MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise

I think I may have found the issue.

I went back to my 2017 MacBook Pro 15" from the 2019 MacBook Pro 16" through a time machine restoration. Then the 2017 MacBook Pro started to do the same thing. That became very confusing as the 2017 MacBook Pro did not do this before I upgraded.

I worked out that my 2017 MacBook Pro did not use the dynamic wallpapers, but the 2019 did (as I left everything on default during the upgrade). But when I went back to the 2017 unit from the 2019 unit, the dynamic wallpaper came across via the time machine restoration.

So I went back to the 2019 unit, turned off the dynamic wallpaper, changed it to something static and the fan speed dropped. Restart the system as well. If you don't restart it can take a while for the fan to drop, i'm thinking there is some sort of memory leaking here which the restart flushes out.

I'm thinking that the dynamic wallpaper + external monitor has some sort of software bug. Note that i'm using a Dell monitor via USB-C to DisplayPort, maybe the Apple monitors don't have the same issue.

It would also explain another weird issue, when connected to an external monitor and in sleep mode, the 2019 unit kept running hot with high fan noise. I resolved it by disabling power nap in the power settings.

What i'm guessing is that when connected to an external monitor, the computer keeps using power nap to update the dynamic wallpaper in sleep mode. So dynamic wallpapers seems to cause fan noise when awake connected to an external monitor as well as in sleep mode.

The behaviour seems to happen to the 2017 unit as well when I switched to a dynamic wallpaper.

Can the people who are having this issue give this a try and see what you get? Also, maybe what screens and connectors people are using?

Dear All and Apple Support, it does seems like this new thermal design is a failure. I have I9, 2,3, 32Ram, 2TB. I have the exact same issue with incredible fan noise in idle mode when connected to Apple Thunderbolt 27 (non 4K) monitor via Apple dedicated Thinderbolt2 - Usb3 adapter. (buy the way, this adapter does not charge the laptop, which is also a drawback). Alongside - I work constantly with Logic and Photoshop/Illustrator (for which this computer is specifically designed) and the fan noise is crazy all the time, even without external monitor. It is so loud, that I can actually hear it sitting in studio monitor headphones, and even in the neighbouring room with a door closed. My old MBP 2012 is much more silent. I have waited for this "MacBook that is great again' for last 5 years and for 3600 usd - it is a complete failure in my opinion. Not to mention the impossibility to roll back to Majave (Catalina is a bug nightmare, especially in terms of music production apps). And I am pretty sure that there is nothing that can be made to deal with this noise - it is just designed so it is super loud, my old MBP even on top fan speeds is much less noise. I have the feeling that apple's era comes to end somewhere soon. If not OS X, I would not event be considering this machine!!!!!!!!

What screen are you using? Brand and model?

I'm having the same issue and I'm just wondering if it's specific to my screen. If it's happening with an 'Apple approved' screen, then this is definitely an issue. I'm using a Dell, but it sounds like you are using a proper Apple supported screen.

About to return mine for a refund and go back to my 2017 MacBook. Just want to rule out screen issues. Btw, did this not happen with my 2017 unit with the same screen.

I am using Apple Thunderbolt 27 display 2011, which is even more frustrating - IT IS A DEDICATED APPLE SCREEN:))))). Unfortunately I do not have the opportunity to return my laptop for a refund right now - but I if nothig changes (of which I am pretty sure), I will try to return it.

cappuccinodrinker wrote:

If it's happening with an 'Apple approved' screen, then this is definitely an issue. I'm using a Dell, but it sounds like you are using a proper Apple supported screen.

This can't be relevant. USB-C, Thunderbold and all other possibilities to conntect displays are standards and Apple never said it is nessesary to get a supported screen. Plus in my opinion if they would they'd get a lot of bad press and who would buy a notebook you can only connect to approved screens?

I am using LG 4K USB-C monitor bought from Apple Store.

My machine has been silent since a week when starting to use it with lid closed. The fans spins up during compile (as expected) but returns to normal after a minute.

The moment I run the laptop with the lid open - heat increases and fans starts spinning. Absolutely crazy.

kurtzenter wrote:

cappuccinodrinker wrote:

If it's happening with an 'Apple approved' screen, then this is definitely an issue. I'm using a Dell, but it sounds like you are using a proper Apple supported screen.

This can't be relevant. USB-C, Thunderbold and all other possibilities to conntect displays are standards and Apple never said it is nessesary to get a supported screen. Plus in my opinion if they would they'd get a lot of bad press and who would buy a notebook you can only connect to approved screens?

I agree, unfortunately that's the line Apple support tried to pull... the typical blame the other guy response.

I managed to test on a Samsung 32" 4K UHD Monitor (UH850): https://www.samsung.com/au/monitors/u32h85/

No issues.

So it appears to only happen on my Dell UltraSharp 27 U2715H: https://www.dell.com/lv/business/p/dell-u2715h/pd

But as you rightful said, this can't be relevant and it should work regardless!

What's insane is that the Samsung screen is higher resolution than the Dell but doesn't cause the issue.

Really confused now... Also, both connected via the same USB-C to DisplayPort cable.

What's going on here? What are people support to do? Run around trying monitors to see which causes the issue or not?

cappuccinodrinker wrote:

What are people support to do? Run around trying monitors to see which causes the issue or not?

Sadly that's the drawback of the Apple Walled Garden, sketchy third party driver support.

Another example is how Catalina broke third party USB-drivers. I had to use my old laptop for hardware development because of drivers and IDEs stopped worked. Almost fixed in 10.15.2, but still some issues with some tools.

That’s a great summary. I’d also like to point out that my observations with high temperatures are relevant even without an external monitor plugged in. Compared to previous models, having the “high performance” GPU card active (even if it is doing nothing) causes vastly higher temperatures for a given CPU workload. Temperatures are much more as I would expect them to be if running off the integrated GPU.

TimUzzanti wrote:

All,

We are kind of wrapping up all our testing and working with the Apple Business Team to figure out how we move forward.

This thread is getting a little side tracked with monitors and so I wanted to point out that these issues discussed are completely unrelated to brand/model of monitors being used. That said, it IS related to having monitors connected and the internal GPU within the MacBook, along with the CPU and the overall heat that both generate.

In our final testings, we did clean installs with 10.15.2 and primarily tested an eGPU using a Razor Core and a Radeon RX Vega 64 so we could eliminate the internal GPU in the MBP.

It became really clear the combined heat from the internal Radeon Pro 5500m GPU and the i9-9880G CPU is too much for the current thermal management system, especially when using all USB-C ports. (I.e., for power, USB-C hub, USB-C to Display Port video cables).  From all the testing and heat generated by the unit, it looks like our Radeon Pro 5500m GPU is fried because we are seeing artifacts on text (laptop display and external monitors) but not when we use the eGPU.

Just so you understand our configuration with the eGPU:  We have one USB-C Hub connected to the MBP and one USB-C cable connected to the eGPU.  The one USB-C cable to the eGPU is powering the MBP but also the eGPU has the two Display Port cable to the monitors.  Now the MBP has two free USB-C ports.  This was producing about 38 degrees less heat in Airflow on the MBP.

When the eGPU is connected, we can push the MBP to about 60% CPU for sustained periods before hearing the fans at about 4500 RPM. But as many of us have noticed, when we don’t have an eGPU, we’re seeing this at 5% to 10% CPU.

We have installed Parallels and ran Windows 10 on three monitors on separate space and have done Geekbench tests and a variety of stress tests with the eGPU and its operating normally.  

Bottom line, the combination of using the GPU and CPU is pushing the MBP into heat conditions causing the FAN issues and in our case, possibly damage to the GPU.  

Apple had a similar issue with the 2018 MacBook Pro and people were starting to stick their machines inside a Freezer to see if they could avoid the CPU’s from stepping down prematurely.

Hopefully Apple can find a solution because these new 16 inch MBP could be incredible.

Please start a support case with Apple so we can get this resolved sooner than later and it will also protect you a bit more if you need to return your units beyond the return policy. Moving forward, its all on Apple!

Tim

Thanks Tim!

My troubleshooting yielded similar results, but I got some inconsistent results, so I was not sure if I was correct that this is not a monitor issue.

I'm going to return for refund for the time being until the issue is worked out. An external eGPU is hardly a solution. Extra cost and it's silly for idle to cause this issue.

Can you keep us updated with what happens with the Apple Business Team?

I hope they resolve it, the laptop is otherwise perfect.

Same issue here with 2,4/5500. Fans are running at 3.500..4000 with noticeable noise with minimal CPU load - when used with external monitor (LG 5k). Unfortunately I will have to return the laptop, even if I’m otherwise very happy with the machine.

Thank you Ahmed for the links

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-computers/1287355-boom-new-16-macbook-pro-8tb-ssd-13.html?posted=1#post14406931

check this link please. TMM has the same Mac and no Heat issues. I go tomorrow to my Mac store and wanna have a new Machine

I really wish there is a hope to get the power of this machine without the noise :)

While I don't think disabling the Turbo Boost will be a problem, I don't think it should considered as ultimate solution easier. It might be okey for some of us to disable it, but for others, they might have actually bought the device for that turbo boost!

First, I have to chuckle at some of the Apple apologists in here blindly defending this new 16" thermal design. As if all these complaints are somehow from delusional users. lol. C'mon now people. I absolutely love my Apple products too, but I'm also going to call a spade a spade.

I'm a professional user. I use my MacBook daily as part of my duties as an Email/IM engineer, often under heavy usage while running virtual machines, etc. I've been using MBPs for years now and I have to say that this new 16" that I recently purchased is the first MacBook I've ever owned that has annoyingly audible fan noise while driving an external monitor. And I'm talking doing little things like having a single Safari tab open in YouTube. Is it an awful amount of fan noise? I'd say no to that, but I expect a 4k laptop to perform BETTER than the one I purchased two years ago. Not worse. That's the issue. These fans are running around 3k without doing much at all while the 2017 fans run around the expected 1800. It's a downgrade in the experience, no two ways about it.

For reference, I replaced a 2017 15.4 MBP (maxed at the time) with this new 16". That 2017 MBP could easily drive my two 32" 4k monitors daisy-chained via a single Thunderbolt cable with inaudible fan noise 95% of the time. The only time the fans cranked up was when I taxed the machine running multiple VMs, handbrake, etc. That was understandable, of course. This new design is simply a far worse experience when it comes to fan noise. Totally unacceptable.

I do like the 16" design in some ways. The speakers are sublime. But overall I just can't see this new design as anything but a downgrade overall. I would just go back to my 2017 but I gave it to my parents on Christmas to replace their 2009 MBP. lol Not to worry, I just set up a return with Apple for the MBP 16 and I've ordered a new MBP 15.4 for $1k off (thank god they are clearing these out right now. Fortunate timing!). Frankly, I'm one that preferred the butterfly keyboard anyway so I don't mind at all. And 6-core with a Vega20 will do just fine....and will have the same thermal profile as my 2017! Actually even quieter from the reviews I've come across.

Anyway, I remain a happy Apple customer overall, but this is a quite a misstep for such a big re-design Apple. I expect better!