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Conversations not grouped by subject in El Capitan mail

I get emails from Fail2Ban on one of the web servers I manage. Each one has a subject of the form "[Fail2Ban] WordPress: banned 45.41.92.66". They're all the same except for the IP address ("45.41.92.66"). Before El Capitan, all the messages with identical subjects, in this case the same IP address, were grouped into a conversation, with a handy dandy counter plainly visible. That made it easy to see which IP addresses were attempting logins so often that I needed to ban them permanently, not just for 10 minutes at a time, as my Fail2Ban is configured to do.


El Capitan mail organizes messages by actual conversations, i.e. messages that are responses to an original, but it doesn't group emails with identical subjects that are not actually part of the same conversation. This is likely correct for many email conversations, but it doesn't work for these Fail2Ban messages. I would love to have a preference to select the old way of grouping by only the text in the subject.

Mail-OTHER, OS X El Capitan (10.11)

Posted on Oct 1, 2015 3:38 AM

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Jan 22, 2017 5:47 PM in response to Bill St. Clair

Has anyone filed a bug with bugreport.apple.com?


Radar has more visibility within Apple than that feedback page I think.


A bug number would be a good thing to post here to reference.


Intuit is requiring 10.11 starting with TurboTax 2017 so we're going to be stuck with the lousy Mail.app if other developers "force" people to upgrade.

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Mar 16, 2017 4:56 PM in response to hyybid

Just filled the bug for that.

Yesterday upgraded from Yosemite to Sierra and got this crap...

I am developer and get a log of monitoring emails every day - i ignored Outlook before, but looks like i had to switch to this monster just because Apple broke the Mail...

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Oct 2, 2015 5:47 AM in response to Bill St. Clair

I have a very similar case. I use Mail with a business account. I get daily fuel invoices, as well as several daily load availability offers, all with the same subject. Having them grouped makes it a lot less likely I will accidentally delete one, enables me to quickly delete them all at once, and saves the extra step of using the search box to find them.


I'm disappointed that Apple did not carry this feature forward. When I get around to it, I may set up some virtual mailboxes to filter on the subject of the ones I use more frequently. The downside being an even more cluttered folder shortcut frame.

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Oct 2, 2015 8:25 AM in response to RedForeman

I'm having the same problem. I get notification emails from Authorize.net that were grouped by subject line in previous versions of OS X. That worked well for these kinds of regular emails. Seriously considering going back to Yosemite if I can.

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Oct 2, 2015 12:33 PM in response to Bill St. Clair

I thought I was going crazy, glad to know I'm not the only one with this issue. I have my security camera software send me an email with a screenshot every time a set camera sees motion and now that El Capitan doesn't group by subject my email is just littered with emails from my security cam software. 😟 I hope we can get a fix for this soon because this is just getting out of hand!

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Oct 3, 2015 2:51 AM in response to recngamb

I've never found a good way to report bugs to Apple, other than these forums. There's a Bug Reporter for developers, but I see no way there to search for anybody's bugs but your own. There's http://www.apple.com/feedback/macosx.html, but again, all feedback is individual, with no way to see what other people have reported. I guess if all of us with that problem gave feedback there, it might get more of a response from Apple than this discussion topic.


Anybody know other ways to report bugs to Apple?

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Oct 3, 2015 5:23 AM in response to RedForeman

So my login to these forums is tied to an old me.com email account that I don't use for anything. The notification e-mails that come in when people post to this thread? Sorted into a conversation.


So either the Apple forum e-mails are marked in a way to make Mail.app see a conversation, or the me.com mail host can trigger that somehow, or both.


Anyone else seeing this?


Kinda crappy if they introduced a feature to make that only work using Apple software end-to-end and disable it on everything else.

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Conversations not grouped by subject in El Capitan mail

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