Does the new Macbook Pro 15" (late 2013) supports 4K via Thunderbolt/Displayport?

imagine apple would provide MST support now, there is another problem that i didnt even think of. Somebody wrote about it in another thread here.

The new Dell 4k 24" has a resolution of about 200ppi, which is already close to apple's retina macbooks. At this resolution, you will definitely need the "Retina Dsiplay Setting" (larger buttons, text, etc. on the GUI and Apps)

However, if the display is not recognized as a "Retina Display", the Retina Setting will not be available! So even with that driver, third party high resolution displays (>=200ppi) will not work with OS X. Only hope is a new apple branded thunderbolt 4k display.

P.S. does soembody know how displays are recognized as "Retina"? Is it EDID? Could there be an override similar to this?

Niklas1337 wrote:

It is Mac Pro with Dell 4k Display. He installed a tweak or whatever and the text and GUI are quite nice!

1920x1080 HiDPi on 31.5" is not quite nice ;-)

Apple does have the technology since 2012, you can use scaled resolutions on your macbook pro retina. unfortunately no signs of MST Support and more variable hidpi modes on latest beta 5 of 10.9.2

😐

NiqueXyZ wrote:

If they don't upgrade the drivers for the retinas that have TB 2.0, I'll be ****** ******. That was the whole point of TB 2.0 -- to get 4K displays working.

And Intel Iris and Iris pro are fully capable of doing 4K @ 60Hz, and so is the NVidia...what the heck apple?

This is another post of yours where you talk about Iris's capability of outputting 4k @ 60Hz very confidently.

jimmal2nw wrote:

I've tried to follow the conversation and maybe I'm not understanding something, but I have the sharp 4k monitor and my macbook pro (15" latest edition) seems to drive it adequetly

That is extremely good news. I haven't seen this myself, but everyone posting on using 30 Hz 4K displays reports that they can't be productive because they can't see the mouse when it moves and there's issues with Window tearing, etc. IMO, 30 Hz in theory should be usable if there's no visible flicker.

jdiamond wrote:

Whether it's the version of Haswell that's two chips in a multi chip module (MCM) or not. However, even the single chip version seems capable of advanced graphics, so that doesn't tell you much. But if it's a quad core chip, it's definitely two chips in a package:

http://images.anandtech.com/doci/5078/184629v689919ice34j9c3_575px.jpeg

Given that eDP is embedded displayport, they must be imagining some really high end tablets. 🙂

Thank you. I gather even the lowest configured 13-inch rMBP's processor, i.e. i5 4258U, is a multi chip processor. Therefore, in light of the info available in the photo I attached in my previous post, this processor is capable of 4k @ 60Hz via DP regardless of display number.

IMO this is significant in respect of Iris -standard-. Because according to a specs sheet previously posted in this thread, Iris is capable of outputting 4k only @ 30Hz.

Now it seems that there are two pieces of contradictory information. Do you agree?

I definetely agree. I asked a forumite in another thread who owns a 13inch Haswell rMBP to try on Windows because it is likely he might have tried only on Mavericks:

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5648156?answerId=24404984022#24404984022

BTW, in that thread another forumite refers to a link regarding the specifications of i5-4250U and i3-4010U according to which those processors are capable of 4k @60 Hz but with 24-bit color depth. As a matter of fact says he believes the "i5 in the 13" Retina MacBook Pro can support 4k@60Hz at 24 bpp but not 32 bpp".

This might be true but those processors include HD 5000 and 4400 GPUs respectively, whereas the i5s in the Haswell 13'' rMBPs include a better GPU, namely HD 5100, a.k.a Iris. I would assume, if they those lower GPUs can output 4k@60Hz, then Iris should be able to do so, but it may not do it nonetheless. Regarding the color depth I have no idea.

So the issues pertaining to Iris's capability of max. resolution that can be output are twofold:

1) What is the max. refresh rate? 30Hz vs 60Hz?

2) What is the color depth? 24 vs 32-bit?

Could someone who owns a 13'' Haswell rMBP running Windows and have access to a 4k with 60 Hz monitor please answer these questions?

(As a side note, according to the following link Iris Pro is capable of 4k @ 60Hz with 32-bit. We know 60 Hz is possible with Nvidia 750M based on the confirmations of the people in this thread, but I am not sure about the color depth. http://9to5mac.com/2013/12/23/new-retina-macbook-pros-can-drive-4k-displays-at-6 0hz-when-running-windows-mac-os-needs-new-drivers/)

I'm just going to leave two random links here:

http://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/06/apple-seeds-first-os-x-10-9-3-build-to-devel opers/

https://www.dropbox.com/s/x5aol4fe6vjzcqq/2014-03-06%2017.56.32.jpg

kogir wrote:

I'm just going to leave two random links here:

http://www.macrumors.com/2014/03/06/apple-seeds-first-os-x-10-9-3-build-to-devel opers/

https://www.dropbox.com/s/x5aol4fe6vjzcqq/2014-03-06%2017.56.32.jpg

Very nice.

Was this performed using a MacBook Pro 15" (late 2013) -- which is the original them of this thread (since hijacked by everyone) -- or was this on some other machine?

Any special magic needed to achieve this, or did it "just work"?

Dear Aron77,

Please kindly state which particular 4k monitors you have tried on and try not only 750M, but also the Iris Pro (by disabling the 750M) and let us know if any/either/both of the GPUs is/are capable of 4k@60Hz.

mg428 wrote:

Dear Aron77,

Please kindly state which particular 4k monitors you have tried on and try not only 750M, but also the Iris Pro (by disabling the 750M) and let us know if any/either/both of the GPUs is/are capable of 4k@60Hz.

Aron,

What has happened to your post? Has the Apple Support Communities deleted it? I don't see it anymore.

Anyhow, just to let you know that Khaos Tian, the person who first discovered the new scaled resolutions and 60Hz refresh rate broader compatability upon the 10.9.3's release, has just declared his own setup on Twitter-- he has the exact same rMBP and monitor you have but he cannot get 60Hz. This is quite intersting...

aron77 wrote:

Yes, the support guys deleted it. Anyhow, the beta won't stay beta forever...

This is ridicilous, as if you are disclosing an classified information.

Anyway, I really cannot understand why Khaos Tian could not get the 60 Hz refresh rate while you could with the exact same rMBP and Dell monitor. May be this is the reason why they removed your post. As a side note, Khaos states that the option for selecting refresh rate was not available at all.

Well, the ability of a GPU to drive two separate displays plus the internal display whose joint pixel count exceeds that of UHD does not necessarily seem to imply that a single MST-enabled UHD display can be addressed by that GPU: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=18862965#post18862965.

There are now reports of users getting flicker free smooth cursor movement at 60Hz on a Dell UP2414Q 4k with today's release. And this is with an older mac pro with a GTX760 card. Hopefully other users can chime in but things are looking very promising. I think the Dell UP2414Q is the sweet spot for 4k right now - true 2x 'retina' display at the right dot pitch ... anything larger will have text too large or will require a fractional scaling mode.

The 2012 rMBP I had was able to drive the monitor at 3820x2160@30Hz no problem. The lack of 60Hz support is what caused me to sell it. While hard to find all the details, the Intel Thunderbolt controller in it cannot and will never support DisplayPort 1.2.

> if 10.9.3 becomes final as is, then the only reason why Apple does not include such capability in Mavericks would be, IMO, to intentionally force customers to buy the high-end and most expensive Haswell rMBP.

We all thought Apple would not support 4k@60Hz on the 2013 rMBP at all, because they wanted to save that as the selling point for the 2014 retina Macbook Pro*, yet they've already managed to enable it for the highest end Mac buyers. As discussed, it'd be pretty bad politics to first enable it on the lowest end Macs.

At this point, I'm willing to give Apple the benefit of the doubt: Creating MST drivers is very hard - it took the GPU companies an average of 2 years to pull it off on their own (i.e. Windows 8) platforms, with Intel taking the longest. First Apple got AMD/ATI drivers working. Now they've got NVIDIA drivers working about 6 months later. Hopefully at some point they'll get Intel HD drivers working. And maybe that's why they haven't released a 4K Apple Monitor yet.

* Or maybe they no longer need to delay this feature because everyone will upgrade just to get USB 3.1 ports. 🙂