If i purchased a stolen iphone and take it to my carrier and they have it listed as stolen, can i take it to another company and use it there, or am i just out of my money?

Roger,

Don't know about UK law, but here you are entitled to keep anything you find unless your possession is challenged by another party. Even then if the other party cannot provide evidence for a legal claim, then you get to keep it. This is, technically, even true of money. This extends generally to any Personal Property.

Even if you turn that phone in to the police, if it's not claimed in a stipulated period of time then it's yours.

Ethically, I agree. But if you are obliged legally, then that must be an area of difference between US and UK law. We differentiate between what may be a moral/ethical obligation and a legal one. Anyway, I was mostly interested in what, if any, difference may exist here between US and UK law of which I know little except historically. I claim no knowledge since the fencing laws were written. 🙂

The OP's situation is more a question of whether he is buying something that was stolen as opposed to found, and what if any risks he may incur.

If you have in fact inadvertently bought a stolen item you are not entitled to keep it; you must return it to the police who should attempt to return it to its owner (or their insurance company). No blame attaches to you for have obtained it innocently, but it's unfortunately your loss in this situation. Of course the 'someone' has in this instance committed a criminal offence and if you know who they are you are obliged to report them. Let's hope it turns out to be not stolen after all.

If you find something of value - say some jewellery that someone has dropped - you are not entitled simply to pick it up and keep it; you are obliged to make a reasonable effort to return it to its owner. Taking it to the police would constitute a reasonable effort. If it's not claimed within a given period, whatever that it, then you are allowed to keep it.

But the OP is asking about a phone that he purchased in good faith. Were that to turn out to be listed as stolen he would not be allowed to keep it. If it's listed as stolen then the original owner is known, and it must be returned to them. Any money he has paid to the thief is lost and his only redress would to be to attempt to get it back from him. Keeping the item once he knows it's stolen is a criminal offence, as would be failure to disclose the name of the person who sold it to him (assuming he knows it, of course) - to fail to do so would make him an accessory after the fact. It's a whole different can of worms from finding something.

Roger,

I am aware of the OP's question which is not related to your post to which I was commenting.

Other than some moral or ethical rationale, the law here does not care what the value of the object is. You are not legally compelled to report the finding. This is essentially one of the problems individuals have trying to make claims to things of value that they have lost but whose ownership they cannot prove.

Years ago I bought a computer for my daughter to use in college. Sometime thereafter her keyboard requied a replacement. She took it in for service only to be told that the computer's serial number was reported as belonging to a computer stolen from Dell. Being a good citizen I contacted Dell who essentially refused to discuss it with me. They would neither admit nor deny the computer was stolen, but the serial number was on A list (wouldn't say what that list was.) I found this all strange, but until I cleared up the matter I could not order my daughter a replacement keyboard from them.

Still trying to be a good citizen I asked my daughter to contact the police to see if the computer was on the National Hot List. It wasn't. I asked the police for advise as to I should do. They said keep it. If there was a real owner somewhere who made a provable claim I would have to return it or the money equivalent. So that's what my daughter did. She used it a couple more years then sold it to one of her friends. Never heard anything more about it from any person or from Dell.

Now, of course the computer wouldn't be worth a diamond lying on the street (if it was pretty big, that is.) Still, the story played out as I suspected it would. Even the police later said she could have saved time by not even bothering to report it.

I said 'of value' - strictly legally I suppose all this would apply just the same to a cheap trinket, but obviously in practice no-one is going to pursue the matter in that case. But in the UK the finder is obliged to make some effort, such as reporting it to the police.

In the OP's particular case, he's on a fine line between not knowing where it came from (but wondering if it's stolen), and suspecting it's stolen. If he's got any serious doubt about the matter he would be well advised to steer clear of it.

This is essentially one of the problems individuals have trying to make claims to things of value that they have lost but whose ownership they cannot prove.

Ah, but if ownership can be proven and something has been reported as stolen, then it definitely can become an issue for whoever winds up with it. It shouldn't come down to that, though - as you said, if no one claims it from the authorities then it becomes yours, without any Imperial Entanglements.

Those concerns were already addressed in my previous remarks. My actual question to Roger did not have to do with stolen property. I was mostly interested in what, if any, differences might exist between US and UK law pertaining to personal property that was found by someone not the original owner.

Although somewhat naive as a proverb, it's nevertheless correct - "Possession is nine-tenths of the law." There is substantial correctness in the remark, but mostly as it applies to personal property. Not so with real property. Definitely not true for any property the government decides is theirs. 😁

Aside from the much enlightening conversations about the legal fine-points, I would just buy from a place that takes it from their stockrooms and have much less chance of it being tagged.

My humble opinion.

Kappy wrote:

The OP's situation is more a question of whether he is buying something that was stolen as opposed to found, and what if any risks he may incur.

It's always risky to buy these things second-hand unless you know the vendor personally - look at the number of posts recently from people who've bought an iPhone only to find it locked and no way of contacting the previous owner.

If he has no actual reason to think it's stolen (the implication is that he doesn't but is simply asking 'what if?') then he has no need to report it as such; but if in the process of activating it with a carrier it were to turn out to be listed as stolen then he would be obliged to hand it over and would lose both the phone and his money. This may well be a low risk: the vendor may be perfectly legitimate (but make sure he unlocks it and removes it from 'Find My iPhone' in any other devices he owns!).

I couldn't agree more, Roger. If you plan to buy second-hand or used, then you need to do some due diligence. My daughter and I learned that the hard way despite that I had actually done due diligence. But that's the price for saving money. Some people are too focused on saving a buck or a pound and don't pay attention to the important stuff.

Con men always will tell you that you can't con an honest person.

Before buying it request the seller give you the ESN or IMEI number before handing over your money. You can then check the lists to see if the phone is reported.

If the seller won't provide the number don;t buy from them.

Once you get the phone make sure the serial number on the phone and the serial umber on the box match.

regards

You're out of luck.

And if it's signed into iCloud make sure you can sign out before accepting the phone.