Iphone 11 Pro Extreme lens flare

Hi Monsterior,

Thanks for adding your comments. I have to both agree and disagree with you. I agree that those users who have had their camera component changed out or received replacement phones (3 in my case) that they likely still have the same issues with lens flare + floating artifacts. I disagree (from my personal experience) that all previous iPhones dating back to the 5S produced the same results as the 11Pro (the phone I and many others have issues with).

I agree that many of us who purchased the 11Pro expecting improved, leading-edge imaging capabilities did expect well, improvements. But I can tell you I did not have the lens flare + floating artifacts issues with my trusty, 'wish I had it back' 6S.

Yes, all cameras will produce lens flare under certain types of lighting conditions – most notably shooting towards the sun or high-power light sources. It's the addition of the floating artifacts that's at issue (for me) with the 11 Pro.

Apple most certaily knows there's a problem and have chosen to sweep it under the rug. Worse yet, they continue to deny that the problem exists.

Thanks again for taking the time to let us know your experiences.

I saw the same on my newly purchased Iphone SE 2020 today. I could see it in my indoor shot of my apartment window with light coming in. Never seen anything like this in any of my android phones before. I tried it on my 4 years old Oneplus 3. I did not find any reflection issue there(I tried auto mode). I did research for couple of hours on various forums, apple support, youtube etc. It's been argued to be lens flare by most of the pros which I don't think it is due to the way the reflection moves. Flares are normal btw. Finally I tried it again on my Oneplus 3 again but this time in pro mode(I tried this feature for the first time since I am not a pro). I tried changing all the options to min and max one by one. I see when I crank up the white balance to max, the reflection appears there as well on the viewfinder. I think probably this is how smartphone cameras are designed. It should be same with any smartphone camera (less or more based on settings and other camera stats)

(See the reflection of window on the left of AC in the pic below)

Hi JP,

My take is that these iPhones were not fully completed _ hardware & software _ but the decision to launch, almost certainly because of marketing pressure, was taken anyway. One of the tale tell is the incomplete reverse induction charging...

With regards to the camera, I believe that some optics fine tuning or re-design should significantly improve the situation with the most appropriate combination of:

1) Optical formulae.

2) Sensor anti-reflective coatings.

3) Lenses & lenses covers materials & refractive index.

4) Lenses & lenses covers anti-reflective coatings.

5) Lenses covers exact sizing. Surround area from matt black material in & out.

6) Matt black external surface for the camera and lens covers surrounding rings (at this time mirror like)

The above may not be feasible by buying existing cameras modules and fitting the bits together which is cheaper but has compromised results...

I am afraid that what we see will remain a limitation for this generation of iPhones. People could experiment and specify their own lens covers & surrounding support rings custom made and see the resulting effects... But is this realistic ?

Apple is not really a specialised optics company like Leica, Zeiss, Olympus Zuiko, etc... Should they wish to improve the cameras and reduce these internal reflections to the minimum then they should perhaps outsource the complete cameras module design to these people...

Detailing facts as given by people in the industry as well as many photography reviewers is not being a “fan boy.”

If you believe this issue is so easily solved, find a high end phone camera that does not suffer from them.

An Internet search will quickly tell you that not only has this issue been around since at least the iPhone 8, it also occurs on premium smartphones from Google and Samsung as well.

Yes JimP, I had an iPhone 7 till last year and I actually much prefer the camera on that, it had zero lens flare. It’s these new cameras that have it, they try so hard to upgrade it that they ignore all the faults it comes with.

Here is another example of the lens flare, this video is from the previous iPhone 11 I had, which I replaced today with no improvement.

Nope, this is not normal, it’s highly prone to flaring. If the is a light source or sun in the vicinity, you will see rainbows in the photo. Looks like it’s missing some coatings on the lens.

I have an iPhone XS, took a picture at the exact same spot, no flares.

Not surprising; you can't just design new optics that defy the laws of physics.

As has been stated before, all smartphone cameras suffer from this, as do multi-thousand dollar lenses for DSLRs and mirrorless cameras.

Hi vv303,

I received my 12 Pro Max and can confirm that it is still present.

I am also facing another camera issues with my new 12 Pro Max and just posted it on the forum. See below details. Sharing as this is happening also on 12 Pro lineup, confirmed with with brother in law who works in apple store.

1) when making video on main 1x sensor and only at 4k 60fps, the screen is suffering from significant flickering. This is not happening on any other resolutions and frame rates. I have compared to my old Xs and Xr with same settings, same scenarios and this issue is not present at all. I have also tried changing shutter speed manually to 1/120 on Filmic Pro, as normally this would resolve the issue, however no matter how I set settings manually flickering is present at all settings, when recording 4k 60fps. I have tried resetting the phone, force restarting, with no luck. I am on 14.2. I even tried using every possible settings scenario on both display and camera settings and still not possible to eliminate the issue :(

2) Ultra wide lens 0.5x is suffering from lags, stuttering when on 4k 60fps. When you touch screen to get auto exposure square and focus point, lag and stuttering is heavily present. The moment exposure and focus point disappears all is back to normal. Again this is only happening when on 4k 60fps and in all lightning conditions. I have tried all above and absolutely all settings but no luck with getting this resolved.

it would be good to see if anyone has come across these issues and managed to fix anyhow. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Happy to share my OneDrive link, so you can see the videos with these issues.

Thanks guys.

Kris

bobneedham wrote:

Apple is obviously not a camera company

Camera companies can't solve this, either.

Huaiwei has been working with Leica, who has been making lenses for 106 years, and has not yet been able to solve this issue.

Likewise, here's a still from a video; the iPhone 12 video is on top, the bottom image was taken with a $5000 Canon DSLR equipped with a Tokina lens:

First: lens flare or not? It’s my understanding that ghosting is a type of lens flare. Referring to as ghosting is a more accurate description. It makes it clear what you are talking about. Sure an orange is a citrus fruit, but calling it an orange instead of a citrus fruit distinguishes it from other citrus fruits.

Second, my 6+ did not display ghosting, although it was susceptible to the generic lens flare. I could control it by shading the lens element. And no, my 6+ was not magical. The ghosting problem with the 12 pro max was very obvious when I traded in my 6+ for my 12, even when shooting at the same location with the same lighting (sunsets). With regards to discussion threads about flaring on the 6+, did they specify which type of flaring they were discussing, or were they just describing citrus fruits? :)

“You can consider it whatever you like; it is not a defect.”

A design that generates something which adversely affects the purpose of the design it is a design defect. If in executing the design the product is not produced as designed then that is a manufacturing defect.

I think Apple made some decisions in the design acknowledging there were limitations to what they could do with a camera in a phone, and being mindful that other measures may have added additional expenses they did not want to build into the price. Just a business decision.

It’s a phone not a camera dedicated to one purpose. Maybe some of us need to expect less from a phone camera. I know I was hoping that this was going to be a camera that could stand in for my Olympus when I didn’t have it. I think most purchasers could care less. Does it take pictures of food and selfies of me with my friends? Does it take photos of places I go? Can I post them instantly on social media? Then it’s all good. Quality is further down the list. ;-)

Because people disparage the camera as defective or horrible when it’s all a matter of technique and working with the limitations of the tools at hand.

It’s easy to take photos with flare using $10,000 of DSLR equipment too, it doesn’t mean the camera and lens are of poor quality.

As an example, this is a still from a 2020 Hallmark Channel movie shot with a $30,000 cinema digital camera with a $8000 lens:

This photo depicts the sun through hazy clouds with the sailing ship. No subtle change of the composition. The problem occurs with strong light sources. If the sky was clear the green dot would be easily seen.

That's complete nonsense, as if some light clouds would be enough to eliminate the issue from a shot of the sun.

As the photographer, I can say it was easy to see the green dots from flare and adjust my composition accordingly when taking the shot, the same as anyone would need to do using any camera.

And what are these magical compositional techniques that you used in the shot to eliminate the green spot? Can you share a photo you shot with the green spot before you changed the composition of the shot?

Short of shooting with a wider lens and then cropping out the green spot, magically removing green spots and ghosting when there is a discreet bright light source is not feasible.