Garageband output volumes in relation to other sequencer output volumes....

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Level 1

8 points

Garageband output volumes in relation to other sequencer output volumes....

First, let me say that I am aware of that tab you can uncheck in garageband preferences that will allow your song to be output at/around its actual final mixed level, instead of having it output at a lower volume if this preference is checked. This is not the nature of my post.

What I am wondering is if other sequencers (Logic, Record, Pro Tools, etc) have higher output volumes than garageband. I for the life of me can't get my garageband outputs to the desired 'radio friendly' volumes that I hear in other music I listen to or purchase. When I push the output volumes to the desired level, it always comes out distorted when the final mix is sent to itunes. I do use an ART Tubepac preamp/compressor so I'm certain I am able to get the recording level I want when recording vocals, guitars, etc....but again, when it comes time to mix it all down, the highest volume I can output my recordings at without clipping/distorting when sent to itunes is just too low for what I need (writing some background music for television). When I compare it to everything else in my itunes (professional recordings), it comes out much quieter. Now I realize I'm not going to get the ultimate professional sound from the minimal gear that i use (ART Tubepac preamp/compressor, M-Audio interface, GrooveTubes condensor mic), but my outputs should be louder for sure.

Anyone else ever use another sequencer and found it allows for louder final outputs than garageband?

iMac, Mac OS X (10.5.6)

Posted on Dec 20, 2009 9:33 PM

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Answer 1

Dec 21, 2009 2:03 AM in response to guitymon

There's a difference between volume and perceived loudness. The keyword is mastering (you might do some googling to find some help about mastering techniques), it can boost the perceived loudness of your music considerably.

Since mastering is not an easy task to do (the people who do it for commercial music are highly paid specialists) it's hard to help you out in a forum post. But here's two things you can try out and that might kick you in the right direction:

• Try some of the Master Track presets that come with GB (go to the Master Track tab in the Info pane, they are in categories like Ambient, Classical, Dance …). Maybe there's something that fits your song.

• Or, even more simple: put a MultiBandCompressor into the free effects slot of the Master Track and play with its presets or, if you're bolder, with the parameter sliders.

You should notice a considerable "loudness" effect!

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Answer 2

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 9:27 AM in response to Christoph Drösser

I am definitely aware of the complex world of mastering and the entirely different entity it is than simply mixing tracks, but this isn't the issue. I already use the Master track presets....and while it does of course give me a better sounding master recording, it doesn't change the fact that my outputs are deemed too 'hot' when sent to itunes.

The bottom line is, to be a bit more clear.....I mix my tracks in garageband and raise the levels to a nice, loud volume comparable to industry standards. *In garageband, it sounds great: no cracking, no clipping, no distortion, etc*.... But when I send it over to itunes, it suddenly comes out all distorted and clipped...so I'm forced to go back into garageband, lower the overall output about 3 or 4 db, then resend it to itunes, at which point it now sounds clean (no clipping/distortion) but my overall level is much lower than industry standards.

I just can't get around this dilemma. I thought buying a new compressor and preamp would solve the problem but it hasn't. I feel it's just garageband's lack of quality that is causing this and I'm trying to find someone who perhaps has another sequencer they use that could tell me if this is simply a garageband shortcoming and not something I'm doing on my end. I mean, let's face it....garageband isn't the most sophisticated DAW and I do have a decent knowledge of recording which makes me feel this is a garageband issue. Answers?

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Answer 3

poflynn

Level 4

1,303 points

Dec 21, 2009 9:33 AM in response to guitymon

I don't understand. My exports sound exactly the same as they do in GB.

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Answer 4

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 9:40 AM in response to poflynn

Yeah, I don't get it either. It's weird because the little 'output' volume meter (bottom right of the project) will show it going into the red from time to time during the song, yet there's no clipping or distortion at all. BUT when I send it to itunes, suddenly the clipping and distortion shows up. And I know it's not coming from the initial recordings I'm doing. I show no indication of clipping via my interface, preamp or compressor...and the tracks themselves sound fine (no clipping/distortion)when I listen to them back before mixing. It's only when I raise the recorded tracks to the desired volume level I want (industry standard) then send it to itunes that it becomes all whacked out.

***?

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Answer 5

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 9:42 AM in response to guitymon

Basically, it is seemingly impossible for me raise the level of my tracks where I need them without the output meter running into the red, regardless of how well or clean my tracks are recorded.

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Answer 6

Dec 21, 2009 10:29 AM in response to guitymon

GB tends to be more tolerant towards clipping than the exported audio (maybe something to do with the higher internal resolution that it works with). But if your song never clips (which is different from going into the red - clipping is when the two little lights at the end of the meter light up), neither in the track meters nor in the overall meter, then the export shouldn't have distortions.

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Answer 7

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 10:40 AM in response to Christoph Drösser

Yes, I should have clarified that. Having my output meter run into the red does NOT result in clipping once output to itunes.....but if the two red lights appear during a playback in garageband, it DOES result in clipping once output to itunes, but NOT while it's in garageband. This just doesn't make sense to me.

This isn't the case for you?....or have you never pushed a song's volume enough to know?

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Answer 8

Dec 21, 2009 11:29 AM in response to guitymon

but if the two red lights appear during a playback in garageband, it DOES result in clipping once output to itunes, but NOT while it's in garageband.

This is exactly what clipping is, even you might not notice it in GB (as I said, GB is more "tolerant"). Avoid it under any circumstances, and the output should be fine.

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Answer 9

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 11:33 AM in response to Christoph Drösser

I do avoid it....but I have to lower my overall final output level or track levels to do so, making the final output in itunes significantly lower than other commercial music. This is the dilemma I'm having.

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Answer 10

HangTime

Level 9

53,853 points

Dec 21, 2009 11:35 AM in response to guitymon

This is the dilemma I'm having.

re-read Christoph's first reply to you

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Answer 11

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 1:15 PM in response to HangTime

I have tried everything Christoph suggested. Again, it's not a matter of mastering the track or compressing it. I do both already. It's a matter of the songs levels sounding fine in GB, but too hot once output.....thus forcing me to lower the track levels, giving me a less than ample output level.

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Answer 12

HangTime

Level 9

53,853 points

Dec 21, 2009 1:40 PM in response to guitymon

it's not a matter of mastering the track or compressing it.

i'm afraid it is.

doing it, and doing it as well as a professional Mastering Engineer are two very different things. you don't flip a switch (or pick a random preset), and magically get a mastered recording.

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Answer 13

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 1:45 PM in response to HangTime

Very true.....but how many people who use garageband are mastering specialists?

Here's a simple way to answer my question. Go listen to something you recorded on GB and compare it with something professional that you've purchased recently. How do the volume comparisons stack up? I'm basically trying to figure out if other people's GB outputs are lower than standard....which I definitely the case with mine.

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Answer 14

HangTime

Level 9

53,853 points

Dec 21, 2009 1:48 PM in response to guitymon

Go listen to something you recorded on GB and compare it with something professional that you've purchased recently. How do the volume comparisons stack up?

before i spent many hours tweaking the Mastering? much lower.

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Answer 15

guitymon Author

Level 1

8 points

Dec 21, 2009 1:54 PM in response to HangTime

How is the comparison after you've mastered it and sent it to itunes? Is it still lower than other professional recordings?

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