Time Capsule Powered Off, Won't Power Back On

CPTApple wrote:

.5 TB Time Capsule just died, SN 6F914S1R2UJ. I am seriously disappointed. With research this appears to be a manufacturers defect. When I put my TC in place it has not moved, temperature and humidity completely controlled. I just can't believe it. Apple needs to man up here.

Just get over it, and get your self either a new Apple Time Capsule or a refurbished one. It is an electronic item you have (not to mention the first generation time capsule) - electroninc items - all electronic items have a limited lifespan. The number one cause of failure is dust. So, now that it has kicked the bucket... go replace it. It is that simple. Don't blame anyone - these things happen. The technology of recent years is more delicate, especially with components using especially small transistors. There will always be that factor of dust, heat, and normal wear and tear. So... the best advice anyone could give you... is go and get your self either a brand new one, or a newer one, or a refurbished one, or choose a totally different manufactuer. Those are your choices, and each come with the same expectations - all electronic items no matter what it is - have a limited lifespan (unless it is in a vaccume and air can not reach the item or as long as air is used to cool the electronic item).

Message was edited by: Carlo TD

There is no need to be rude CARLO TD, the guys understanably upset that his Time Capsule is dead. If you want to resond to such a thread make it a worth while one, and more importantly helpfull. Any idiot knows that electronics have a limited life span, and its fairly evident that the time capsuls poor quaity components limit this! I think its important people communicate when such failures occure so those that want to repair and fix the problem can. If your solution to these kind of problems is to "get over it" and buy another one then be my guest. That kind of solution is not welcome here. I bet Apple love you, along with any orther retailer who can whip your pants down and make money out of you!

A more helpfull answer to the problem can be found here: https://sites.google.com/site/lapastenague/a-deconstruction-of-routers-and-modem s/apple-time-capsule-repair

Hello Carlo TD,

A good design that runs cool will keep operating for a very long time. The major failure of electronics is heat. The second major failure is excessive voltage and that could be from something as simple as static electricity not even touching the circuitry but creating an excessive field. In completed and built circuits that though is very unusual. A voltage spike will usually punch through very thin silicon substrates, if they have not been adequately protected and this again comes down to good design.

If components are run up against their maximum operating temperatures than they will have a known and predictable lifespan. For example the PSU in the TC is designed to be air cooled. Internal component temperatures exceed the design constraints for maximum operating life, so what happens? The lifetime is shortened and premature failure results.

"All electronic items have a limited lifespan" is an acceptance of a marketing man's dream. We have all come to accept 'built in obsolesence' and seem to expect that electronics will somehow 'wear out'. Electronics, if correctly designed, will work for any calculated period of time including beyond a human lifetime.

You are wrong about the number one failure being dust. Please think this through. Dust in the environment will naturally settle wherever gravity will pull it. If there is a flow of air, the dust will travel with that and settle onto whatever is in its path. If air is used as the fluid medium to draw away excessive heat and the surface of the heated items are coated with environmental dust, it is not the dust that causes the failure of the hot item, it is heat. The heat cannot escape. Dust is wonderful at clogging filters and blocking the flow of cooling air.

The components used inside the TC are very good and with the correct cooling will not fail as they have been doing. Take them beyond their design spec and not surprisingly they will fall over.

The failure of the TC - IS A DESIGN PROBLEM. It should not be accepted as it has been. Confusion in the Apple community is all that is needed for the problem to persist and your unhelpful 'get over it' comment makes me think you have sorted out the problem in your own mind. You are accepting a bad design. You are advocating acceptance to an understandably irritated Apple TC owner, who quite rightly wants more from a long term back up device that a couple of years +.

The design problem is a simple gaff made by the physical placement of the fan, inside the TC case...

and there are 3x things that are FUNDAMENTALLY WRONG and have REMAINED UNCORRECTED.

1. The fan is not turned on. Other than fleetingly at power on.

2. It points the wrong way by 90°. It blows onto the side of one bit of the hard drive - not through the PSU.

3. There is no air inlet hole to allow cool outside air to be drawn into the fan and blown through the hot PSU.

It is nothing to do with dust.

It is nothing to do with poor components.

It is nothing to do with operation of the TC (other than peripherally).

It IS to do with the HEAT NOT BEING REMOVED.

Ray Haverfield (LaPastenague) advocates the simple method of removing the PSU from inside the case. At a stroke this alters the physical design and makes it more robust.

On the other hand, I advocate correcting the DESIGN FLAW within the case and making it run cool by using the fan as intended. Cool running electronics last longer than hot running electronics. Cold running electronics last longer than even cool running. Electronics in deep space, running in a hard vacuum and at temperatures wonderfully close to absolute zero, will most likely last for as long as they receive a working voltage.

The choices are many and various. Apple will not voluntarily accept anything that will cost them money on such a minority interest item as the TC. A redesign would not be worth the effort, as it is far cheaper to let an accepting public allow things to fail; even when they should not.

Apples main defence of their position with respect to longevity of TCs is... SILENCE.

According to Google Search Engines, dust makes the top ten list each time.

Here are the first three links doing a Google search:

http://www.computerdust.com/downloads/special_report_on_the_effect_of_dust_on_el ectronics.pdf

http://www.articlesbase.com/hardware-articles/10-most-common-reasons-for-compute r-failure-in-business-and-industry-450773.html

http://www.dieselserviceandsupply.com/causes_of_power_failures.aspx

But I do also understand what you are saying.

There is no dust causing failure of the TC.. the simple fact is without the fan turning on they are almost totally free of dust.. even the fan blades seldom have dust because it never turns on.. The issue as freddietheone has pointed out is overheat of the most sensitive components.. electrolytic capacitors.. to the point it is beyond the manufacturers recommended max operating temperature for the whole power supply.

If it was designed correctly for natural convection cooling the entire case should have been aluminium with nice finned top.. some other arrangement would have to be made for wireless to work.. a small plastic window as per imac design. But using thick abs plastic and rubber sheets.. the end result is too small to survive the temperature rise required to expend the heat.

Carlo,

I completely disagree with you assessment. There are a few reason why I buy Apple products.

1. I choose to pay more for Apple products because they work. I expect a higher performing product from Apple Than I do from other computer manufacturers.

2. The design of Apple products is superb in comparison to other manufacturers.

3. Apple products work seemlessly with other Apple products. The true meaning of plug and play.

4. Apple products are at the cutting edge of innovation, both from a design standpoint and a technological standpoint. Specifically as it relates to human interphase.

Carlo, I choose to pay a premium for Apple products because it has consistently delivered on all the above points. This is what branding is all about, creating a perception in the marketplace that sets an expectation for its consumers.

I will say that Apple has done a great job of managing their brand, however in this instance they have dropped the ball. I think it important for a consumer products company to understand when they have let their consumers down. To simply buy another without expressing your opinion violates the unwritten pact between consumer and vendor. We are providing a service to Apple by sharing our frustration. It is through this dialogue that companies are able to respond to the needs of their consumers.

I hope this provides insight into my thoughts on the topic, and my objectives in communicating through this forum.

simon132 wrote:

There is no need to be rude CARLO TD, the guys understanably upset that his Time Capsule is dead. If you want to resond to such a thread make it a worth while one, and more importantly helpfull. Any idiot knows that electronics have a limited life span, and its fairly evident that the time capsuls poor quaity components limit this! I think its important people communicate when such failures occure so those that want to repair and fix the problem can. If your solution to these kind of problems is to "get over it" and buy another one then be my guest. That kind of solution is not welcome here. I bet Apple love you, along with any orther retailer who can whip your pants down and make money out of you!

A more helpfull answer to the problem can be found here: https://sites.google.com/site/lapastenague/a-deconstruction-of-routers-and-modem s/apple-time-capsule-repair

I am not being rude... but you are. I am telling very good advice... and perhaps the most helpful. Please try to solicit your site or things that you are advertising in other forums. I am telling it as it is - we are not children, would you rather me treat the other person like a child and say oh... you have a boo boo... do you want me to kiss it and make it feel better?... Please...if that is the case, you need to go elsewhere. We are all adults in here (and if not, I still was not rude.)

Hello Carlo TD,

I simply could not let this go... which makes for good reading by the gathered masses, if nothing else.

The three points you have listed as coming from a Google search, relating to dust induced failure are worthy of digging a little deeper into each of them. The conclusions are worth it.

1. The first article is written by a company called 'Computer Dust Solutions', who quite naturally will advise keeping dust to a minimum and dust inside computers is a bad thing. It is a bad thing on the delicate electro-mechanical parts for obvious reasons, in that it clogs up the small moving parts, it gets in the way of light-paths (CD and DVD drives) and generally works about as well as a spoonful of talcum powder does inside a mechanical wristwatch mechanism.

It goes on to say, in less detail, that the dust blocks filters and impedes air-flow that is primarily there to COOL the electronics. Temperatures can rise as much as 30°F (16.5°C) and lead to complete and abrupt failure. It is the excessive temperature that causes electronic failure, not the dust itself. It is the mechanism whereby the cooling is stopped.

2. The second article is written by a man from a company called 'Industrial Computer Solutions' who quite naturally would suggest, as he does, the best way to protect your computer from the environment is to put it inside an industrial cabinet or enclosure. He lists a whole series of absolutely obvious reasons why computers fail, where the first is 'User Error' and then goes to list reasons why a piece of computer gear intended for a clean, dry office environment will fail when subjected to an environment it was never designed for. Item 9 is factually wrong. He qualifies his argument by altering the conditions to 'condensation' which can then freeze, and presumably expand and damage components that way.

About Dust/Dirt, he does say it can "block cooling vents causing a computer to overheat" and "it will only be a matter of time before it packs up for good."

3. This is an article about power systems and electricity supply, not electronics. Environmental hazards such as water and dust must be separated from high voltage circuits. In this respect you are absolutely correct but also this has little to do with contained electronics.

All three articles have one thing in common. The product in question MUST be designed for the environment in which it operates. Dust impedes air-flow and if the air-flow is the primary source of cooling, the item will overheat and fail. Not allowing for dust, which could affect the cooling, is bad design.

The design of the TC, is such that convection flow was expected to be through all the sides, low down and vent through the plastic gap slightly higher up. This is a bad design since there is no lamina flow of air as it is heated. A slightly better convection cooling can be created with the TC on its edge, with the power lead on the lower side, as well as the indicator LED showing on the front panel. This creates a natural chimney draw on the heated air as it rises through the PSU inside and will give a 1° to 2°C cooling effect.

Sadly it also will draw in 'dust' and that will impede the cooling flow... :-)

Regards,

Chris Fackrell (freddietheone) YORK, UK.

I had a 1st gen 1 TB TC. It died within a short amount of time. And I agree, there was a design flaw in the first gen. I also owned a cat, and kept the TC in a corner of my apartment. My unit was always getting warm, even to the point it was excessivly hot. Theire was at one time a recall from Apple that let a person replace it with a refurbished one. I off course missed that window, and had to exchange my unit for a refurbished unit (1TB was the only one that was offered as a refurbished unit.) (And they sold it at a discounted price.) I have been using the newer (refurbished unit) since then with no problems and the unit is not as hot as my oringal unit. So something was done yes inside the unit, at the same time (when my unit did go bad), I went thruough all same emoticions. But I also became wiser about having clutter arround the unit, airflow, and dust how these all play a part. Anything that produces heat is a magnet for dust. I was upset that I had to buy a refurbished unit (and money is tight for everyone), but in the end, I figured it is no different than anything else that could break, or needs repair. Eventually everything needs to be repaired or breaks. I took the advice of someone, that told me, go get another unit - I did, and I am happy I did, and if my unit broke again, I would buy another unit, even a brand new unit this time around. I feel the frustration, but life is short, and this is not something to get yourself sick over.

My 1 TB Time Capsule is approximately 17 months old. Out of warrenty. Won't power on. I thought it may have had something to do with it falling from the shelf to the carpet. Took it to the Apple store, they plugged it in and it worked. I was so excited and confused why it would work for them. They gave me their cord, when I got back home and plugged it in -- NOTHING. UGH. I agree 17 months is poor quailty for this high of a priced item. After reading all of the SAME complaints, I will buy the AppleCare extended warrenty with the next Time Capsule. Sad to think Apple makes a rip off product. IF it is only suppose to last 17 months it should be stated on the box.

I will buy the AppleCare extended warrenty with the next Time Capsule. Sad to think Apple makes a rip off product. IF it is only suppose to last 17 months it should be stated on the box.

Plug it into power without anything plugged into it.. just plugging in ethernet may be the problem. Gen 3 have some board issues..

Try a few outlets around the house.. just to be sure.

A repairer.. a real one not Apple might be able to fix it.

https://sites.google.com/site/lapastenague/a-deconstruction-of-routers-and-modem s/apple-time-capsule-repair/new-issue-with-a1355-gen-3-tc

I have fixed them. But not all, as they present with different problems.

BTW there is no extended warranty on the TC itself.. it is covered by applecare on your computer.. any computer you have that has applecare within 2 years of the TC purchase will cover the TC as well.

Any fix for this problem yet?

tomfromchicago wrote:

Any fix for this problem yet?

The fix.. for Gen 1 and Gen 2 is to replace the internal power supply.. either a converter or fully external power supply.. these are not readily available, so the method I use is 12v power supply and internal 12v to 5v converter..

Gen 3 and Gen 4 are too young mostly for the internal power supply to die.. yet!! So only the occasional blown supply.. so the ones that present are dead boards or dead hard drives.. those WD greens are not up to quality of the earlier disks Apple used. Many people will still have applecare covering their TC.. so that is the first port of call. Only if that is run out, then it is time to dig deeper.

Check my website for how to replace the supply.. and check the board.

Hello tomfromchicago,

Apple have made no substantial changes to the TC design. The PSU has been beefed up 'slightly', the internal fan (apparently) turns on now and is proportional to the internal heat (so I have been advised). The fan still points to the side, not the PSU. So air is merely stirred around inside the case. There is still no air inlet hole.

Another option is to repair the internal PSUs that have cooked themselves to death. A repaired unit may last almost as long as the original (that is: not very long at all) but will last substantially longer if the case is modified and the fan turned round. My own TCs have been running continuously for more than 2 years now and do not run hot, they have not failed and are reliably boring.

Ray's method of removing the PSU from the case, at a stroke, alters the TC to a cool design. I know it works well because that is what I did to start with! We should all be very thankful to Ray - for TC work, he is the pioneer.

I subsequently modified the case to allow air in and it ran as cool as a decent design would allow. Apple will never do this, I suspect. It is too much of a redesign. I have had no units fail with this modification, as a result of overheating. I have had some hard-drives die because they were rubbishy builds but that is another story... :-)

Regards,

Chris Fackrell, (freddietheone), YORK, UK.

Goodaye Chris.. nice to see you here again.. !!

We have diverged paths to repair but the fundamental issue is still the same.. although I must say that from Apple's point of view they fixed it.. the Gen 4 run substantially cooler.. through better power consumption patterns.. I have studied it a fair bit lately.. Although the later TC have higher wattage power supplies.. they actually draw less current. The standby power is around 12W and even full bore running seldom exceeds 18W.. peak demand is still high during disk spin up etc. But the aim is for the TC to last 3years.. (+2days) so it is out of applecare.. thus completing the mission parameters.. make it a consumable.. make it cheap.. sell it at a great profit margin.. ensure people have to buy a new one.

Our Wallace and Gromit Anti-Pesto solution.. to make it last.. breaks a fundamental design parameter Apple have built in.. obsolescence.

( Chris can be Wallace.. I'll be Gromit!!)