Mail - Classic view in Catalina

I agree this is a huge step backwards! The info I want to view and sort on isn't present in the main screen. I can't rearrange columns I want to see let alone rearrange them in the order I'd like to see (or not see) them.

This may drive me to a third party mail application :( Please bring htis level of flexibility back!

Despite what some on here are saying, you CANNOT get classic view. You can get something similar-looking but less functional. Less functional because (i) you cannot sort by column headers and (ii) emails now take more than a single line in the inbox, even without message preview -- one line is for who the email is from, the other is the subject line, whereas in classic view you could have who it was from on the left and the subject line on the right.

Apple is missing a very important trick. We like choice. Not too much, but some. And we don't like losing choices we had.

They will view any complaints as merely a case of customers needing time to get used to something new. So they'll ignore the complaints. Some complaints are indeed just that, but not all, and if you ignore ALL your customers complaints, their resentment will grow and grow.

In short, irritating. Very irritating.

D

"(ii) emails now take more than a single line in the inbox, even without message preview -- one line is for who the email is from, the other is the subject line, whereas in classic view you could have who it was from on the left and the subject line on the right."

This is still possible. Its not classic view and I hate the changes, but you can get them both on the same line. Click "use column layout" under the view header on the menu.

Fact is, the "Classic View" is dead.

Apple, in it's infinite wisdom, failed to understand how users use and benefit from the Classic View.

The ability to show, reorganize and sort columns on the fly is incredibly useful .... Especially for those of us who must management lot's of email.

Like much of what Apple seems to do these days with its software, there was probably not too much thought about the change. Too often changes are made to the interface and functions for changes sake to convey the appearance of progress.

The challenge for me is now to find an Apple Mail replacement that plays well with the likes of SpamSieve, ProtonMail, Daylite and the other plugins I currently use. That won't be easy.

But rest assured, the Mail "Classic View" is dead, at least for now.

Indeed, what I would like -- but doesn't seem to exist -- is something that allows me to interact with my work emails in Exchange using an interface as much as gmail as possible.

In terms of stringing together conversation threads in the most useful way, stability, search, snoozing, autocompletion when organising emails, and -- relatedly -- LABELS, which I LOVE, gmail seems unsurpassed. I'd use it for everything but my work no longer lets me.

I can get snooze and autocompletion using plug ins, but I have to pay for these.

When I moved from Windows to Mac it was for a better screen, better software, and things that just work rather than breakdown. My first screen lost its antiglare coating within a year (though admittedly Apple has now replaced it); the software has serious limitations (Finder too); and I experience crashes on the Mac too, in fact more often in Mail than any other app. Anyway, sorry, just letting off steam!

d

Thanks! Stupid me for not having noticed that. Actually, I've decided I quite like the "to", since it allows me to distinguish emails addressed to my address and emails I am receiving for other reasons.

But I still prefer gmail (see below) by a very wide margin.

Thanks again

d

The fact is, Apple did remove the "classic" features from Mail for Catalina.

The removal effectively downgrades Mail significantly for many users, such as myself.

Mail no longer allows users to organize and order columns, and sort, in the manner users choose.

Yes, one can look at messages in columnar format ... but only in the manner that Apple has now chosen.

It seems Apple is getting out of the email client business. Why else dumb down an essential feature for many users?

Or, too many key software design decisions are increasingly being made by inexperienced theoreticians at Apple.

For heavy duty email users such as myself - a professional Mac user since 1985 - the change is a deal breaker.

I am now looking for a different email program. Presently I have >100,000 messages in Apple Mail.

I have to wonder if Apple's next step will be to also remove this functionality from Finder.

Since they clearly seem to know what's best for us, why should we be able to control which columns about a file are shown; how wide they are or what order they are in.

They would have exactly the same justification for doing this in Finder as they have in Mail.

I what the Mail - Classic view in Catalina , and you are you're full of **** , you must not change it , you bring it back I want to have ,the ability to change it myself you take that away then I disagree and I am very , w very , ANGRY, ANGRY, its totally BULSHIT . BRING IT BACK, AND AFTER Steve Jobs , YOU FUCK THINGS OP, PEOPLE , CHOICES. WHAT WHAT THE LIKE . please bring it back , I cat not read my mail proper.

Jeffrey Gorman wrote:

The only thing actually missing is the column headers themselves.

No, that's not the only thing that's missing. There is no 'To' column anymore. I always use to Cc: myself so my emails arrive in my Inbox, but there I can only see that I (!) sent them, but no longer to whom!

Actually that is available: on the Menu bar under View are some Show/Hide choices.

The core problem is that of those choices "Use Column Layout" is actually not a column layout; it is a line-by-line (list) layout with each line arranged as the folks at Apple want them, not as we users prefer them. They give us the 4 choices you see there and seem to believe this will suit everyone. They took away our control over what of each message to view in the this view.

A "column layout" is only such if there are headers. The functionality to click on headers to sort, and drag to suit the user's needs, is almost universally part of that. Here that feature has been removed.

None of that works!! Preview pane is just not there - a change which impedes and interferes with the smooth progress in Mail. It has added another step to the process and lends nothing to our ability to expeditiously deal with volumes of emails. Simply see no point to this change ... actually it is quite useless. If there is a redeeming feature I would certainly appreciate being enlightened.

Yeah preview pane still exists.

Under the 'view' header, uncheck "Show side preview" and make sure you have "Use column layout" checked and you get the old classic view of having the preview pane under your messages.

Still a pile of manure regards the other changes though.

Repeating the same phrase doesn't offer a fix that has nothing to do with the problem of not being able to set up the classic view.

I want everything others want plus I want my preview to appear below the emails not on the side. Moving columns doesn't fix a bad redesign.

Are Apple programers paid by the keystroke so bad redesigns earn them more?

Further to my prior post.

When you download Catalina Mail messages to the Mac, one cannot view Sent messages properly in the List View.

That view shows only the FROM column but not the corresponding TO column.

All sent messages are of course FROM me, so that's a useless column when viewing sent messages..

Yet, in the view, one cannot see to whom the messages were SENT. That too is wholly useless. Unfathomable.

Call me old fashioned, but all >120,000 of my emails are archived locally, not on the IMAP server.

The changes to Catalina underline Mail as a useful email client.