Netflix quality HORRID after update

I continue to get HD on my Chromecast.

Hey everyone,

I've also been having problems with Netflix and HBO Go. Has anyone been having problems with HBO Go as well?

DustyStorm wrote:

Guys, I'm rely starting to think it's a Netflix issue and not just Apple TV.

I don't see this normally. Certainly there are time when Netflix fails to get HD quality on all my devices but it's unusual.

My recent, more detailed, observations might suggest a CDN issue but I think there are enough reported cases to say any success, not the failure, is the glitch.

However if more people could report network specifics it might point to a consistent problem.

DustyStorm wrote:

...only my iphone 5 gets 5800kbps.

That's close to a miracle, considering the fact that the maximum HD size on iPhones is 720p at 3000 kbps.

Can everybody please get their facts straight before posting to this forum. How else are we expecting Netflix or Apple to take our observations seriously.

DustyStorm wrote:

Guys, I'm rely starting to think it's a Netflix issue and not just Apple TV. Yes the netflix app on Apple TV is broken but there is something else going on. Been testing the example short on all devices the past four days. Chromecast and Roku won't go over 1050kbps anymore, Apple TV stays at 576kbps. Roku 3 and Chromecast were getting Super HD last week and now neither of them are anymore. iPad gets 3000kbps and only my iphone 5 gets 5800kbps. Netflix needs some work for sure.

As we've discussed on this thread previously there is obviously other noise out there. People who have issues with other devices, certain times of day, etc. Yours, for example, is one of the few times anyone has complained about Chromecast/Roku. By all other accounts, they are rock solid. So this could be a fringe case of something wrong with your connection or Neflix talking to those devices.

The one issue that is consistent across 98% of posters here this issue of AppleTV dropping to sub-SD quality while all other devices on the network are at HD. It is pinpointable (is that a word?) to the November update, across multiple ISPs, and most importantly easily replicatable. I don't have to wonder if I it will "work this time" if I were to go try it now...it won't. And it will do the exact same thing:

- Stream HD for 2 seconds

- Buffer

- Stay below 576kbps

I'm not saying to not raise your concerns about your Chromecast and Roku, but the core of this discussion is focused on the above issue.

bodosom wrote:

When using the ATV3 client my streams are reliably sourced from a single address in nflxvideo.net

When using the iPad client my streams are reliably sourced from a single address in llnw.net (Limelight).

When I use AirPlay the stream is reliably sourced from a single address in llnw.net but it's not the same address the native iPad client is using. Toggling from iPad to ATV toggles the stream source address between the two.

Now this morning I'm getting 5800 on my ATV from nflxvideo and only 4300 (which is the best I've ever gotten via AirPlay) from llnw but I'm willing to chalk that up to lack of congestion.

That is consistent with what I posted 12 Dec. Airplay coming from Limelight Networks and Apple TV Native Netflix Application from Netflix Streaming Services ( just after you were telling me 'Except there is no AirPlay stream 🙂)

I am pretty sure that Airplay from an iPad is limited to 4300 kbps (and for me on an iPhone 4S to 3000 kbps) - all indications that that Apple TV is handling Airplay Netflix streaming different to streaming from its native Netflix app,

bodosom wrote:

Netflix says you need 7Mbps to get superHD (5.8Mbps/5800Kbps). But I think you need more in the face of congestion.

When the Apple TV is getting 5800 kbps Super HD its 10 minute average is almost exactly 7 Mbps. This is very consistent across a broad range of titles (1.85:1 movies, 2.4:1 movies, TV shows etc). This allows for 5800 kbps video, audio speculated to be a low 192 kbps and keeping a buffer full).

I agree though - it is likely you will need a bit more to get the 7 Mbps average (actually a time machine to go back to October to get it on an Apple TV).

Last night same as normal (since ~ 11 November).

Apple TV native netflix application 560 - 750 kbps (sometimes starting higher but after the stutter ~5 seconds after start of playback dropping back to low level).

Airplay Netflix through Apple TV 4300 kbps

Chromecast Netflix 5800 kbps

As before all on Comcast 16 Mbps connection

Vandergraff wrote:

Airplay coming from Limelight Networks and Apple TV Native Netflix Application from Netflix Streaming Services ( just after you were telling me 'Except there is no AirPlay stream 🙂)

I still believe that there's no AirPlay stream based on the extremely variable performance I see. I posit that there are 5800, 4300, 3000 etc. streams for the ATV and 5800, 4300, 3000 etc streams for the iPad3 and that Netflix hasn't rolled out a special set of streams for AirPlay (or DIAL). My point was different content networks will show varying performance metrics to the client. The client will then request the optimal stream. Optimal as defined by Netflix.

I will admit that I'm speculating as much as the next poster that doesn't work for Netflix but, apparently unlike others here, while I have no trouble getting superHD on my TiVo/PS3 AirPlay is not significantly better than ATV direct and in my case those differences are just as likely to be explained by Limelight versus Netflix sourcing given the peering relationship between TWC and Limelight.

bodosom wrote:

I still believe that there's no AirPlay stream based on the extremely variable performance I see. I posit that there are 5800, 4300, 3000 etc. streams for the ATV and 5800, 4300, 3000 etc streams for the iPad3 and that Netflix hasn't rolled out a special set of streams for AirPlay (or DIAL). My point was different content networks will show varying performance metrics to the client. The client will then request the optimal stream. Optimal as defined by Netflix.

I will admit that I'm speculating as much as the next poster that doesn't work for Netflix but, apparently unlike others here, while I have no trouble getting superHD on my TiVo/PS3 AirPlay is not significantly better than ATV direct and in my case those differences are just as likely to be explained by Limelight versus Netflix sourcing given the peering relationship between TWC and Limelight.

I am sorry I wasn't trying to imply that there were special encodes for Airplay - that clearly wouldn't make sense as the Apple TV is decoding the stream whether initiated by Airplay of the Apple TV Netflix app.

What does seem to be happening is that the Apple TV is managing the streams differently depending on whether it is initiated by Airplay or the Apple TV. Here the evidence is that the streams seem to be coming from different locations (Limelight / Netflix), are capped at different speeds (4300 for Airplay from iPad / 5800 for Apple TV native app) and that many (although unfortunately not you) get reliable 4300 connections using Airplay while having problems with the native Apple TV Netflix app.

I agree it is all speculation - but these differences presumably give Netflix / Apple an indication what is broken and what needs to be fixed. Airplay shows (for many) that the Apple TV platform is still able to get and play Netflix Super HD (albeit limited to 4300 and requiring Airplay to initiate the stream).

EVERYBODY GO TO APPLE.COM/FEEDBACK & SAY WHATS GOING ON WITH NETFLIX ON YOUR ATV.THATS THE ONLYWAY THIS GOING TO BE RESOLVED.APPLE IS AWARE OF THE PROBLEM BUT NEEDS TO BE NUGGED ABIT MORE. TALKING TO NETFLIX IS A WASTE OF TIME, THEY WILL TELL YOU ANYTHING TO GET OFF THEIR BACKS.

Well, I had to experiment (and Best Buy has easy returns). I got a new ATV and it currently has software version 5.3 and the latest update is version is 6.02.

On my old ATV the sample short starts as always at 4300 kbps or better but rebuffers at about 4-6 seconds in and drops to 235 kbs or maybe up to 560 kbps and stays there.

On the new ATV it starts at a low 1050 kbps and then over the course of a minute works up to 4300 kbps. However, it DOES NOT stay at HD levels and will drop to as low as 560 kbps within 2-3 minutes and then ramps back up to 1050 kbps before falling back down again or jumping up to 3000 kbps. it finally returned to a full 1080p level thought only 3850 kbps towards the end of the short.

I will test a few more times to see if there are patterns but the new ATV running an older software version cannot hold onto a high bit rate but exhibits different issues. Most noticeably, it does not rebuffer after a few seconds like those with the Nov update seem to and it will stay at 720p levels or better but is not as consistent as my Chromecast.