack that can tell the OS to route QE data through a vidcard in a PCI slot. Information on it is here,

Be sure to read the cautions, as enabling QE can make for strange effects, including some PCI cards to shut down due to over-saturation of the PCI bus.

Allan

Allan,

1,000 bonus points for interesting reading. The 5 to 15% speed increase is at the risk of a 50% speed decrease! Sounds like great odds to me. lol

I was intrigued by the developer's comment:

Note: Although the reader above said he verified "Quartz Extreme" was enabled in Tiger, a developer wrote to say that the above edit will NOT enable HARDWARE Quartz 2D Extreme for a pre-9600 ATI graphics chip. (10.4.0 has Q.2D Extreme disabled by default on all installs BTW) (The Mac Mini and iBook G4 current models use an ATI Radeon 9200 Mobility for instance. Apple notes for Core image support requires a 9600XT Radeon or better (9700 Mobility or better)/Nvidia FX5200 or better. Hardware support for the ARB fragmentprogram extension is required. Note - in reality any 9600 or up (including a 9600 Mobility supports core image/core video in Tiger.)

Are they saying that even a brand new mini does not take advantage of Quartz Extreme?

Jim

No, John, I've not tried the hack. With warnings about "over-saturating the PCI bus" (I have little idea what that means). I have been leery of using it on this computer, on which I run a flight sim that demands around 115MB of the VRAM on my PCI Radeon. I figure that, with such a load, messing with the settings (which are fine for 3D apps like the flight sim) could prove to be more trouble than it's worth.

Allan

John,

If I may jump in, more detailed question might be, "what airplanes can you learn to fly using that version of flight simulator?" Alan, I presume that you have a yoke and the full controls set up. Any links to hardware sources for mac yoke controllers? I tired of older versions that just used a mouse and I could not find a Mac compatible controller. It would be fun to revisit the application with a full cockpit setup.

Jim

PS, Some of Psyko's classmates at DeVry University built a cockpit and configured a laptop to create a wireless link to a remote laptop running Flight Simmulator to demonstrate the ability to control a drone. Fun exhibit to visit.

John,

The flight simulator I use (vicarious flying for a guy who cannot pass the FAA physical to be a real pilot) is X-Plane. It is the only option for the Mac today. Runs pretty well on the old Beige, thanks to the massive video card. Frame rates are 16-18 fps at 1024x768 with the detail level set one click under "max."

A good desktop flight sim is like real simulator training. I can plan a flight, and have to use the same navigation aids as a real pilot to get from A to B, all in real time. If your landing technique is not good, you make 1/18th of a golf course. It can be set to randomly cause some systems to fail in flight. It can be as simple as the autopilot going walkabout, or as serious as having a wing fall off. A good mark of proper sim programming is that all the planes should not "feel" the same. A big jet should not feel like a Cessna (this is a complaint I've heard against MS Flight Simulator).

Jim,

I'd love to have all those control input devices but they are way too expensive. I have a single Saitek joystick--no rudder pedals. There are thumb buttons on the stick that I've programmed to control the rudder. Even if I could afford the pedal and yoke sets, I believe my USB card is not going to tolerate any more widgets. With the vid card, I'm reluctant to add any more PCI cards. I believe the big Radeon is drawing a bunch of electrons from the PCI bus.

Allan

I get choppy iTunes visuals also. I think it's the QE thing all over. I understand that QE works nearly all its magic on 2D stuff.

Want a screen saver that really probes your 3D capability? Search versiontracker for one called "Lattice." It runs well on 500mHz and 128VRAM.

Unless a 2D saver is really simple (geometric shapes, for example) I sometimes see a little hesitation.

I was just wondering why you needed 2 Radeon 9200 video cards.
A single card supports dual independent monitors in extended desktop mode. Even though you have one VGA and one DVI port, with the right kind of adapters you can drive two identical monitors, either VGA or DVI, can't you?


G3 Desktop, SonnetEncoreZIF G4 1GHz, 768MB, WingsAV-6MB, DVR-106D, 60GB Maxtor Mac OS X (10.4.7) PCI: TempoUltraATA66-120GB Maxtor, 120GB Seagate; TangoUSB/FW; Radeon9200-17"LCD

Appalooza... in case you haven't had the Mac Mini question answered, the new Mac Mini (Read: PC Mini...) doesn't have a dedicated video card. It uses an Intel graphics chip without its own VRAM.. it's total garbage. QE needs a real card, and at least 32MB VRAM.

As a result, it, and the new MacBooks (non-pro) perform worse than the old PowerBooks in games.