Flash player

Apple rewrote key components of OSX to make the iPhone OS with a native,built from the ground up, touch interface. this means that applications that worked on the desktop OS should work on the iphone? Unless the apps are completely reworked to accomodate a touch interface, which some game developers did, maybe not perfectly, but workable, you can't run them on the mobile devices based on the same operating system.

In reality its the same thing with Flash. Even if they rewrite the Flash base code for mobile devices to work well on thos mobile devices, you wold still be required to rewrite the already exisiting apps to account for the touch interface.

Case in point is the common "hover" of a mouse over a video player to get the controls to appear. How would you hover on the touch interface?

My wife was using the main computer to view her documentaries and stuff for about a week after we had the wifi iPad. now two months later, and she hasn't touched the main computer in weeks. Found other sites that offered her video that worked on the iPad. Wether in apps or HTML5, she doens't know what it is or cares. Her videos play there so she goes there. And those advertisers get seen.

just my 2 cents
Jason

I don't think Apple view iPad users as babies. More like cash cows. Flash would allow content and apps to bypass the iTunes Store and the App Store. Flash on the iPad would impact Apple's revenue stream. No need to look any further. There's no "moral" or "technical" decision. It's business.

Yawn. We're all sheep, and we just follow Steve Jobs wherever he goes. We say we're making rational decisions when we by Apple products, but actually we're all, millions of us, just part of Steve's reality distortion field.

I think Flash *****. I'm glad I don't have it on the iPad. I have a Safari plug-in on my Macs explicitly to block it from websites and, guess what, since I installed it, fewer issues.

Of course, I just made all that up so I don't feel like an idiot for following Steve. Really, I know Flash is great, but I just can't resist his power.

Of course it's a commercial decisions - Apple's in business to make money (shock!! Who knew!!). And it's a technical business, which is why I said in my earlier post it was a commercial and technical decision. If I get what I want and Apple gets more money, that's win-win.

And, BTW, there is the minor point that no-one apart from Adobe claims that Flash works well on mobile devices.

Note, for those that need, to, the operative word is "well"

Flash is becoming less of an issue with the rise of HTML5, specifically the Video and Audio components, and, to a lesser degree, WebGL and WebSockets. There are many great resources for finding out what's going on in the HTML5 community, and some really promising projects that I follow:

http://smokescreen.us/ -- Convert SWF files to HTML5 in-browser using JavaScript, with support for vector graphics, animation, and sound. Some of the examples are mind-blowing.

http://code.google.com/p/quake2-gwt-port/ -- a stunning example of what can be done with modern web technologies, all without Flash.

http://html5watch.tumblr.com/ -- A good listing of HTML5 projects from various people.

http://html5zombo.com/ -- A silly example, but functional, of extracting resources from a SWF to make an HTML5 version. (Possibly used/the basis of smokescreen?)

http://apirocks.com/html5/html5.html -- A nifty HTML5 slideshow example, which I just found. I wrote something similar to replace a PDF picturebook with an interactive web page: http://s3.infilm.ca/2009.html

I agree with Jobs's explanation: Flash *****. Security issues, error messages, resource hog, etc.(although he's also obviously feared of Flash's capabilites that would make tons of commercial apps, especially most 2d games, a waste of money.)

But he needs to realize that there are many many people who want Flash on Apple mobile devices regardless of its drawbacks. What I think the best solution would be is adding, along with Flash, an option to enable/disable Flash contents on the web. If it's not technically impossible, it would be win-win for everyone.

I think he realizes it. But I think you overestimate those that care. If that many really did feel that flash was a killer app, they would not have sold over 2 million in 2 months.

Jason

I don't think anyone here is saying it's a 'killer app'. It is however, extremely inconvenient not having the option as many news services, education sites, sports results, BBC, etc. use Flash and not being able to view them is a real pain.
The transitional period from Flash to HTML5 is going to be pretty tedious for some people.
At the end of the proverbial day, however, this is a pointless discussion. It's not as if Mr Jobs is going to change his mind!

Considering the iPhone and the Touch have been out for 3 years and have sold 85 million units, if Flash were a big issue, it most likely would have been implemented.

Sure, it's an inconvenience for those who like Hulu or Farmville but users should put pressure on those sites to become mobile device compatible.

Sorry Tamara, but i disagree. The iPad is a very different device to the iPhone and Touch. I have never missed Flash at all on my iPhone, and have never heard my wife or sons complaining about it on their iPhones/Touches. They have been complaining since using my iPad.
The iPad is a totally different web browsing experience to those devices.
Again, like many of your other posts, you seem to think that the world should change to fit Apple's philosophy, rather than 1 device fitting in with the rest of the world.
As I said before, sure, let's all move to HTML5, but in the interim, why not allow users to access some of their favourite sites?
There are so many sites that just can't be used on the iPad that I didn't think even used Flash. Examples are all BBC sites (major), ITV UK Player, Grand Slam Tennis tourneys, major newspapers in the UK, etc. etc. There many more examples of important sites that are now inaccessible on the iPad.
Those who say things like oh well, it's only irritating adverts, adult sites, and stupid 2D games that use Flash are really talking nonsense.

why not allow users to access some of their favourite sites?

Don't you get it!? Flash, FLASH doesn't work on mobile devices! Its not like Apple is going to write it for them! They have had 3 years to get one ⚠ version written that could run on iphone. The mobile version that made for the google phones and exhibited in the past week or two CRASHED the browser! And when it wasn't crashed it was brought to a crawl!

This isn't a "why doesnt apple support it" question but why hasnt ADOBE done their job?

Just my thoughts 🙂
Jason

Sorry Jason, but I certainly do 'get it'. If you believe it has anything to do with there not being a mobile version of Flash, then I think it's you that's not 'getting it'.
Mr Jobs has made a policy statement that Apple mobile devices will not use Flash (for perfectly sensible reasons). Simple as that.
Don't you think that if the Apple mobile device market was opened up, then - as if by magic - Adobe would pull the finger out and produce a mobile version that works?

Flash does not run well on mobile devices. Heck, it crashed twice on the Android demo a few weeks ago. Somehow, I don't think Apple is interested in something that unstable.

It seems that in your opinion, the web should stay stuck in 2000 rather than move forward with no technologies and new ways of doing things.

As far as the BBC, I was reading an article a few days ago that they are in the process of implementing non-Flash versions of their video content. Considering the way the iPad is selling, I'm betting in the next six months, there are going to be a LOT of sites that will have adapted their content.

Adobe can't even make a decent version of flash for the Mac and they've had over 10 years to do so.

Mr Jobs has made a policy statement that Apple mobile devices will not use Flash (for perfectly sensible reasons). Simple as that.

Read Mr. Jobs open letter concerning flash and you will see that the arguments we are making are the same he used to make his policy, Adobe can't make a flash version that works well on mobile (that includes battery performance, speed, memory management etc...), so its not supported on Apple mobile devices. period. He has said show him a version that works WELL on mobile first.

In 3 years Adobe hasn't been able to produce a decent mobile version. PERIOD.

Apple doesn't make flash, tell adobe to prove to apple that they have a version that runs well on the iphone/iPad. They have the developers license with apple already and could produce it and demonstrate to apple that it works well. the only demo they have on mobile (and were very excited to show off), crashed! Twice! I don't think thats "working well" yet.

Tamara wrote:
Adobe can't even make a decent version of flash for the Mac and they've had over 10 years to do so.

In the last 10 years Apple went from os 9 to os X (versions zero through six). PPC to Intel. Carbon to Cocoa. Not to mention that 10.6 was a complete overall of the core OS. ****, with all that iTunes is still Carbon. So what 10 years? In software 10 years is a quite a few lifetimes.

In 10.6.3 Apple finally opened some hardware acceleration APIs to developers. A beta of Flash Player 10.1, called Gala, is already released for testing. No matter how hard Adobe works on Flash it will not be allowed to run on iPad. So it's easy to say Adobe needs to prove it can work well. What's the point? Apple won't allow it. It's their platform, their rule.

I don't have a problem with not allowing flash on iPad. But you don't need to attack Flash to justify it. Judging by the number of Apple software updates I get that mention "bug fixes", it's a fact of life: Software is buggy because it's made by humans.