Pages 5 features checklist

Can anyone tell me what happens to those of us who rely on Pages '09 on both an iPad and iMac for our professional writing --saved via iCloud --when we next need (or want) to replace either our desktop or tablet?

We won't be able to add '09 to them. And we will lose all our professional formatting.

I've no choice but to go back to MS Work now. It's the only full function thing reliable across both now and for the future as well as accessible via the net. Sad.

I totally agree. And now that we're forced to use Office, how are we going work with Word and Excel files on Apple phones and tablets? Next purchasing round I guess we look at ms surface?

Peter,

PeterBreis0807 wrote:

James Mol wrote:

Anyone try out iStudio as a replacement yet?

http://www.istudiopublisher.com

Looks as though it might be a substitute.

Yes, and no it is not.

Peter

Can you elaborate? Their website looks spiffy. Do you rate Swift Publisher higher? (Please just asking for your personal opinion.)

Thank you.

Will have to start looking at alternatives. Been waiting years for a Pages [real] update.

Dear "robogobo":

robogobo wrote:

Tristan, I didn't just "discover" Versioning (I actually suggested using it very early in this thread and in another), but I previously thought it was tied to Time Machine. After my previous attempts to help were met with "what if we're not using Time Machine", I went back to work trying to find a solution, because I'm such a nice guy. Then I discovered Versions are not tied to Time Machine. That means even people who don't use it could still recover their files. I'm one who embraced auto save and versioning the very first day it came out. But thanks for being condescending, anyway.

Now, when I get some time I'll go ahead and try your workflow.

BTW, any probability reported to be outside the 0-100% range immediately signals self-contradiction; and, in a self-contradictory system (of thought, for example), everything is true—and also false, at the same time.

Thanks so much. I'll try to remember that next time. You're so good to point it out because it's really important that I satisfy your needs. BTW, the sun doesn't actually "rise", rather the earth rotates to reveal it. FYI.

(what are you trying to prove, man?)

Actually, I wasn't trying to prove anything, but you did manage to prove yourself either sloppy or ignorant: contrary to your conclusion, "versioning" indeed is one of the functions (background/faceless daemons) of Time Machine itself. See the enhanced oval in the photo where "versioning" comes up blank on earlier versions, the error report is "signed" by Time Machine. Also, when you summon up Time Machine, do notice that the local "versioning" back-ups (stored on the start-up volume) and the back-ups from the designated (typically external) back-up volume are interleaved; the former load quickly, the latter must wait for the external volume to mount. They are both part and parcel of Time Machine.

In turn, I have reported a not-so-unreasonable (and Apple-advertising inspired) workflow where the iOS-OSX combination of the Pages upgrade does irretrievably kill a Pages 4.3 document—not to prove a point to anyone, but to warn users of a very real and serious danger. As my initial (and admittedly short) report went ignored, and a differend workflow that does not irrevocably destroy Pages 4.3 documents was lauded as a general solution to the problem, I repeated the report with more and clearer details. In that case, "versioning" (= hidden Time Machine back-up on the start-up volume) cannot help. Of course a back-up on other volumes will bring back the file when it was last backed up, and that depends on the individual's back-up strategy and frequency. I should like to hope that the pro users of Pages 4.3 did back-up and did know how to use their back-up; then again, it is probably useful to point that out, so thank you for the reminder. Even so, having to resort to a back-up always means loss of time and work: both the time and work one must invest in locating the latest workable back-up, as well as the time and work on the document after that back-up was made that now is lost.

As for the quip about probabilities in excess of 100%, well, it is a simple matter of a centuries-standard definition (of what probability and what certainty mean) and elementary arithmetic; if there is any "need" in this, it is a need for clear and precise communication. If someone reports 1000% certainty, it can only be understood as wanton hyperbole, attempted humor or basic inumeracy. Since you brought it up, your assurances of Apple's plans and strategy, only very high level Apple executives and Board members can claim to know with significant certainty (still <100%) what Apple will or will not do; the rest of us can only wager. So, unless you are a very high level Apple executive or Board member, you must be proffering a wager, at 1000%. Good luck with that. Over and out.

PeterBreis0807 wrote:

Simultaneously they also removed iCloud support for [Pages 4.3] as well. Also curious.

Peter, I seem to have no problem storing Pages 4.3 files in the iCloud, and accessing/editing/saving them with Pages 4.3. I open Pages 4.3, and open the files using the "Open…" menu command, then selecting the file from the resulting iCloud "folder." Does this not work for you?

My apologies if this has been asked and answered already. This is a long thread. We use Pages specifically for designing all kinds of graphic/layout heavy materials for our business. We share files and edit each other's work. We need to upgrade one machine to a new iMac. I'm assuming it will come with Mavericks and IWork installed. How do we move the old Pages over to the new machine?

We will never survive with the changes in P5.

Do you know if Microsoft have an new version of Office for Mac coming out any time soon? Actually, would be quite a sharp move on their part to not update Office now I guess.

PeterBreis0807 wrote:

If the doc is that simple, what is the point of Pages at all?

Just use TextEdit which always could open and save as .doc.

That argument just fails under its own weight.

Peter

If you consider that a well-reasoned, fair, or objective response, I think you should re-examine.

1. TextEdit does not support styles, images, diagrams, shapes -- all of which I use for the types of documents listed.
   
2. How exactly is exporting a plain text document from Text Edit, emailing it to 5 people, having all of them making separate edits, and then trying to reconcile those edits back into one document an equivalent workflow to creating a document, sharing a link with 5 people and collaborating via app and browser on the same document at the same time? Or keeping a live version of a document that specific people can keep updated at any time via browser or app?
   

I wonder if you even read my post.

PeterBreis0807 wrote:

mythmatic wrote:

Well, as I mentioned earlier on this thread, I think the case for the new Pages being better for light business word processing is a strong one.

For example, both my wife and I have been able to use Pages for the first time ever to colloborate with coworkers who do not have Macs (which, for each of us, is most of our coworkers).

In fact, I think for the work flow of:

1) create a simple document like a letter, procedure, spec, etc.

2) share it with people you want to be able to review / make edits

and

3a) export final PDF based on edits and share broadly

or

3b) keep a "live" version of the document online for people to both refer to and update as needed

Pages 5.0 is not only better than Pages '09, but for me is better than Google Docs and Microsoft Office 365 for this type of use case (which is one of my most common use cases, personally).

I realize that this excludes a lot of professional applications and needs, but I believe it is where Apple is starting with Pages 5.0, and that the software will most likely be for casual business use at first, and developed outward from there.

That is a rather weak rationalisation.

Why then did Apple withdraw iWork '09 (something people were willingly paying for) from the App Store and push a non-paying version down their throats?

Why did they remove the existing iCloud support from iWork '09 as well?

The only conclusion is that they are forcing Users onto their inferior solution because they know Users won't choose to cripple their own work.

If you claim it is because Apple is concerned that Pages '09 doesn't work 100% with iCloud/iOS Pages that is laughable because they have no problem with Pages 5 being as broken as it is.

Given a choice the Users would quickly sort out what works and what doesn't. What doesn't is Pages 5.

Peter

Sorry - I don't follow what you think I am "rationalising". I was responding to an earlier post and giving an example of a single use case where I think the new Pages is better than Page '09, which may give insight in why some specific users find it better for their specific needs.

I also mentioned, as I have a few times previously, that this does exclude most professional use cases which is very unfortunate. And I have previously mentioned that I think Apple made a big mistake and did their customers a disservice in releasing Pages 5.0 as an update rather than a separate, new, 1.0 product.

So please explain what you think I'm "rationalising" and if you object to my post, please clarify if you truly believe that there is not one single user or use case where Pages 5.0 features are more beneficial than Pages '09. That's not to say that your use cases or even the majority of use cases aren't harmed by the update, but do you really have such a strong disagreement with the idea that some particular group of users find the new features helpful?

I actually "love" (as much as one can love software...lol!) Pages 09. I used to have to use MS at work and I hated it. Years ago, when I had a windoze machine I used Serif Pages and I liked it a lot, I used it for all my DTP stuff.

Yes, Pages09 is really good at the Layout / Word Processing in one program! It does just about everything I need. That's why I was so looking forward to an update.

I know we can still use Pages 09, but I think it might be wise to look at alternatives. Even though getting Swift Pub, or iStudio doesn't solve replacing the Numbers 09! I really like it, too, and use it everyday.

Years ago, MS had a little program called "Works," I think. It was like a "home" version of Office, with lite versions of Word, Excel, and Access. For lite versions it was really jammed packed with just about everything someone at home with students could use (me). Then MS cancelled it. No updates, and when the OS updated the "Works" finally just wasn't "viable" anymore. Kind of like the AppleWorks of years ago - which actually had a really good database program included.

So, I'm thinking iWork suite is headed down that same slippery slope.

**Just did some looking around iStudio website, and I can't find that it does mail merge... swift doesn't either, I guess. dang this is a reall bummer.

Message was edited by: linda2009