Setting up and configuring a roaming network.

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Level 1

8 points

Setting up and configuring a roaming network.

How does one set up an Airport Extreme (latest version, tower design) as a base station to extend a Wi-Fi system connected to a service provider’s router? If one follows the Apple directions, where a Time Capsule is used for the example (but appears to be for the 1^st generation, flat type), one sets the “Connection Sharing” under the Internet Connection tab, for the base station, to “Share a public IP address”. Then for the other devices, connected via Ethernet, use “Off (Bridge Mode)”.

However, using the latest version of Airport Utility, there is no such option for “Connection Sharing”. I also understand that the base station needs to be set for DHCP and NAT. However, if I select this option under the Network tab, it allows/prompts me to enter the “DHCP Reservation” and “Port Settings”, but have no idea as what to add here.

Can someone advise as to how best set up the Extreme as a base station.

As background information, I recently had one Extreme set up as the base station, with the Network Mode in “Create a wireless network”, but with the Router Mode set to “Off (Bridge Mode)”. Then another Airport Extreme and 2 Airport Express with the Network Mode in “Extend a Wireless Network”, also set in “Off (Bridge Mode)”; all connected via Ethernet to the base station. Although it worked ok for a few months, the quality of the Wi-Fi was only marginally extended. However, recently the system shut down and will only stabilize if I add the one Airport Extreme to extend the system from the Extreme used as a base station, once I add one of the additional Airport Express, the system crashes. On investigating, it would appear that I need to have the base station set as above, but it would appear that the Apple instructions for this are outdated.

Mac Pro, OS X Mavericks (10.9)

Posted on Sep 5, 2014 9:00 AM

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Answer 1

Best reply

LaPastenague

Level 9

67,202 points

Sep 5, 2014 3:16 PM in response to Von123

Yes, the instructions are well out of date.

How does one set up an Airport Extreme (latest version, tower design) as a base station to extend a Wi-Fi system connected to a service provider’s router?

There is no need to setup the AE as router.

The wireless roaming setup works under either routing or bridge mode.. that is entirely irrelevant actually. The problem is the airport utility is rather too automated.. it takes over and will probably try and force your AE to take over as router.. this is plainly not possible if the ISP router is full wireless modem router, in many cases.

So it really is up to you which way you go. The key part to roaming is simple in the extreme (sic).

Setup wireless with the same name, SSID to everyone except Apple who must use Wireless Name.

So lets say SSID in the modem is WLan, and you want to include it in the roam.. then in AE and all other devices, set wireless name = WLan.

Set security to WPA2 Personal =WPA2 TKIP - AES.

Use the same password on everything.

And of course all are creating a wireless network.

All are linked by ethernet.. but the mode, bridged or routing is irrelevant to the actual roam. (might mess up your routing of course)

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Answer 2

Sep 5, 2014 3:21 PM in response to Von123

It's worth getting your head round Bridge Mode and router mode as you can grind your network to a halt if they are misused.

Your ISP issues you with a single IP number which is your identity to the internet. The router part of your modem issues your various devices with new IP numbers - Network Address Translation - which are in a range of numbers for local use only. These numbers cannot be seen by the outside world.

If you now connect another router - such as an Airport Extreme or Express - and it starts issuing its own IP numbers, there is a danger that it will decide to issue a number which the first router has already put into use - 'double NAT'. This results in two devices with the same IP number, and chaos. In some cases you can get away with this as the AE probably issues numbers beginning with 10, and the other router may issue numbers beginning with 192.

However it's better to put the AE into 'bridge mode', so that it simply passes through the IP numbers allocated by the first router. This works perfectly well - I've done it myself for years and never any problems at all.

The exact method varies with your version of the Airport Utility. On older versions, open Applications/Utilities/Airport Utility. Select your Airport in the list and click 'Manual setup'. Click 'Internet' in the toolbar. Click the 'Internet Connection' tab if necessary. Set the 'Connection Sharing' menu to 'Off (Bridge Mode)'. Click 'Update' and wait for your AE to restart.

On the current version, open Applications/Utilities/Airport Utility. Click the image of your Airport and in the pop-up pane click ‘Edit’. In the pane which drops down, click the ‘Network’ tab. Set ‘Router Mode’ to ‘Off (Bridge Mode)’ and click ‘Update’; wait for your AE to restart.

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Answer 3

Von123 Author

Level 1

8 points

Sep 6, 2014 9:19 AM in response to Von123

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the replies. Both however don't refer to how Apple suggest a roaming network is supposed to be set-up. As previously set-up, and again now, I have 2 Airport Extremes providing the Wi-Fi, one connected via Ethernet to the ISP router and the second connected via Ethernet to the latter, both in "Off (Bridge Mode), and all three devices have different IP numbers. However, unlike previously, when I now connect additional devices via Ethernet (from the AE connected to the ISP router) to extend the network further, I loose all Wi-Fi. All devices appear to be ok (glow green), but when I check via my Airport Utility (ver 6.3.2.), all the devices are down. Thats when I then found the Apple instruction on using the initial AE as a Primary Wi-Fi base station with "Share a public IP address" (an option which I can't find), and subsequent base stations using the "Off (Bridge Mode).

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Answer 4

Sep 6, 2014 9:45 AM in response to Von123

AirPort Utility 6.3.2 will automatically configure the AirPort routers in a roaming configuration.....(Apple calls this extend using Ethernet), so you might want to redo the setup of the "extending" AirPort.....assuming that the "main" AirPort is functioning normally and correctly at this time.

Thats when I then found the Apple instruction on using the initial AE as a Primary Wi-Fi base station with "Share a public IP address" (an option which I can't find), and subsequent base stations using the "Off (Bridge Mode).

Unfortunately, those 3+ year old instructions do NOT tell you that Apple simply assumes that you will be using a simple modem connected to the "main" AirPort.

You have your "main" AirPort connected to another ISP router......not a simple modem....so the correct setting for that "main" AirPort on your network would be Bridge Mode. AirPort Utility 6.3.2 will setup the AirPort in Bridge Mode automatically when you connect the AirPort to another router.

The best advice that I can give is that you should toss those out of date and confusing instructions. Apple has yet to provide a good guide for the newer version of AirPort Utility, but we can help if you have questions.

"Share a public IP address" is now DHCP and NAT in the newer 6.x versions of AirPort Utility. But, you should not need to worry about any of this, since AirPort Utility 6.x will make the right choices for you 99% of the time during the setup of the device.

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Answer 5

Von123 Author

Level 1

8 points

Sep 6, 2014 11:12 AM in response to Bob Timmons

Thanks Bob, that clears things up.

Any idea or suggestion as to why suddenly adding more base stations (via Ethernet) to the system causes it to shut down, worked fine previously. Have recently added a Bose sound system that uses Wi-Fi along with Philips Hue.

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Answer 6

Sep 6, 2014 11:22 AM in response to Von123

In theory, you could add as many AirPorts as you want using Ethernet. Not sure what your problem might be.

All that I can suggest is that you simplify things by powering things off and starting with just the "main" router. Check that for proper operation and then add the "next" AirPort or router and check that out. Then add another and check, etc.

If for some reason, an AirPort has been previously configured to "extend using wireless", and you then connect an Ethernet cable to the device, that is a sure recipe for a crash.

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Answer 7

Von123 Author

Level 1

8 points

Sep 7, 2014 4:38 AM in response to Bob Timmons

Hi Bob,

Started from scratch setting on Airport Extreme as the base station and creating a Wi-Fi network.

Connected the second AE via Ethernet, and performed hard reset on same. First attempt had an error, second attempt went fine and stated that the AE was extending the existing Wi-Fi network via Ethernet. All looked good; however, when I then checked the settings on the extending AE it stated that it was “creating a wireless network”. When I first tried to change the setting back to extend, it came with a exclamation mark and status showed Wireless (router and both AE had different IP addresses). Tried another hard reset of the extending AE, and had exactly the same result when I changed its settings. Then I again changed to the Wi-Fi setting to “extend a wireless network”, and this time it worked (it also showed a new IP address after the change).

All looked ok at this point, until I plugged in an Airport Express via Ethernet to extend the Wi-Fi - all devices crashed.

Went through the whole process yet again but was unable to rest the extending AE to “extend a wireless network”, kept crashing. In the end had to leave the extending AE in what appears to be a “”create a wireless network” mode (although during set-up by AirPort Utility it was “extending an existing network via Ethernet”). I then added the other two Airport Express devices, again Airport Utility showed both being set up to extend the wireless network from the base station via Ethernet; but as for the extending Airport Extreme, if I check the settings, it states “create a wireless network”. When I look at the set-up diagram in Airport Utility, it gives mixed indications as to how the devices are connected.

At least the system is now stable. Again thanks for clarifying the issue about DHCP and NAT.

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Answer 8

Sep 7, 2014 6:00 AM in response to Von123

"Extend using Ethernet" is the same as "create a wireless network". Any AirPort that is connected using Ethernet should be setup to "create" if you check the settings in AirPort Utility / Edit / Wireless tab / Network Mode.

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Answer 9

jmarsh53

Level 1

0 points

Nov 17, 2014 4:59 PM in response to Von123

This was a very informative post. I'll be In a very similar situation in a couple days. In my case, my second AE won't be connected via ethernet to the main AE that will be connected to the ISP's modem/wireless router via Ethernet. In this case would the second AE be set automatically set by the utility to extend/create the network or do I need to manually alter anything. So much out there refers to non Apple setups and all I found were the same outdated instructions from Apple. Thanks for anyone's input.

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Answer 10

Nov 17, 2014 5:34 PM in response to jmarsh53

Please post back with the make and model number of the modem/router that you will be using.

In order for this to work correctly, your modem/router must be using a setting for wireless security of WPA2 Personal. Please check to confirm that this is the setting that is currently being used.

You did not indicate what operating system that you would be using on the computer that will be used to set up the AirPort. It would really help if you could provide that information.

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Answer 11

jmarsh53

Level 1

0 points

Nov 17, 2014 6:04 PM in response to Bob Timmons

Thanks Bob. Sorry, yes that info would help. The device they will be supplying is the Arris TG1672G.

http://www.arrisi.com/product_catalog/_docs/_specsheet/TG1672G_PF_30SEP13.pdf

My setup is currently two newer AE base stations (tower version) and a bit older express. All are up to date with firmware. One AE is the main and is connected to the current ISP provided non-router modem (to be replaced by the Arris on Wednesday)via Ethernet. The other AE and express are connected wirelessly to the main AE to extend the network throughout the house and backyard. If it matters I have a printer, DiskStation NAS, Apple TV, Sonos and video game consoles all connected to my wireless network. The computer that will be used to configure things is a mid 2010 MacBook Pro with the most recent version of OSX Yosemite. I believe when the cable tech comes Wednesday all he will do is set up the new Arris. Re-configuring my wireless network will be my problem. They won't help connect the AEs.

Thanks again,

Jason

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Answer 12

Nov 17, 2014 6:21 PM in response to jmarsh53

All that you need to do is connect an Ethernet cable from one of the LAN <--> ports on the Arris gateway to the WAN "O" port on the main AirPort.

Power up the main AirPort, and it will likely be blinking amber. Open AirPort Utility, click Edit, then click the Network tab and make sure that the setting for Router Mode is set to "Off (Bridge Mode)".

Everything else should operate normally.

You will have another wireless network provided by the Arris. If you really need another wireless network, you can leave it on. If you don't really need another wireless network, contact the ISP for instructions on how to turn off the wireless function of the Arris.

Now, if your goal is to have the AirPorts extend the same network that the Arris will be providing, everything gets a lot more complicated. There would be no reason to setup the AirPort Extreme to extend the Arris network unless you plan to locate the main AirPort Extreme a few rooms away from the Arris gateway.

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Answer 13

jmarsh53

Level 1

0 points

Nov 17, 2014 6:29 PM in response to Bob Timmons

Thanks again for your time and help. I'll give it a go.

I'll assume 1) I don't rename or recreate my wireless network, just make the change to Off/Bridge.

2) When adding the second AE and the express wirelessly that they remain unchanged and configured as they are - "Extend a wireless network".

I believe there is access that allows me to turn the Arris radio off from what I've read.

Many thanks,

Jason

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Answer 14

Nov 17, 2014 6:49 PM in response to jmarsh53

1) I don't rename or recreate my wireless network, just make the change to Off/Bridge.

Correct. You might want to check the setting for Router Mode under the Network tab at this time to see where the setting is at. If you have been using a simple modem.....not a modem/router.....then the setting is now at DHCP and NAT.

If you have been using a modem/router "upstream" from the first AirPort, then it should already be configured in "Off (Bridge Mode)". If that is the case, you really won't have to do anything other than make the connections.

2) When adding the second AE and the express wirelessly that they remain unchanged and configured as they are - "Extend a wireless network".

Correct. Power off the second AirPort and the Express before you hook up the main AirPort. Get the main AirPort up and running with a green light. Then power up the 2nd AirPort Extreme and finally the Express.

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Answer 15

jmarsh53

Level 1

0 points

Nov 21, 2014 4:47 PM in response to Bob Timmons

HI Bob,

Just wanted to take a second and thank you for your help. Everything is working perfectly.

Jason

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