guest network does not work when bridging airport express to extreme

I have a working solution now for using an AirPort Extreme in Bridge mode below a 3rd party router and having its Guest network work properly.

Yay!!

It involves creating a special VLAN (ID = 1003) on the router.

Once I had sorted out all the details it works great.

It is relatively easy to do, but complex enough that I chose to describe it in detail with screen shots and diagrams in a pdf I have uploaded to the new Tutorials section of the R.A.I.S. page at http://rais.precursor.ca

Enjoy.

What speeds are you getting? See our previous posts on the speed issue.

Using the Guest network in Bridge mode below my Cisco router using a VLAN I find that my upload speed is my ISPs stated maximum but my download speed is a about a tenth of that !

My service is 5 0 Mbps down and 5 Mbps up.

In guest network I am getting 5 Mbps in both directions.

While on the main WiFi network I am getting 50 down and 5 up.

Alex

I have a similar setup to Alex - edgeos router creating a vlan 1003 and AirPort Extreme ac 6th gen, 2 airport expresses (2nd generation) connected via Ethernet providing wifi.

I too am seeing limited download bandwidth on the guest network - around 15% of my 60Mb download, upload is unaffected.

I'm hoping enough people leave feedback to Apple about this. There doesn't seem to be a work around this. Download speeds on the guest network tagged on vlan 1003 barely surpass .5mbit when using a third party router.

http://www.apple.com/feedback/

I've opened a ticked and discussed it with support. The reply from Apple, higher up, was that they didn't support Guest network in bridge mode. I told him it wasn't likely to make any difference but was happy to reset the device so it ran using NAT, despite this not being what I want since I don't want double NAT on my LAN, so I can demonstate that the problem still persists. Apple will likely say that it's because of the way we are configuring the device in tandem with a managed switch and vLAN 1003 until enough users complain about the guest network not working in the ordinary way.

I've moved back to another wireless system comprisiing of two older cisco WAP's and a cisco WLC to do most of my wireless so now no longer need the guest network on the Airport Extreme. I'll go back to Apple after I've reconfigured my Airport Extreme in the conventional way to report my findings about the guest network. It's an okay device as a good looking, but basic, 802.11ac access point but it's not sufficient for my needs beyond that.

Really is a shame, them saying "we don't support it" basically means we are either too lazy to implement it or don't want to. The thing is is that it does work, just that download speeds are terrible. The other thing is, is that when using an AirPort as a router and one or more AirPorts in bridge mode via ethernet, guest network works fine. So Apple saying they don't support guest networks in bridge is quite the slap in the face.

Yes unfortunately that was the response that came back to my ticket. The way bridge mode users are getting the guest network to function using a managed network switch to tag the switch port that the AE is connected to with VLAN ID 1003 is unsupported. I've just reconfigured my AE into DHCP & NAT mode, which had the effect of creating double NAT on my LAN, and both the main wireless network and the guest wireless networks configured on my AE now function at full speed both upstream and downstream. You say that the speed of the guest network on additional AE access points running in bridge mode when connected to a main AE running in DHCP & NAT mode is also fine. Clearly there is a problem with using guest network with a single AE running in bridge mode for some currently unexplained reasons.

I received similar feedback from Apple support regarding the same issue - i.e. guest network in bridge mode with a managed switch configured with VLAN 1003 is not (and will not) be supported. Double NAT works and permits full speed on both the main and guest network, but it's not a great solution. My workaround was to attach an Airport Express (also in bridge mode) on the back of the Airport Extreme and use that as my guest network access point. It has no problems passing through VLAN 1003 for the guest network at full speed. Definitely looks like a software problem between the Airport versions: 7.7.x on the Extreme and 7.6.4 on the Express.

This sounds like complete BS to me that they won't support it....For the money of the device not everyone wants Double NAT which is a PITA to manage, but either way it's crap they just won't fix this in bridge mode. It's got to be easy and I bought FIVE of these for using with a managed switch.

Just wanted to add my experience with this situation. The guest network was also throttled for me. But, in addition, my Airport Extreme will lockup randomly throughout the day with the guest WiFi enabled. The Extreme is running firmware 7.6.4, is the a/n model (prior to latest), is in Bridge Mode, with a FortiGate 40C as the main router/DHCP Server/VLAN provider. Any others experiencing this lockup?

nabeards

just moved the Router Mode from "off (bridge mode)" to DHCP and NAT, and guest network is working fine.

The issue here is simple and only a problem when you have a roaming apple network. The fact Apple won't fix it ***** because you cannot get around it when the AE's are individually connected to a managed switch. The "Main" AP that is running DHCP and NAT even if enabled will give normal guest access speeds, the issue is the other extended ones. In order for those to even PASS traffic they have to have a tagged VLAN on 1003 on the manage switched so they can get a DHCP address. If they were directly connected to the main AE it's not an issue since the switch ports are unmanaged.

Once you tag these then the ones in Bridge mode get the slow speeds. The is 100% UNAVOIDABLE with a managed switch in the mix and MUST be fixed by Apple at the AE/VLAN side. It's an obvious bug in the AE in bridged mode that it works....just that it works "slow".

This problem would persist if the "main AE was in bridge mode but it becomes the only one that works "right" when it's running DHCP/NAT but anything in Bridge mode gets jacked. The only way I can see around it is to connect ALL the AE's to an unmanaged switch, on the AE interconnects and then link the main AE's WAN port to the managed switch, but I've not tested it. In theory it should work as the Main AE would strip the VLAN tag and in effect would be no different than connecting to the LAN ports on the main AE.

Bottom line....it's a crappy bug that can and should be fixed so you don't need another switch to interconnect AE's to each other.

Hello all.

Just purchased the latest Apple airport Extreme and three Apple Airport Expresses to replace some older equipment and set up a simple roaming network at my home. What a nightmare!! This Apple stuff is supposed to just work! When it does not some documentation would help, instead of having to trawl through hundreds of outdated web pages to try and find stuff.

Anyways, I removed my TalkTalk router and plugged the Extreme straight into the Fibre modem, I then ran the wizard and all was well. Everything working, lovely fast internet connection, and a lovely fast wireless connection from the Extreme. The range is awful, and certainly no better than the supplied TalkTalk router! The Extreme is much faster on wireless, but the range is mediocre. A big disappointment but...... moving swiftly on.

I then started to connect the Airport expresses to form a roaming network. I'm no slouch when it comes to technology, and can normally get routers, switches, etc up and running in minutes, I found the Apple system totally counter intuitive. I ran the wizard, selected the various tick boxes (Extend the wireless network using an Ethernet cable) and BANG, the whole system fell over!!??

Long story short, several resets later and pages of web browsing, and I find the correct setting is "Create a wireless network" and set the Express's to Bridge mode, and away we go.

To be brief I expected this to be a walk in the park with Apple bearing in mind the cost of their kit and their claims. Where was the wizard to ask me what I wanted and then configure it all for me? Even Windows is easier than this!

Talking of Windows....... Why does the Windows Airport utility not allow setting up the guest network on the Airport Express when they are in bridge mode??? Luckily I have an iPad running the latest Airport utility and was able to do it from there, but I digress....................... Grrrrrr!

Then of course, the guest networks on the Airport Expresses don't work due to reasons mentioned above due to the VLAN 1003 issue. To prove the point I connect the Airport Express units straight into the Extreme and the guest Networks start working (I can log in). OK, so far so good, I have a Netgear 24port Smart Switch bought in the New Year sales so I can configure that to pass the Guest Networks to the Extreme.

So, run a quick speed test and..................... The guest networks on the Airport Express's are only passing a tenth of the available bandwidth on my fibre connection? The normal wireless network extended from my Extreme (via Ethernet to Airport Express's) work at full speed as does the Guest network on the Extreme. The Guest Networks on my Airport Express's are diabolical for speed, even when connected directly into the back of the Airport Extreme, thus removing the smart switch from the equation.

What's going on here? So Apple support are saying that they do not (and never will) support Airport Express in Bridge mode, with guest Network, through a smart switch? And? What about when the Express is plugged directly into the Airport Extreme which is the primary base station, and is configured for DHCP and NAT? Surely to heaven they must support this? Has anybody asked the question?

I am currently considering boxing the whole lot up, returning it to the shop, and buying a set of Devolo powerline products to extend the wireless network from the TalkTalk router.

Gerald.

P.S.

imdavidthornton says "You say that the speed of the guest network on additional AE access points running in bridge mode when connected to a main AE running in DHCP & NAT mode is also fine.............."

What do you mean exactly by "Additional AE"? Do you mean additional Airport Extreme, or additional Airport Express?

Certainly my Airport Express's running "Guest Network" (In Bridge Mode) plugged directly in the Primary Airport Extreme running NAT & DHCP perform terribly.

Or are we saying that additional Airport Extremes running "Guest Network" (in Bridge mode) perform at full speed (Guest Network) when plugged directly into a primary Airport Extreme running NAT & DHCP. If the last statement is true then this sounds a very expensive way to form a Roaming wireless and Guest Network around the home.

Or have I misunderstood.

Gerald.