The clipboard converts JPG data to TIFF

I just had a go 'round with senior apple tech, about an issue I'd expect people to be jumping up and down about, but there's hardly a complaint.


Essentially Apple has verified a clipboard issue in Snow Leopard and Mountain Lion, a problem that affects Apple Mail and Pages, and perhaps other applications. I first consciously encountered the issue when using Apple Mail, so I'll describe it in that context.


When I copy a portion of a jpeg (or make a screenshot) it pastes into Apple Mail as a TIFF file. (NOTE :I do this a lot, because I need to quicly send cropped portions of existing images, without cropping, saving, attaching, remembering to remove unneeded saved image from hard drive ...)


Here's an all-Apple scenario:


  • Open a JPG in Preview
  • Select a portion of the JPG
  • Copy
  • Paste inline into Apple Mail
  • Send the email
  • Open the Sent Mail box, and look at the attachment type for the message sent
  • RESULT: The attachment is a TIFF file. JPG was copied / TIFF was sent


This is a big problem:


  1. the conversion to TIFF needlessly bloats the file size by four to eight times the original size
  2. worse, some email clients can't hand TIFFs, and can't display them inline.
  3. This clipboard problem seems to pervade Apple software, and is evident in Apple Pages. Somethin's rotten in the OS.


Other vendors handle pastes seemlessly. In mail applications like Entourage and Thunderbird ... ya copy a JPG it pastes a JPG. But Apple claims that the clipboard conversion is normal expected behavior, handled by Quicktime. In reality, it's a total pain, expected or not


I haven't looked into it, but I'd expect that after an image copy the clipboard may have more than one format in it. Consider the text clipboard, which often simultaneously contains: plain text, rich text, HTML, etc. The software receiving the paste should intelligently decide which format to take in on paste. Same should go for images. Even if the clipboard contains only TIFF data after copy/conversion, shouldn't the receiving app be able to request that QuickTime convert the TIFF to JPG on paste? If so, well, Mail could do that! I believe the application is responsible for chosing which format to paste— that's certainly true if there are more than one formats on the image clipboard, or if conversion is offered.


I hope to not have to resort to measures like third party clipboards:


http://www.jot.fm/issues/issue_2008_03/column2.pdf


https://discussions.apple.com/thread/545464?answerId=2662725022#2662725022


Here are some posts on Apple's forum complaining about this problem:


https://discussions.apple.com/search.jspa?resultTypes=&dateRange=all&peopleEnabl ed=true&q=clipboard+jpeg+tiff+convert&containerType=&container=&containerName=&u sername=&rankBy=relevance


After talking with six people at Apple (half who couldn't understand the issue), and after devoting two hours of my time to find a resolution or tenable workaround, I find it discouraging to recieve this responce from an Apple Senior advisor:


It does appear that the clipboard may save images to it as uncompressed TIFF files, instead, you can try opening the image in preview or dragging and dropping to avoid the clipboard. Again, I've come across workarounds like automated scrips and clipboard manager applications but I can't really make any recommendation or suggestions regarding third party apps.


What's the real problem here?


John

Posted on Mar 12, 2013 6:31 PM

Reply
82 replies

Aug 23, 2017 8:58 AM in response to Csound1

And we all have heard & know what opinions are like, as you've got,.... everybody's got one. And some have their opinions pop up just because they're grappling with somebody intelligent & all they want to do is test their mettle & wits & saber-rattling skills against the smart guy, preferably in shoulder-shrugging anonymity, & want nothing more than that. In this day & age of smartphone worshiping & smartphone worshippers & idolizers, a whole lot of what is said by many, and their motivations, are suspect. Lots of smartphone-worshipping existential loneliness out there these days, and the societal consequences that come from that...... such as bored, self-anonymized internet forum trolls.

OUT.

Aug 23, 2017 9:11 AM in response to IdrisSeabright

jeeeeeez.... where'd you come from?? lol

gettin' whacky in here...... time for me to disappear from here & let the wackiness subside & settle down. Unbelievable how all this has escalated upon *only me* who, just one among other posters & yet the only one to be "attacked" by Miss Manners wanna-be's, jumped on some high-points guy who was being smug & short with a very low-points not-savvy Mac guy with a valid question. Some of you need to get your priorities straight as to who are the good guys & who are the bad guys & which do I support. In our current idolatrous smartphoneland, we're seeing more & more wide-eyed sorta clueless-to-truth crazy people out there in society....

DONE & OUT.

Y'all opponents go have a nice day. Pleeeeeeze. Thx. I'm done. wow..... crazy. rudeness like beauty?? apologize to insecure hypersensitives?? huh???

Aug 23, 2017 9:18 AM in response to kevinkendall

kevinkendall wrote:


LOL 😁 Yep.... good Jedi mindtrick. I've done it. Works, til ya get stabbed in the back unsuspectingly. LOL But that's life... ups & downs, ins & outs, and different shades of grays.

You've said you were "out" about three times now, that you wanted no part of this craziness. But you don't seem to be able to help yourself. Needing to have the last word is not the sign a mature, thoughtful "good guy".

Apr 8, 2013 8:18 AM in response to John Blasquez

Thanks for this description....


Well, I have nothing to add, this behavior is completely wrong, makes a basic feature hard to use, and thanks to Apple's legendary "ease of use" I have to create a file on the desktop and find and drag it and drop it, then send the mail. But you know what ? I should be happy, because at least now I can trash the file and empty the trash without quitting Mail ! Yes, they actually fixed a bug lying around for more than two years !


Maybe we should give them two more years to fix that one.

Apr 8, 2013 8:27 AM in response to John Blasquez

When I copy a portion of a jpeg (or make a screenshot) it pastes into Apple Mail as a TIFF file.


Whether or not this is incorrect behavior is an opinion, not an absolute. Editing a JPEG loses data and causes a loss of quality. Plus, how can you tell something as simple as the clipboard what quality you want the resulting JPEG to have? You can't. Apple is probably saving the data to a lossless format (TIFF) to avoid such issues.


The solution, of course, is to not use the clipboard. You obviously have very specific desires as to how you want the image saved... so use an image editor to crop, save the image in the format and quality that you desire, and attach the resulting image to your Mail message. Alternately, you could probably create a workflow in Automator that would take care of doing all that for you, using the frontmost Preview window. Another option would be to use an app other than Preview, that will encode the clipboard contents as JPEG rather than TIFF.

Apr 8, 2013 8:45 AM in response to John Blasquez

John Blasquez wrote:


What's the real problem here?

You just noticed something that has been unchanged since OS X time immemorial. If you inspect the clipboard with a utility, you can see that the data is even labeled "NeXT TIFF v4.0 pasteboard type". If your primary concern is bending over backwards for people with PC e-mail clients, this should be the least of your worries.


On OS X, all images are TIFF images. The file format is just that - a "file" format. When it is read into memory, it is always converted to a lossless TIFF. Otherwise, every time you copied and pasted, you would lose quality. That would be messy real fast.


I suggest instead of using the "Share" feature instead of copy and paste. If you share an entire image, it will share the file in whatever format you have saved it. If you only want to sare a portion of an image, select it and copy it to the clipboard. Then, in Preview, choose File > New from clipboard. Then click the "Share" button and choose e-mail. That will give you a PNG image instead of TIFF.

Apr 8, 2013 8:46 AM in response to thomas_r.

Well, there is a smart way to determine if this is dumb or smart : look at the number of email client in the world correctly handling TIFF images, and make a decision...


Apple did not make the smart one, period. PNG would be acceptable without loss of information, I agree about JPEG, I wouldn't want compression by default.


Would Apple be event smarter they would respect what's been set in com.apple.screencapture, like they do to save on desktop !

Apr 8, 2013 9:17 AM in response to John Blasquez

It has nothing to do with the Mac OS. Every single image editor in the world does the same thing. Photoshop, GIMP, you name it. JPEG is a file format, not a working format. In order for any image editor or OS to work with an image, it has to open the compressed JPEG data into an uncompressed state so you can work with it. Windows does exactly the same thing. Any image on the clipboard is uncompressed. It has to be.


It doesn't matter what you start with; JPEG, PNG, RAW, PSD, TIFF; they all have to worked on in an uncompressed state. Think about it, how exactly would you display an image that was still compressed even in memory? Compression is only used to save on storage space.

Apr 8, 2013 9:18 AM in response to thomas_r.

I agree with that, anyways it comes from Apple and we're talking about consistancy and what's best for the user.

My opinion is that screencapture should respect what's in com.apple.screencapture prefs, but I can accept that for quality reasons, the screenshot is always stored as uncompressed TIFF. It is up to the application to transform the picture in that case. There is absolutely no point to pasting an uncompressed TIFF image in a email, nobody would expect that being the default behavior. Nobody would expect a regular user to understand why his PC fellows never see their screenshot

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The clipboard converts JPG data to TIFF

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